Installing M3 components on 335 makes it feel like an M3?

onesuperboi · 07-11-2010, 10:33 AM

Has anyone driven an e90/e92 M3 and a 335 with M3 suspension components? If so, does the 335 feel the same as an M3?

tres · 07-11-2010, 08:09 PM

i have the m3 components its feels very tight but its not like the m3

BRO · 07-11-2010, 11:10 PM

Did you change to M3 shocks and springs?

I am contemplating the M3 suspension change. I have no desire to drop the car or destroy the ride of my daily driver. Or spend a lot of money chasing diminishing returns. But the car feels sloppy and floaty on the track compared to M3's I have ridden in.

I drove a new M3 today and was surprised how lethargic it felt compared to my Proceed equipped 335i. It was flatter in the corners but a bit numb steering. With a tighter suspension on the 335i, there would be no comparison. And I get 21 mpg around town and 28-32 mpg hwy!

My current thinking is to get all the M3 parts except the rear subframe bushings (too expensive to install) and shocks. I already have GC soft camber plates. For shocks I am trying to decide between Koni FSD (good all around performance) and Koni Sport Yellows (adjustable for the track). Any opinions out there?

itsbrokeagain · 07-11-2010, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRO

Did you change to M3 shocks and springs?

I am contemplating the M3 suspension change. I have no desire to drop the car or destroy the ride of my daily driver. Or spend a lot of money chasing diminishing returns. But the car feels sloppy and floaty on the track compared to M3's I have ridden in.

I drove a new M3 today and was surprised how lethargic it felt compared to my Proceed equipped 335i. It was flatter in the corners but a bit numb steering. With a tighter suspension on the 335i, there would be no comparison. And I get 21 mpg around town and 28-32 mpg hwy!

My current thinking is to get all the M3 parts except the rear subframe bushings (too expensive to install) and shocks. I already have GC soft camber plates. For shocks I am trying to decide between Koni FSD (good all around performance) and Koni Sport Yellows (adjustable for the track). Any opinions out there?

Koni yellows would be the better choice of the two. You can set how stiff or soft you want them.

zsapphire7 · 07-12-2010, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRO

Did you change to M3 shocks and springs?

I am contemplating the M3 suspension change. I have no desire to drop the car or destroy the ride of my daily driver. Or spend a lot of money chasing diminishing returns. But the car feels sloppy and floaty on the track compared to M3's I have ridden in.

I drove a new M3 today and was surprised how lethargic it felt compared to my Proceed equipped 335i. It was flatter in the corners but a bit numb steering. With a tighter suspension on the 335i, there would be no comparison. And I get 21 mpg around town and 28-32 mpg hwy!

My current thinking is to get all the M3 parts except the rear subframe bushings (too expensive to install) and shocks. I already have GC soft camber plates. For shocks I am trying to decide between Koni FSD (good all around performance) and Koni Sport Yellows (adjustable for the track). Any opinions out there?

The M3 rear subframe bushings are probably the ones that make the most difference id say. The rear just becomes solid after the install and you lose the floaty feeling.

turb0mik3 · 07-12-2010, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zsapphire7

The M3 rear subframe bushings are probably the ones that make the most difference id say. The rear just becomes solid after the install and you lose the floaty feeling.

+1 to this. I am contemplating doing a large swap of M3 parts from HP Autowerks here in town. I don't track my car often, but will be getting the M3 front control arm kit, rear toe control arms, and rear guide arms. That should give a lot more feedback and although it might be sort of expensive, it will be worth it when I install my LSD so the back will stay under control.

The HACK · 07-12-2010, 03:35 PM

Having gone from a car with open diff to two cars with LSD (one with the wonderful ///M LSD), and now having another car with open diff that I've taken to the track regularly, I have to say, unless you can swap for a REAL mechanical LSD you're never going to come close to the M3 "feel."

turb0mik3 · 07-12-2010, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The HACK

Having gone from a car with open diff to two cars with LSD (one with the wonderful ///M LSD), and now having another car with open diff that I've taken to the track regularly, I have to say, unless you can swap for a REAL mechanical LSD you're never going to come close to the M3 "feel."

Good call, gosh I want a 3.46.

Saving and waiting suckks.

boom · 07-12-2010, 05:06 PM

I am interested in this question as well. I am suspicious of just slapping parts designed for the M3 on the 335 and expecting a similar feel. The M3 has different dimensions (IIRC it's wider). For this reason I'm considering a setup that was designed for our hardware. Eibach pro kit or Dinan stage 2 plus rear sway. Any input on this is appreciated as I'm a suspension noob.

scottp999 · 07-12-2010, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boom

I am interested in this question as well. I am suspicious of just slapping parts designed for the M3 on the 335 and expecting a similar feel. The M3 has different dimensions (IIRC it's wider). For this reason I'm considering a setup that was designed for our hardware. Eibach pro kit or Dinan stage 2 plus rear sway. Any input on this is appreciated as I'm a suspension noob.

Dinan sells the rear bushings with the front control arm bushings.

http://www.dinancars.com/store/produ...cat=321&page=2

I believe the rear bushings and the front sway for the dinan stage 2 suspension are just the m3 parts which they mark up a ton. Just like the dinan lsd is the quaife unit.

If you want something better than the BMW performance susp, then get the dinan stage 1, and buy the M3 front sway from tischer to get it equivalent to dinan stage 2.

The rear bushings, what ever you do are going to be some labor hours, so might as well do all the m3 parts while back there.

onesuperboi · 07-12-2010, 09:38 PM

Getting a good suspension setup is hard. I'm using my car as a daily driver, but like what other have said, I don't like this floating feeling when going on uneven pavement at high rates of speed. On the other hand, I don't want the bouncy feeling either that usually occurs when purchasing springs and shocks to lower the car.

It sounds like the BMW performance suspension kit is the best solution so far. I was just hoping to get more input and see if replacing the components to M3 parts will really make a tremendous difference for daily driving.

When people purchased the M3 suspension components, I've read that they use the BMW performance springs and shocks as well. Has anyone else tried installing different springs and shocks or use the stock ZSP? Maybe the real reason behind the greater ride feel is due the springs and shocks, not the M3 components...

HP Autosport · 07-13-2010, 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onesuperboi

Has anyone driven an e90/e92 M3 and a 335 with M3 suspension components? If so, does the 335 feel the same as an M3?

If you do all the M3 components that are compatible with the 335i and upgrade the shocks and springs, you will be close. One of the last pieces of the puzzle would be a good LSD.

Alpina_B3_Lux · 07-13-2010, 03:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boom

I am interested in this question as well. I am suspicious of just slapping parts designed for the M3 on the 335 and expecting a similar feel. The M3 has different dimensions (IIRC it's wider). For this reason I'm considering a setup that was designed for our hardware. Eibach pro kit or Dinan stage 2 plus rear sway. Any input on this is appreciated as I'm a suspension noob.

The suspension of the M3 and the "normal" 3 series is almost identical, which is also why it's so easy replacing the 335i stock components with the M3 ones. You can therefore get very close to the M3 feel (or even surpass it if investing more). I've made the experience that adding the M3 parts (except shocks and springs) does make a huge difference in driving feel. Add to that a proper LSD and you're very very close. I've written some lines about my own experience with these upgrades: click here for my extended review.

Right now I've gone one step further and added a complete coilover, the Bilstein B16 Ride Control. That makes an additional immense difference, of course. I've not yet had the time to write a proper review of it, also because the ride height isn't final yet. But I do believe that now the suspension is at least equal, if not slightly superior, to the (stock) M3 setup. And it's loads of fun to drive!

Alpina_B3_Lux

scottp999 · 07-13-2010, 07:35 AM

For a daily driver, or a car driven a couple days a week for fun and not taken to the track, the BMW Performance Suspension and Quaife (or wavetrac) LSD has been a huge improvement over the stock components.

If you like going to the track or other events then consider adding the m3 components. It is a lot for parts and then the labor is more than a few hours.

GaryS · 07-13-2010, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boom

I am interested in this question as well. I am suspicious of just slapping parts designed for the M3 on the 335 and expecting a similar feel. The M3 has different dimensions (IIRC it's wider). For this reason I'm considering a setup that was designed for our hardware. Eibach pro kit or Dinan stage 2 plus rear sway. Any input on this is appreciated as I'm a suspension noob.

Dinan suspension is firmer than BMW Performance suspension, which I've heard is firmer than Eibach. If the cost is okay, I recommend adding the M3 front arms and rear subframe bushings to either of the first two. The BMW PS is a little quieter and more comfortable, but also a little bouncy.

adding: By quieter I mean less road noise.

BRO · 07-13-2010, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onesuperboi

Getting a good suspension setup is hard. I'm using my car as a daily driver, but like what other have said, I don't like this floating feeling when going on uneven pavement at high rates of speed. On the other hand, I don't want the bouncy feeling either that usually occurs when purchasing springs and shocks to lower the car.

It sounds like the BMW performance suspension kit is the best solution so far. I was just hoping to get more input and see if replacing the components to M3 parts will really make a tremendous difference for daily driving.

When people purchased the M3 suspension components, I've read that they use the BMW performance springs and shocks as well. Has anyone else tried installing different springs and shocks or use the stock ZSP? Maybe the real reason behind the greater ride feel is due the springs and shocks, not the M3 components...

Since you don't mention tracking the car, it does seem the BMW performance suspension would do the job for you and the M3 bits not as noticable. If you decide to track your car, the M3 bits might be more valuable. I track my car 5-6 times a year and don't mind having to adjust camber plates and shocks and change tires when I go. So I am leaning towards Koni Yellows for their adjustability. Just picked up M3 springs for shipping cost on the M forum which are a little stronger than the sport package springs on the car now. Mr 5 reports Performance package springs might be stronger still and perhaps a better fit to the stiffer Koni compression characteristic?

I still can't bring myself to drop $1K on mostly labor to change the rear subframe bushings. Cost benefit analysis is difficult because the measures are subjective. I work in the audio business and I know how some subjective benefits are inflated proportional to the money you just spent. Flame suit ON!

cstavaru · 07-13-2010, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRO

Since you don't mention tracking the car, it does seem the BMW performance suspension would do the job for you and the M3 bits not as noticable. If you decide to track your car, the M3 bits might be more valuable. I track my car 5-6 times a year and don't mind having to adjust camber plates and shocks and change tires when I go. So I am leaning towards Koni Yellows for their adjustability. Just picked up M3 springs for shipping cost on the M forum which are a little stronger than the sport package springs on the car now. Mr 5 reports Performance package springs might be stronger still and perhaps a better fit to the stiffer Koni compression characteristic?

I still can't bring myself to drop $1K on mostly labor to change the rear subframe bushings. Cost benefit analysis is difficult because the measures are subjective. I work in the audio business and I know how some subjective benefits are inflated proportional to the money you just spent. Flame suit ON!

I am not an expert, but I think that you should get the springs and shocks matched for the same application: either get BMW Performance springs and shocks, M4 springs and shocks, Koni springs and shocks, etc.

mike-y · 07-13-2010, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cstavaru

I am not an expert, but I think that you should get the springs and shocks matched for the same application: either get BMW Performance springs and shocks, M4 springs and shocks, Koni springs and shocks, etc.

well, Koni doesn't make springs, so you can't do that

You really just need to match the spring with an appropriate damper. Koni yellows are adjustable, so you can match them to most other springs out there by adjusting the rebound. Or you can use them in a coilover conversion kit, similar to what Ground Control or HP autowerks sells.

Ramppo · 07-13-2010, 03:31 PM

I used to have Dinan S2 which means complete Dinan suspension, it was really nice if your are looking for more sporty daily driver than what BMW sport suspension can offer and it was OK for me untill i took my car to Nürburgring.
When you enter the corners at high speed which you will when you track the car the Dinan suspension is way too floaty and soft and can not be compared to full M3 suspension convertion+LSD+Koni double adjustables which iam currently runing.
With this set the car is surpriseingly good daily driver too!

onesuperboi · 07-13-2010, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HP Autowerks

If you do all the M3 components that are compatible with the 335i and upgrade the shocks and springs, you will be close. One of the last pieces of the puzzle would be a good LSD.

Thanks for the feedback. I hope to get an LSD soon too and do these upgrades, but I am waiting until my warranty runs out. I'm doing all this research in preparation of the inevitable... modding.

onesuperboi · 07-13-2010, 08:12 PM

I don't think I would consider the Dinan kit, although I do like the fact that the package is specifically for the car and that with the camber plates you are allowed to run wider tires in front.

I am surprised the the Dinan kit didn't do so well Nurburgring. Is there a reason why you chose Koni shocks?

From my research, it seems like the best shocks are the Blisteins or BMW Performance springs since they seem to ride well and be durable. I'm afraid if I go with the other companies, such as KW or Koni's, that the performance would be great in the beginning but fade within a shorter time frame.

And, I really want to make sure that the M3 suspension parts do make a difference that is noticeable and that it's not only the shocks and springs.

rcusick · 07-13-2010, 10:02 PM

Instead of focusing on trying to replicate an m3, focus on what you don't like about your ride and make incremental changes as your budget allows. Generally I would recommend the following mods jn the following order (with some adjustment depending on what your trying to fix).

Non rft tires - keeps car planted, improves ride quality. Best win win.
Coilovers. Don't bother with springs / shocks separately. Go for a kw v1 set. Great price. Cheap install. Huge impact on handling.
M3 Front control arms / links. This is not that expensive to install and immediately improves handling. Camber is adjusted to be more aggressive by default.
M3 front brace. Really tightens u front end. Not that expensive to install.
M3 sways. Don't mess with other sways. M3 are the best. However reward / cost payoff is much less than coil over install.
M3 rear links. Cheap to install. Tightens up rear. Note this doesn't include replacing link that seats coil overs.
LSD - best mod overall to improve handling on corners and dead launches, you may want to put this lower on the list due to cost and fact that you just want better handling at high speeds. Cost of install is also high.
Rear subframe bushings. This is a tough one. Cost benefit of bushings versus and LSD for me is a no brainer. Both are expensive but LSD makes such a huge immediate difference.

Hey. Advice is free. What I can say is i have done each of these mods in stages and feel cost benefit is reflected in priorities stated above.

07-11-2010, 10:33 AM	#1
onesuperboi Major 52 Rep 1,357 Posts Drives: '08 e92 335i COBB 4.01 Stage 1 Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Bay Area, CA (Alameda) iTrader: (6)	Installing M3 components on 335 makes it feel like an M3? Has anyone driven an e90/e92 M3 and a 335 with M3 suspension components? If so, does the 335 feel the same as an M3?
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07-11-2010, 08:09 PM	#2
tres Major 34 Rep 1,381 Posts Drives: 2011 bmw 335is 6MT Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: maryland iTrader: (6)	i have the m3 components its feels very tight but its not like the m3
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07-11-2010, 11:10 PM	#3
BRO Oldie Newbie 4 Rep 134 Posts Drives: E92 2007 Auto Sport Red Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Irvine CA USA iTrader: (0)	Did you change to M3 shocks and springs? I am contemplating the M3 suspension change. I have no desire to drop the car or destroy the ride of my daily driver. Or spend a lot of money chasing diminishing returns. But the car feels sloppy and floaty on the track compared to M3's I have ridden in. I drove a new M3 today and was surprised how lethargic it felt compared to my Proceed equipped 335i. It was flatter in the corners but a bit numb steering. With a tighter suspension on the 335i, there would be no comparison. And I get 21 mpg around town and 28-32 mpg hwy! My current thinking is to get all the M3 parts except the rear subframe bushings (too expensive to install) and shocks. I already have GC soft camber plates. For shocks I am trying to decide between Koni FSD (good all around performance) and Koni Sport Yellows (adjustable for the track). Any opinions out there?
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07-12-2010, 03:35 PM	#7
The HACK Midlife Crises Racing Silent but Deadly Class 1821 Rep 5,337 Posts Drives: 2006 MZ4C, 2021 Tesla Model 3 Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Welcome to Jamaica have a nice day iTrader: (1)	Having gone from a car with open diff to two cars with LSD (one with the wonderful ///M LSD), and now having another car with open diff that I've taken to the track regularly, I have to say, unless you can swap for a REAL mechanical LSD you're never going to come close to the M3 "feel."
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07-12-2010, 05:06 PM	#9
boom My X5d tows my spec miata to the track. 74 Rep 1,254 Posts Drives: 2010 X5 35d Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: USA iTrader: (0)	I am interested in this question as well. I am suspicious of just slapping parts designed for the M3 on the 335 and expecting a similar feel. The M3 has different dimensions (IIRC it's wider). For this reason I'm considering a setup that was designed for our hardware. Eibach pro kit or Dinan stage 2 plus rear sway. Any input on this is appreciated as I'm a suspension noob.
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07-12-2010, 09:38 PM	#11
onesuperboi Major 52 Rep 1,357 Posts Drives: '08 e92 335i COBB 4.01 Stage 1 Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Bay Area, CA (Alameda) iTrader: (6)	Getting a good suspension setup is hard. I'm using my car as a daily driver, but like what other have said, I don't like this floating feeling when going on uneven pavement at high rates of speed. On the other hand, I don't want the bouncy feeling either that usually occurs when purchasing springs and shocks to lower the car. It sounds like the BMW performance suspension kit is the best solution so far. I was just hoping to get more input and see if replacing the components to M3 parts will really make a tremendous difference for daily driving. When people purchased the M3 suspension components, I've read that they use the BMW performance springs and shocks as well. Has anyone else tried installing different springs and shocks or use the stock ZSP? Maybe the real reason behind the greater ride feel is due the springs and shocks, not the M3 components...
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07-13-2010, 07:35 AM	#14
scottp999 Brigadier General 133 Rep 4,764 Posts Drives: 4runner SR5 Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: MD iTrader: (2) Garage List 2007 BMW 335 [9.00]	For a daily driver, or a car driven a couple days a week for fun and not taken to the track, the BMW Performance Suspension and Quaife (or wavetrac) LSD has been a huge improvement over the stock components. If you like going to the track or other events then consider adding the m3 components. It is a lot for parts and then the labor is more than a few hours.
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07-13-2010, 03:31 PM	#19
Ramppo Cruiser 16 Rep 106 Posts Drives: bmw 335 e92 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Helsinki Finland iTrader: (1)	I used to have Dinan S2 which means complete Dinan suspension, it was really nice if your are looking for more sporty daily driver than what BMW sport suspension can offer and it was OK for me untill i took my car to Nürburgring. When you enter the corners at high speed which you will when you track the car the Dinan suspension is way too floaty and soft and can not be compared to full M3 suspension convertion+LSD+Koni double adjustables which iam currently runing. With this set the car is surpriseingly good daily driver too! __________________ V4 Autotune, Vishnu Meth, injen IT, AR catted, Forge DV, Quaife LSD, RR OCC, Dinan OC, Dinan Exhaust, Dinan IC, Dinan LWFW, M3 Suspension, Koni/Swift.Upcoming RB turbo upgrade(ordered), AR cattless, FX400
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07-13-2010, 08:12 PM	#21
onesuperboi Major 52 Rep 1,357 Posts Drives: '08 e92 335i COBB 4.01 Stage 1 Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Bay Area, CA (Alameda) iTrader: (6)	I don't think I would consider the Dinan kit, although I do like the fact that the package is specifically for the car and that with the camber plates you are allowed to run wider tires in front. I am surprised the the Dinan kit didn't do so well Nurburgring. Is there a reason why you chose Koni shocks? From my research, it seems like the best shocks are the Blisteins or BMW Performance springs since they seem to ride well and be durable. I'm afraid if I go with the other companies, such as KW or Koni's, that the performance would be great in the beginning but fade within a shorter time frame. And, I really want to make sure that the M3 suspension parts do make a difference that is noticeable and that it's not only the shocks and springs.
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07-13-2010, 10:02 PM	#22
rcusick Private First Class 11 Rep 133 Posts Drives: BMW 335 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Los Angeles iTrader: (0)	Instead of focusing on trying to replicate an m3, focus on what you don't like about your ride and make incremental changes as your budget allows. Generally I would recommend the following mods jn the following order (with some adjustment depending on what your trying to fix). Non rft tires - keeps car planted, improves ride quality. Best win win. Coilovers. Don't bother with springs / shocks separately. Go for a kw v1 set. Great price. Cheap install. Huge impact on handling. M3 Front control arms / links. This is not that expensive to install and immediately improves handling. Camber is adjusted to be more aggressive by default. M3 front brace. Really tightens u front end. Not that expensive to install. M3 sways. Don't mess with other sways. M3 are the best. However reward / cost payoff is much less than coil over install. M3 rear links. Cheap to install. Tightens up rear. Note this doesn't include replacing link that seats coil overs. LSD - best mod overall to improve handling on corners and dead launches, you may want to put this lower on the list due to cost and fact that you just want better handling at high speeds. Cost of install is also high. Rear subframe bushings. This is a tough one. Cost benefit of bushings versus and LSD for me is a no brainer. Both are expensive but LSD makes such a huge immediate difference. Hey. Advice is free. What I can say is i have done each of these mods in stages and feel cost benefit is reflected in priorities stated above.
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