[creepy coupe]

Originally Posted by CarAbuser

Being brought up in a household where casualty was a staple every Friday night .

I bet they thought you fairly unattractive also.

[xenon]

Originally Posted by doughboy

Large company schemes are much better VFM as the 'cash' P11D equivalent is always very low compared to what you would pay as an individual.

And you don't get penalised for claiming either as the company pays the same regardless of your claims.

Yes, this is very true.

[rogerxp]

You simply get what you pay for with PMI.

You'll pay more if you go individually (but can get special 'introductory' offers) but any small owner/managed companies should really be getting a group scheme - the minimum number included is 2 but 5 upwards starts to attract decent discounts.

If you're not paying that much then things will be excluded, or, the benefits are limited to a set amount - if any ongoing claim exceed this amount you have to fund it yourself.

There are all sorts of tweaks & tricks to help reduce the costs (excess, limits, reduced hospital lists, etc) or just cleverly splitting up who's covered to get the number of members up.

It is possible to 'negotiate' discounts for anyone with a group scheme already in existance, you just need to know who to speak to, and the right phrases. All this without making any changes to the scheme whatsoever. Anyone interested just PM me .

[mowflow]

My wife and son have PMI and dental as my wife works for Cygna Healthcare. It was an option to add me but we never bothered. All my hospital visits are for broken bones and the need to have my face glued shut, as these aren't covered I don't bother.

[rogerxp]

Originally Posted by mowflow

My wife and son have PMI and dental as my wife works for Cygna Healthcare. It was an option to add me but we never bothered. All my hospital visits are for broken bones and the need to have my face glued shut, as these aren't covered I don't bother.

In fairness, those sorts of issues get sorted at A&E, it's traditionally the major things where PMI excels, or investigations (when referred from a GP) where you can been seen very quickly instead of a 6 month wait. Plus, of course, not sharing a room with 7 other great-unwashed . Funnily enough I was at Stepping Hill earlier today as my little boy was having a scan (started before birth so following it through) and some of the pond life wandering around there is just staggering (staff & public ).

I took my own Saline

[Hotcoupe]

Originally Posted by CarAbuser

The main gripe I have with NHS hospitals is the severe lack of attractive nurses.
Being brought up in a household where casualty was a staple every Friday night I had grown to expect wards full of leggy blondes but instead it's just dumpy Filipino nurses and Mo Mowlam look-a-likes.

Originally Posted by creepy coupe

I bet they thought you fairly unattractive also.

bad day @ the office Del

I had to have a minor eye op last week,female Doctor was a brahma,and the Irish nurse was too die for,not good when you're lying flat on your back!

The op was done on the NHS and within 2 wks of being referred by my GP.

On a separate note,and from my own experience (not eye related) going private would have been of no benefit to me,my NHS consultants would have been the same consultants under a private health scheme,and I doubt my treatment would have been any quicker.

The NHS gets a lot of bashing,it's not until you need it yourself you realise what a fantastic service it provides, and at no cost.

That's not to say PMI is of no benefit of course,one benefit is it keeps the q's shorter for us peasants,so to all those with PMI,thanks from one of the 'great unwashed'.

[creepy coupe]

Originally Posted by Hotcoupe

:

The op was done on the NHS and within 2 wks of being referred by my GP.

The NHS gets a lot of bashing,it's not until you need it yourself you realise what a fantastic service it provides, and at no cost.

When things are serious they do get a move on IMO

bad day @ the office Del

The sun is shining, the BM is outside and clean, with a full tank. Life's good Ian

[- Paul -]

Threw up blood on 7th Jan - I've since had blood test and an endoscopy and am in the process of further tests (all in less than a month). I have nothing but admiration for the NHS. They have never failed me (yet). Yes - I've had two hour delays on appointments etc, but this is worth it when I've been dealt with the way I have. It doesn't bother me in the slightest that others (great unwashed) are present - these people get ill too!

[Baby Dave]

I used to work in a private hospital and I would never ever go private. Yes you get your own room, but the nursing staff couldn't get jobs within the NHS. The consultants are from the NHS and are just earning a bit extra working at the private hospital. When things went tits up, which was on a regular basis, the staff bad to phone 999 for an ambulance, and the patient had to be taken to the local NHS hospital. Private healthcare is a rip off and you are not treated by professionals as you are within the NHS .

[SteveC]

Always believed in the NHS; until last year

Late February I decided my office needed redecorating so I set about removing the furniture. Got halfway through emptying and moving a bookcase when I felt something in my back go. Next day I flew to Germany in agony, high on painkillers.
Got to see an orthopaedic surgeon the very next morning (he came in 1 hour early to see me), diagnosed the problem and gave me an orthotic heel raise and some muscle relaxants.

Got back to the UK but a week later was in absolute agony, even when lying flat in bed and considered calling an ambulance. Instead toughed it out and next morning went to GP, who ran few tests and found that I was losing the use of my right leg. Prescribed the strongest co-codamol and the strongest tramadol and suggested I go to A&E.

A&E ran a few tests, decided I didn't need anything more than the pain killers and some rest and sent me home. The next night I again considered calling an ambulance as the pain was almost unbearable. Next morning saw another GP, who suggested I just suspend myself in the corner formed by kitched cabinets, with the idea of providing some degree of traction on the spine. Quack
By the following evening I couldn't lift my right leg more than 20 degrees from horizontal or walk up stairs and was taking max tramadol every 6 hours, and max co-codamol every 6 hours, i.e strong pain killers every 3 hours. The hour before each painkiller was pure agony.
Next day back to the GP, who prescribed physio therapy. I have private insurance so managed to see a therapist the same day. She refused to treat me for fear of doing further damage and told me I absolutely needed an MRI to get a proper diagnosis.

Back to see yet another GP, who agreed that it was an emergency (I could barely walk and couldn't pee) and sent me back to A & E. Saw the same doctor, who now involved his boss. Told me I didn't meet their guidelines for an MRI and sent me home with a bottle of Morphine and told to take 6 weeks bed rest (lying in bed was the worst pain).

Went back to GP and demanded something be done. By now I was worrying that if I kept up the incessant painkillers I'd blow out my kidneys (very many dialysis patients are there because of pain killers).
Dr. wrote a letter to my private health insurer, stating that I needed to see a spinal specialist.
The next day I saw the specialist, who did an MRI and found damage to 3 discs, that were pressing on various nerves. Scheduled a procedure for nerve blocks, which I had the next day. Left the hospital next evening pain free and remained that way, allowing me to start rehab. excercises to stabilize spine.

Specialist booked me in for spinal surgery in the event that pain returned. After 1 year, lots of Osteopath visits and constant excercise my back is virtually pain free if I'm careful not to lift anything and I can once again do 60 leg curls with 65kg (sitting of course).

My conclusion....NHS is a service provided for the masses that is becoming more and more stretched. With no disrespect to the Doctors and Nurses, who I know do their best, NHS is to medical care what MacDonalds is to eating out. If you want general wards, mass produced hospital food, long queues, long waiting times, junior doctors with overlong work hours and overstressed resources, stick with the NHS. If you want private wards, quick access, no queues, specialist physicians and optimum (as opposed to economic) treatment, then private is the only way to go.

[briers]

Private healthcare don't do emergencies like this one

Any ops and your gp can refer you but anything a&e and you will be treated under the nhs.

Quite often you will be treated by the same consultant private or nhs and sometimes you have to wait longer under private. You do benefit if you have a complicated medical history as you have an actual consultant review your case.

[DrunkenMonkey]

Ive had a mixed bag

Mum had to suffer a full year of bumbling doctors and tests on the NHS before we went private and diagnosed her with TB, she was litteraly at deaths door at that point.

Treatment was on the NHS - St Mary's which was outstanding, it was a long 2 years of treatment and touch and go operations. Nurses and doctors were brilliant.

Couple of years ago my grandad passed away at Barnet hospital under the NHS. He had fibrosis, couldnt breathe much and had caught an infection from the ward he was in. Nurses and care staff were awful.

One particualr nurse did not give him his medication on 3 occasions in 2 days. He was slowly going under by this time.

Myself and family made a big fuss and were assured he would receive his antibiotics on time from now on.

That didnt happen and he passed away a day later, we had no choice but to watch.

death certficate stated neumonia as the cause of death. which was a blatant lie.

anyway, there are many stories good and bad.

I dont even know what my point is anymore after all that lol

[JLR1969]

I snapped the ACL in my knee. Saw the doctor who advised it would be 6 months for surgery on the NHS.

One call to BUPA and two days later I was in a BMI private hospital having surgery.

The private wing was attached to the main hospital and the surgeon was the consultant who also worked for the NHS so in essence I paid to jump the queue.

Worth every penny.

[Vaheed1]

Personally, I think we should be grateful for having the NHS, because care like this isn't available anywhere else in the World for Free. They have a thankless task, that's for sure.

I'll forever be grateful for the tremendous support and treatment i received for my cancer.

Private care isn't any different, just quicker.

[JLR1969]

Originally Posted by Vaheed1

Personally, I think we should be grateful for having the NHS, because care like this isn't available anywhere else in the World for Free. They have a thankless task, that's for sure.

I'll forever be grateful for the tremendous support and treatment i received for my cancer.

Private care isn't any different, just quicker.

I pay 40% tax how is the NHS free?

[SteveC]

Originally Posted by JLR1969

I pay 40% tax how is the NHS free?

You pay 40% tax AND National Insurance AND private health insurance if you're insured privately.

[JLR1969]

Originally Posted by SteveC

You pay 40% tax AND National Insurance AND private health insurance if you're insured privately.

And tax on fuel, booze etc etc etc. it never ends. The NHS should be good!

[Vaheed1]

Originally Posted by JLR1969

I pay 40% tax how is the NHS free?

It might not be for you and me - but if we were ever to have income problems in life, we have the safe guard of having free treatment. It's insurance policy which runs, no matter what you earn. Your and my 40% tax for the whole year...COMBINED.. wouldn't buy 2 bags of Chemo for someone's cycle of treatment.

[JLR1969]

Originally Posted by Vaheed1

It might not be for you and me - but if we were ever to have income problems in life, we have the safe guard of having free treatment. It's insurance policy which runs, no matter what you earn. Your and my 40% tax for the whole year...COMBINED.. wouldn't buy 2 bags of Chemo for someone's cycle of treatment.

So a case of free if you are one of life's scroungers and if I ever lose my income then the past 23 years of paying in will cover me so not exactly free either.

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by SteveC

Always believed in the NHS; until last year

Late February I decided my office needed redecorating so I set about removing the furniture. Got halfway through emptying and moving a bookcase when I felt something in my back go. Next day I flew to Germany in agony, high on painkillers.
Got to see an orthopaedic surgeon the very next morning (he came in 1 hour early to see me), diagnosed the problem and gave me an orthotic heel raise and some muscle relaxants.

Got back to the UK but a week later was in absolute agony, even when lying flat in bed and considered calling an ambulance. Instead toughed it out and next morning went to GP, who ran few tests and found that I was losing the use of my right leg. Prescribed the strongest co-codamol and the strongest tramadol and suggested I go to A&E.

A&E ran a few tests, decided I didn't need anything more than the pain killers and some rest and sent me home. The next night I again considered calling an ambulance as the pain was almost unbearable. Next morning saw another GP, who suggested I just suspend myself in the corner formed by kitched cabinets, with the idea of providing some degree of traction on the spine. Quack
By the following evening I couldn't lift my right leg more than 20 degrees from horizontal or walk up stairs and was taking max tramadol every 6 hours, and max co-codamol every 6 hours, i.e strong pain killers every 3 hours. The hour before each painkiller was pure agony.
Next day back to the GP, who prescribed physio therapy. I have private insurance so managed to see a therapist the same day. She refused to treat me for fear of doing further damage and told me I absolutely needed an MRI to get a proper diagnosis.

Back to see yet another GP, who agreed that it was an emergency (I could barely walk and couldn't pee) and sent me back to A & E. Saw the same doctor, who now involved his boss. Told me I didn't meet their guidelines for an MRI and sent me home with a bottle of Morphine and told to take 6 weeks bed rest (lying in bed was the worst pain).

Went back to GP and demanded something be done. By now I was worrying that if I kept up the incessant painkillers I'd blow out my kidneys (very many dialysis patients are there because of pain killers).
Dr. wrote a letter to my private health insurer, stating that I needed to see a spinal specialist.
The next day I saw the specialist, who did an MRI and found damage to 3 discs, that were pressing on various nerves. Scheduled a procedure for nerve blocks, which I had the next day. Left the hospital next evening pain free and remained that way, allowing me to start rehab. excercises to stabilize spine.

Specialist booked me in for spinal surgery in the event that pain returned. After 1 year, lots of Osteopath visits and constant excercise my back is virtually pain free if I'm careful not to lift anything and I can once again do 60 leg curls with 65kg (sitting of course).

My conclusion....NHS is a service provided for the masses that is becoming more and more stretched. With no disrespect to the Doctors and Nurses, who I know do their best, NHS is to medical care what MacDonalds is to eating out. If you want general wards, mass produced hospital food, long queues, long waiting times, junior doctors with overlong work hours and overstressed resources, stick with the NHS. If you want private wards, quick access, no queues, specialist physicians and optimum (as opposed to economic) treatment, then private is the only way to go.

Very interesting topic going on here.

I work for NHS, a big American Private Hospital and Bupa Health Care and luckily I know in and out of it.

It is good to have private insurance, but sometimes its not in your favours.

I am not defending NHS, but I will put lots of things on DOH (Department of health) and NICE (google it) to blame.

DOH and NICE gives us criteria to decide who should go for MRI in case of back pain and who should not. They also have a criteria that with back patient should be referred to who and for how long? And after how long, one should be sent for MRI (if it is not critical).

If it is in the hand of GP, Consultant on Duty, I am sure, they will be sending every other patient for MRI to clinically rule out discs and many other issues, but DOH and NICE govern us, and make policies and we have to follow them. (Feel free to blame them).

There are three things, if present, then you should be referred for MRI.
1- you cannot pass urine or bowel.
2- Saddle Anesthesia (numbness around your buttock and perinial Area)
3- Muscle Strength of your leg should be less than -4/5 on oxford scale.

In your case if you have difficulty in lifting your leg up, and if your muscle strength was less than -4/5, you should have referred for MRI and subsequently for Surgery, if needed depending on how much discs were pressing on your nerves.

Now your surgery was done 1-2 weeks after initial injury and it got worst over the time. It suggests that you had initial minor injury, and if you were informed about proper after care of back and followed, you could have avoided the surgery and any other consequences.

Another thing which I should mention, strategy in NHS is minimal invasive unless it is critical. So with disc problems, criterai is

1- Treat a patient conservatively unless
2- It is critical and any of those three things are present (stated above).

It is also worth of mentioning, that in private practice, I have seen many surgeons opening your back even if it is not necessary. And that is the drawback of private pratice. You may be thinking that you are getting best treatment in the world, whereas basically your back is paying Surgeon his fees.

I have seen Pilot (only 45 years old), who could not go back to his work after spinal surgery and highly ranked officer, who struggled even after surgery.

As said earlier, sometimes it is not necessary to go for surgery, but it is absolutely necessary to go for DIAGNOSIS. I think your case could have dealt properly if MRI was done, but GP hands were tight, as you stated and you did not fulfill the criteria.

Also dont forget, it could be, you did not need surgery and you had one. I am not putting you off, but I always recommed people asking Surgeons that

IS THIS SURGERY NECESSARY?

I hope your back is sorted now, and you are having healthy life. So did they take out part of your discs or what?
What exactly have they done?

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by DrunkenMonkey

Ive had a mixed bag

Mum had to suffer a full year of bumbling doctors and tests on the NHS before we went private and diagnosed her with TB, she was litteraly at deaths door at that point.

Treatment was on the NHS - St Mary's which was outstanding, it was a long 2 years of treatment and touch and go operations. Nurses and doctors were brilliant.

Couple of years ago my grandad passed away at Barnet hospital under the NHS. He had fibrosis, couldnt breathe much and had caught an infection from the ward he was in. Nurses and care staff were awful.

One particualr nurse did not give him his medication on 3 occasions in 2 days. He was slowly going under by this time.

Myself and family made a big fuss and were assured he would receive his antibiotics on time from now on.

That didnt happen and he passed away a day later, we had no choice but to watch.

death certficate stated neumonia as the cause of death. which was a blatant lie.

anyway, there are many stories good and bad.

I dont even know what my point is anymore after all that lol

IMO you have done wrong. Sorry and regrest about what happened to your family, but if he was not given medication on time, you should have made a complaint.
There are many black sheeps out in every organization and they get away because we people are so much afraid of complaining. And such sheeps carry on working and destroying others.

What if same nurse did not give medication to another 1-2 patients and they suffered?

Please if you know something went wrongs, always complaint and let the inquire handle it.

In each trust / hospital, there is departments which is know as PALS (Patient advice and Liaison Service) and you can always contact them about any complaints you have.

http://www.pals.nhs.uk/

Dont think that you are trying to be nuisance but think about other patienst aswell.

All the best.

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by JLR1969

I snapped the ACL in my knee. Saw the doctor who advised it would be 6 months for surgery on the NHS.

One call to BUPA and two days later I was in a BMI private hospital having surgery.

The private wing was attached to the main hospital and the surgeon was the consultant who also worked for the NHS so in essence I paid to jump the queue.

Worth every penny.

I would be very interested to know what you do for living. Are you athletes or does your earnings depend on your athletic activities?

Just to share information, if your ACL was snapped, and you did not want to go back to any sports, you could have lived without surgery.

Did you had arthroscopic reconstruction?

This is typical example where private insurance helps. But if I was you, I would think twice, 'can I live without this surgery?'
Reason being, your ACL deficiency can be compensated by strengthening your muscles. It is not CITICAL (life and death) matter, and hence some people live without srugery.

Well done as your private insurance settled it.