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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > NA Engine (non-turbo) / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > Official BPC N52 Turbo Thread



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      04-26-2017, 04:08 PM   #1
John@BPC
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Official BPC N52 Turbo Thread

Ok guys in this thread we will be sharing the continued development of our N52 race turbo kit.

The goal over the next 6 weeks is to finish the track prep for our E90. Once the car is track ready we will begin our durability testing at the 505hp level we are currently at. Dan will be driving with in car video. He has 6 years of experience at our home track VIR (Virginia International Raceway). Most of which has been with the BPC S62 swapped E30. We are all excited to see how our Turbo E90 holds under race conditions. We are hopeful it will make us proud and hold together for its intended use. Once we have completed a couple track events with good results we will be removing the hot side to send to get bid out to duplicate for resale. After we are able to come up with a price and time frame for production we will start a group buy for members. Please enjoy the journey with us and please keep your questions/comments professional and on topic.




Our website now has a few albums with all of the pictures taken from the old thread, organized in one place for your viewing pleasure.

https://bimmerperformancecenter.com/pages/bpc-n52-turbo

Last edited by John@BPC; 05-24-2017 at 12:56 PM..
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      04-26-2017, 04:12 PM   #2
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Oh boy.....this is getting exciting.
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      04-26-2017, 05:48 PM   #3
rick100
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bob crazy thought here

I ve been following your old thread for a while and I find it hard to understand the reasoning for not putting out a stage 1 type of kit with a 300-350 whp first, where we can keep the same transmission and leave everything stock . ESS had some type of success with a kit putting less than 300 whp, and I m sure your kit at the same power is a lot better

Realistically volume customers are not going to spend over 10 k for a proper kit that needs other upgrades. At the 6k-8k mark is where more volume customers will be at. That is pretty much where you can justify not getting a 335 over a 328 . And that is pretty much where guys feel comfortable as we still do not know the reliability of a turbocharger in the n52 platform

You guys will probably get a lot of return customers if you guys come out with a stage 2 and even stage 3 kits afterwards.

The average guy is more willing to fork out 7k for a nice kit ( 300-350 whp) get used to it, test it out and then maybe add more money to upgrade fuel system and tranny for more power

Honestly it seems like you guys felt comfortable with the kit at around 300-350 whp and it seems you had quite a bit of interest from a lot of members here.

Anyways if you feel this like not replying I will just delete my post in a few days

Aside from that, the n52 race car project is looking great
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      04-26-2017, 10:41 PM   #4
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      04-26-2017, 10:51 PM   #5
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I agree with rick100 it seems like you guys are going with all in 500hp. That kit is way to much expensive as it requires a lot of parts to be upgraded. A lot. Just saying - there would be probably x10 times more happy people buying Stage 1 300-350hp kit that will not require to change half a car
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      04-26-2017, 11:55 PM   #6
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i will happily fork out 6-8k for a stage one kit
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      04-27-2017, 02:02 AM   #7
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Nice! In to see what the limits are. Much excite!
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      04-27-2017, 07:04 AM   #8
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That is one good looking (albeit busy) manifold. I know you guys are tuning for race, but I would love to know how that set up behaves on the street at from idle to 4500.
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      04-27-2017, 09:19 AM   #9
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Thanks Rick,

When we started this project we really wanted to use the borge warner EFR 7163 internally gated turbo. This is the same turbo that we bought two of and used on our F10 M5 built engine. While the engine was out of the M5 and we were waiting on having parts developed Dan decided to use one of the turbos for our project E90 test car. This is the same car that we developed most of our N/A tunes on. The engine has 175k miles and was the test mule for us to be the firs to cut open the intake and run it with no throttle body all the way up to 8200 rpm and made 280hp with AA headers and everything else stock.

Now back to the Turbo. We found because of the location of the motor mount bracket it was not possible to fit the EFR 7163 internally gated as a bottom mount. We also found the internally gated back side will not work as a top mount either. We swapped out the back side for an external gate which allowed for it to fit as a top mount but still would not fit as a bottom mount. The next obstacle was the A/C compressor location. Having the A/C on the exhaust side does not allow proper room for any piping cold or hot. The N54 fixes this issue buy moving the motor mount bracket all the way back to cylinders 5-6, the coolant pipe for the water pump is moved and better designed and also moves the A/C to the drivers side. The reason we could not copy the N54 with the N52 is because the bosses for the bolts in the block are not physically there. So we decided to removed the A/C so we could build the manifold we wanted to build. We had great results. 6 lbs of boost got us to 350hp and 300tq with an amazing power curve for both. If you wanted to call this a stage 1 we could sell it no problem. The only main issue is the customer will have to loose A/C. We feel hard pressed to sell a entry level kit for a street car that requires the removal of the A/C system.

Over the last 3 months we have been studying everything on our employees Eric's 06 330i trying to figure out a way around these obstacles listed above. At the end of the day we found even if we made our own motor mount bracket and custom coolant pipe it is still not possible to get around the the A/C as a bottom mount or top mount with a properly size turbo and quality designed manifold. This is the sole reason it is being offered as a race kit. It the customer is fine with removing the A/C the could use this setup we have built on low boost 6-7lbs on the street.

Hope this answers you question.
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      04-27-2017, 09:45 AM   #10
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325rwhp would be perfect for many people, but not having AC in going to be an issue.
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      04-27-2017, 09:51 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob@BPC View Post
Now back to the Turbo. We found because of the location of the motor mount bracket it was not possible to fit the EFR 7163 internally gated as a bottom mount. We also found the internally gated back side will not work as a top mount either. We swapped out the back side for an external gate which allowed for it to fit as a top mount but still would not fit as a bottom mount. The next obstacle was the A/C compressor location. Having the A/C on the exhaust side does not allow proper room for any piping cold or hot. The N54 fixes this issue buy moving the motor mount bracket all the way back to cylinders 5-6, the coolant pipe for the water pump is moved and better designed and also moves the A/C to the drivers side. The reason we could not copy the N54 with the N52 is because the bosses for the bolts in the block are not physically there. So we decided to removed the A/C so we could build the manifold we wanted to build. We had great results. 6 lbs of boost got us to 350hp and 300tq with an amazing power curve for both. If you wanted to call this a stage 1 we could sell it no problem. The only main issue is the customer will have to loose A/C. We feel hard pressed to sell a entry level kit for a street car that requires the removal of the A/C system.

Over the last 3 months we have been studying everything on our employees Eric's 06 330i trying to figure out a way around these obstacles listed above. At the end of the day we found even if we made our own motor mount bracket and custom coolant pipe it is still not possible to get around the the A/C as a bottom mount or top mount with a properly size turbo and quality designed manifold. This is the sole reason it is being offered as a race kit. It the customer is fine with removing the A/C the could use this setup we have built on low boost 6-7lbs on the street.

Hope this answers you question.
Probably a dumb question, but is it completely impossible to use the N54 compressor and bracket on an N52?
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      04-27-2017, 10:04 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terraphantm View Post
Probably a dumb question, but is it completely impossible to use the N54 compressor and bracket on an N52?
Yes, there are no bosses on the other side of the block to swap the compressor over. Check out the video below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFDZT0oKYBQ
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      04-27-2017, 11:30 AM   #13
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Ok thanks for the reply Bob.

So basically the main obstacle now is not having a/c , now I can understand why you guys are going all out , the main target is customers that want to have a race car. Your regular joe driving on the street will probably want a/c

Now , there was another member digidon with a turbo set up , I do not recall him removing the a/c compressor for his turbo build. I may be 100% wrong here and maybe he did get rid of the a/c compressor. Im assuming you know who he is and maybe you guys had exchanges some thoughts about this turbo build

I found his thread
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1223874

I didnt find anything regarding removing the a/c , have not read the whole thread though

Last edited by rick100; 04-27-2017 at 11:38 AM..
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      04-27-2017, 11:47 AM   #14
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Ya, the no a/c would be an issue with some guys, but at 6lbs of boost, the supercharger may be a better option that going with a 8k kit for the same power. If your spending that kin !of money, then you go all the way. Your basically spending the same amount, doing the same work, may as well run the 500hp to the wheels. If that is the original mileage on that car, now I can see why 4th had gone out. At 450 rwhp, that trans should be good.
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      04-27-2017, 03:45 PM   #15
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I hate to derail the thread, but I'm unbelieveably interested in the throttle bodyless intake. lol
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      04-27-2017, 04:52 PM   #16
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well said Rick... I am one of those that a 6 to 8k price tag would make me hard pressed not to buy.

digidon kept the ac I believe but I don't think you can compare the manifold he made to what BPC probably had in mind. not to knock the Don in any way as his build is absolutely amazing but I think BPC would have to make too many quality and manufacturing compromises in a mass market manifold to make it work to their standard.

Now if they were planning on making a log manifold or some weird design that's mainly designed to fit more than for top performance... say 15% less efficient for sake of argument... I'd still be interested if the power and tq curves we're similarly shaped. Just saying.

Regardless I'm still following their race development closely cuz it's gnarly af
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      04-28-2017, 08:25 AM   #17
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Excellent news .. when these parts become available to purchase even buying key kit components and fabricating the rest on your own would be great !

"If you wanted to call this a stage 1 we could sell it no problem. The only main issue is the customer will have to loose A/C. We feel hard pressed to sell a entry level kit for a street car that requires the removal of the A/C system."

Just being able to purchase a "stage 1 race kit" with the disclaimer from you guys of look .. if you buy this from us realize its for a track/race car "stage 1 race kit" so your going to loose some comfort features of your car.. as long as it is clear what will entail when this is installed. for the target customer who is ready to buy (most likely a project street car or weekend track cars aka toys) Great news.. that you said that you would still put one together if asked to.

very excited to see the next step of this project.

thank you
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      04-28-2017, 03:23 PM   #18
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Update

Here's where we stand with the E90 interior:







































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      04-28-2017, 03:28 PM   #19
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      04-28-2017, 04:14 PM   #20
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      05-05-2017, 07:39 AM   #21
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Really excited to see how this pans out once it gets some good track time. Keep up the good work, love seeing these updates.
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      05-05-2017, 09:10 AM   #22
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It looks like building a race car tread running a turbo. Lol
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