[amuzement]

Sorry if this is a repost, but this is absolutely ridiculous..

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...50_comparison/

I don't want to ruin the results for you guys, but you're not going to be happy with them

[Karbon]

Not to burst anyone's bubble about the new F30 but honestly I haven't heard anything good about it from anyone. I like BMW and I wanted to like the F30 but...

A couple of friends who have been working at BMW for a long time said and I quote:
"I honestly can't recommend any of the current model 3 series. They're cheaply made and it shows. It's all about the bottom line now. It's not even a drivers car anymore."

Go take a really good look at one on the lot, I mean a good look. I was floored by how cheap it looked.

By comparison, the F30 is massive compared to the e90. It's a completely different car. The F30 is basically the size of my e39 5 series. Check the dimensions.

[SWFan]

Well, the key is Cadillac used BMW's E46 3-series as the template for the ATS. In my opinion the E46 is the best version of the 3-series. That is probably why the ATS feels better than the F30 series, simply because BMW has inched further and further away from being a driver's car since the E46.

I don't find this Motortrend review ridiculous at all. Cadillac has itself a very nice car in the ATS. Most reviews I've seen since the ATS release have it being about equal to the BMW 3-series, if not outright better.

Does it mean we should all turn in our BMW keys and get ATS's. No. But if you're in the market for a small luxury sport car the ATS isn't far off the mark making it a worthwhile car to go test drive in my opinion.

[Bingobimmer]

Saw this about a week ago and it seems like bmw really went away from enthusiast with the new 3. I really do believe the e9x m3 will be a collectors item in the future. And the ats is a really well built car.

[amuzement]

I remember reading somewhere that BMW is switching to front wheel drive in the near future, which is a definite sign of them moving away from the enthusiast market. I have a E46 330i with ZSP and it is a great and fun car. I have not yet checked out an F30 so I'm sure you guys are right. I guess I was not expecting BMW to move towards the luxury market this early

[Das_Stig]

Originally Posted by Karbon

Not to burst anyone's bubble about the new F30 but honestly I haven't heard anything good about it from anyone. I like BMW and I wanted to like the F30 but...

A couple of friends who have been working at BMW for a long time said and I quote:
"I honestly can't recommend any of the current model 3 series. They're cheaply made and it shows. It's all about the bottom line now. It's not even a drivers car anymore."

Go take a really good look at one on the lot, I mean a good look. I was floored by how cheap it looked.

By comparison, the F30 is massive compared to the e90. It's a completely different car. The F30 is basically the size of my e39 5 series. Check the dimensions.

know exactly what you mean when i looked from far was like not bad, but as i looked closer saw exactly where they cheaped out here and there.. was not appealing at all.

[J02 335i]

I have not personally driven an ATS or F30 335i, and I'm not trying to sound like a fan boy here, and I could be completely wrong. But to me it almost sounds like Motortrend either "wants" or "needs" another winner in this segment other then BMW.

They have been criticized for years for the 3 series always (or the majority of the time) winning their comparo's.

So the 335i, is the fastest, best handling (figure eight), ties for the shortest braking distance, has the most room and the base price is $990 more then the Benz and $1200 more then the ATS. Lets not forgot gets the best fuel economy also.

Maybe I'm confused? Or the new electric power steering and build quality that bad?

[Efthreeoh]

I'm happy with this review.

When BMW dropped the N/A I6 and stuck an Ipad out of the dash in the F30, they lost me as a customer. I've owned a BMW 3 Series since 1988. It is pitiful how BMW has gone after the Lexus customer. Kudos to Cadillac, they probably have my next car in the ATS. I driver's car, is what I want. It's also sad when Mercedes beats a BMW as a sports sedan.

And the Caddy is the first car I've seen that when you order the base-level 2.0T with a manual trans and sunroof, the price actully goes down.

[fireline43]

They need to make an incentive to change from BMW to caddy to make it appealing. Looking up their offers, they weren't that great

[MattMD]

My hope for the F-series sedans lies in the F30 LCI.

I think a lot of people who are actually in the market may compare the ATS to a CPO E90 LCI. It won't be the "newest thing" but I think it is the epitome of the 3 series. People expected something better than the best, but that couldn't happen. That's why the F30 is a letdown.

[Saintor]

If I was in the market, I would revisit seriously C300/C350 with updated NA V6 engines for 2013. Yes, we have a C300 in Canada.

[5tony]

I spent a few days with a loaner F30 and I can say that the steering feel is what makes it less fun to drive than my '11 335i. The great "firm" steering feeling of the e46 and e90 is gone. You really can't feel how much the tires are biting if you close your eyes. The coil back after a turn feels totally unnatural too. I for one am glad I didn't wait for the F30. BTW, I was really in the market for the F10 5 series when it came out, but after driving it I decided the e90 was the car I really enjoyed driving and bought the 335i instead.

[335BBS]

Originally Posted by J02 335i

I have not personally driven an ATS or F30 335i, and I'm not trying to sound like a fan boy here, and I could be completely wrong. But to me it almost sounds like Motortrend either "wants" or "needs" another winner in this segment other then BMW.

They have been criticized for years for the 3 series always (or the majority of the time) winning their comparo's.

So the 335i, is the fastest, best handling (figure eight), ties for the shortest braking distance, has the most room and the base price is $990 more then the Benz and $1200 more then the ATS. Lets not forgot gets the best fuel economy also.

Maybe I'm confused? Or the new electric power steering and build quality that bad?

Audi S4 smoked it too, in every catagory including steering feel. I think the upcoming 4 series will address the"performance" issues. Whether you believe it or not , most 3s are driven by non enthusiasts...people who think its cool to be in a BMW. Another reason I am going back to Audi.

[335BBS]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

I'm happy with this review.

When BMW dropped the N/A I6 and stuck an Ipad out of the dash in the F30, they lost me as a customer. I've owned a BMW 3 Series since 1988. It is pitiful how BMW has gone after the Lexus customer. Kudos to Cadillac, they probably have my next car in the ATS. I driver's car, is what I want. It's also sad when Mercedes beats a BMW as a sports sedan.

And the Caddy is the first car I've seen that when you order the base-level 2.0T with a manual trans and sunroof, the price actully goes down.

Thats where the money is.

[335BBS]

Originally Posted by fireline43

They need to make an incentive to change from BMW to caddy to make it appealing. Looking up their offers, they weren't that great

BMW is constantly offering incentives so it will be tough. They are trying to catch Mercedes in sales volume.

[derrick603]

I'd be more likely to check out an ATS if it had a more interesting motor. The ATS-V is probably out of my price range though.

[amani]

had the F30 a few days for a loaner, definitely bigger and slightly roomier and like the exterior too, but driving experience wasn't really impressive. been complaining about the interior since e30 and finally e90 has a more acceptable finish, but the F30 comes downhill again, yuck. That emission friendly cutoff feature, i am not sure how durable that is.

[ChuckBMW3]

Originally Posted by amuzement

I remember reading somewhere that BMW is switching to front wheel drive in the near future, which is a definite sign of them moving away from the enthusiast market. I have a E46 330i with ZSP and it is a great and fun car. I have not yet checked out an F30 so I'm sure you guys are right. I guess I was not expecting BMW to move towards the luxury market this early

I really hope that's not true

[mike-y]

Originally Posted by J02 335i

They have been criticized for years for the 3 series always (or the majority of the time) winning their comparo's.

you're thinking of Car & Driver, but even they said that the ATS has better handling/dynamics, and is a much better "driver's car" than the F30. But in C&D's case, they felt the ATS ergonomics and interior design wasn't quite up to par to those in the F30.

[Thrakos]

Originally Posted by 335BBS

Audi S4 smoked it too, in every catagory including steering feel. I think the upcoming 4 series will address the"performance" issues. Whether you believe it or not , most 3s are driven by non enthusiasts...people who think its cool to be in a BMW. Another reason I am going back to Audi.

While I've only been on the forum for a short time, it seems that you have nothing positive to say about BMWs yet you hang around.. what gives?

[J02 335i]

Originally Posted by mike-y

you're thinking of Car & Driver, but even they said that the ATS has better handling/dynamics, and is a much better "driver's car" than the F30. But in C&D's case, they felt the ATS ergonomics and interior design wasn't quite up to par to those in the F30.

Your right, I was thinking of Car and Driver.

[amuzement]

Originally Posted by BeMWeh

While I've only been on the forum for a short time, it seems that you have nothing positive to say about BMWs yet you hang around.. what gives?

I think he is just bummed out like the rest of us about the direction that BMW is heading.