[200Duece]

Originally Posted by jbass524

Not bashing you but it seems like this post is for the OP to acquire useful information so he can make a good decision on his first handling mod. In the OP he is asking if there are any other approaches to increasing handling and reducing body roll. Even though the understeer is beaten almost to death it's an important consideration when choosing a first handling mod.

For instance, a bad recommendation would be this: If he wanted stiff and flat I would sell him my UUC swaybarbarians. They are so stiff they actually add spring rate and roll is minimal. Unfortunately his car would only feel faster and understeer would increase at the limit while making his car less comfortable.

I pretty sure I provided plenty of advice to the OP in the other posts I made. I had already given a quick reason as to why anti sways aren't the answer and about increasing spring rate dont necessarily add to "HANDLING" as the OP asked.

Understeer was never a question of the OP. That's why I poked a lil fun with chaz58

[335fourdoor]

Originally Posted by 200Duece

oh, please don't start with the understeer conversation . That goes a whole different direction. And probably the wrong direction

Deuce,

first i want to visit whale's vagina,ca.where is it?

second, which shocks/struts would you recommend if you're doing your own car?

[200Duece]

San Diego, ofcourse (Anchorman)

And I am biased and love everything Bilstein makes. Koni also is a great choice. I've driven a bunch of prepped cars with Koni's. I also hear the new BMW Performance is really nice

[335fourdoor]

Originally Posted by 200Duece

San Diego, ofcourse (Anchorman)

And I am biased and love everything Bilstein makes. Koni also is a great choice. I've driven a bunch of prepped cars with Koni's. I also hear the new BMW Performance is really nice

If you're to choose between koni fsd or koni yellows,which would u choose?

[jbass524]

Originally Posted by 200Duece

I pretty sure I provided plenty of advice to the OP in the other posts I made. I had already given a quick reason as to why anti sways aren't the answer and about increasing spring rate dont necessarily add to "HANDLING" as the OP asked.

Understeer was never a question of the OP. That's why I poked a lil fun with chaz58

I suppose could've read more.

[enrita]

Originally Posted by 335fourdoor

If you're to choose between koni fsd or koni yellows,which would u choose?

From lots of reading i gathered that kONI FSD with Eibach springs is a very good combo.
I personally have the Bilstein PSS10 and incredibly happy with them. totally transformed my car.

[200Duece]

Originally Posted by 335fourdoor

If you're to choose between koni fsd or koni yellows,which would u choose?

The FSD's are prob the better choice for the daily driver. The yellow sports are nice because of thier adjustability

[cvc 22349a]

I've driven a 335i w/Koni Sports but chose the FSD's because of the crappy CA roads. When driving on smooth roads, I wish I had installed the Sports; they're more responsive but harsher over bumps/potholes. The FSD's and non-rft PS2's have improved handling and ride comfort too. Don't notice the car wallow as it did before and got a little less body roll too.

[335fourdoor]

Originally Posted by cvc 22349a

I've driven a 335i w/Koni Sports but chose the FSD's because of the crappy CA roads. When driving on smooth roads, I wish I had installed the Sports; they're more responsive but harsher over bumps/potholes. The FSD's and non-rft PS2's have improved handling and ride comfort too. Don't notice the car wallow as it did before and got a little less body roll too.

did you install fsd's without changing out stock springs? are u satisfied with that set-up?

[cvc 22349a]

Originally Posted by 335fourdoor

did you install fsd's without changing out stock springs? are u satisfied with that set-up?

Yep. I had the FSD's installed with the oe sport springs. Didn't want to lower the car. I'm real happy w/the FSD's, but when I drive in Nevada on good roads I wish I had the Yellow Sports-they're quicker. There's tons of threads on the both shocks. I would definately ditch the oe shocks.

[335fourdoor]

Originally Posted by cvc 22349a

Yep. I had the FSD's installed with the oe sport springs. Didn't want to lower the car. I'm real happy w/the FSD's, but when I drive in Nevada on good roads I wish I had the Yellow Sports-they're quicker. There's tons of threads on the both shocks. I would definately ditch the oe shocks.

so to clarify: fsd's great with stock sport springs,
koni yellows recommend with h&r sports or race? am i correct?

[cvc 22349a]

Originally Posted by 335fourdoor

so to clarify: fsd's great with stock sport springs,
koni yellows recommend with h&r sports or race? am i correct?

I don't know about h&r springs. Either of the Konis will work well with the oe sport springs. I chose the FSD's because of the crappy CA roads. They're more comfortable over sharp impacts, potholes, expansion joints than the oe shocks, yet they improve handling, reduce body roll and improve turn in a bit. The yellows will provide better handling and steering response but will be harder riding.
I didn't want to reinvent the entire suspension, just improve it a bit. Dampers are the best way to do that with non-rft tires imo. Check out Tire Rack's review of Konis and search this forum for feedback.

[335fourdoor]

Originally Posted by cvc 22349a

I don't know about h&r springs. Either of the Konis will work well with the oe sport springs. I chose the FSD's because of the crappy CA roads. They're more comfortable over sharp impacts, potholes, expansion joints than the oe shocks, yet they improve handling, reduce body roll and improve turn in a bit. The yellows will provide better handling and steering response but will be harder riding.
I didn't want to reinvent the entire suspension, just improve it a bit. Dampers are the best way to do that with non-rft tires imo. Check out Tire Rack's review of Konis and search this forum for feedback.

thanks for taking time to respond.appreciate it.if i wanted to lower the cat a tiny bit with either koni's,what aftermarket spring would you recommend?

[ToadHollow]

Eibach Pro kit springs @ about 3/4" all around OR H&R sports which I believe are closer to an inch drop.

Most here have the H&R sport springs .....

[cvc 22349a]

Originally Posted by 335fourdoor

thanks for taking time to respond.appreciate it.if i wanted to lower the cat a tiny bit with either koni's,what aftermarket spring would you recommend?

I'm not the right guy to ask. There's plenty of information and misinformation in this forum. I'd talk to techs who are enthusiasts/track their cars. If I were to lower the car a bit and increase spring rate, I'd go for the BMW performance suspension (don't know about those shocks) or Dinan stage 2; they're tuned systems. Search H&R sport w/Koni sports and Eibach w/Koni FSD if you just want to install springs/shocks. g/l

[335fourdoor]

Originally Posted by cvc 22349a

I'm not the right guy to ask. There's plenty of information and misinformation in this forum. I'd talk to techs who are enthusiasts/track their cars. If I were to lower the car a bit and increase spring rate, I'd go for the BMW performance suspension (don't know about those shocks) or Dinan stage 2; they're tuned systems. Search H&R sport w/Koni sports and Eibach w/Koni FSD if you just want to install springs/shocks. g/l

yes,the misinformation i can do without.this is not as easy as i thought.
all i'm looking for is a simple suspension set-up that would improve the stance and tighten up the inherent wallow that zsp follows.something inexpensive and reliable.i think i'm starting to lean toward h&r sports w/koni yellows,as the fsd's w/eibach seem to not be agressive enough.

[jayely1]

so pretty much if you dont want to change your spring or struts theres nothing else that would improve handling?

[200Duece]

There are other things that you can do but for the money the spring and shock/strut combo is the best way. there is no single part that you could add. The right tires add grip that improve handling. aftermarket springs with increased rate and being lower, enhance suspension geometry and improve handling. different shocks and struts can react more aggressively to keep the car/tires connected to the ground and better control the weight of the car which inmpoves handling. Larger Anti Sway bars also change and control the weight and actions of the car and it's suspension to keep the car connected to the ground and improve handling.

[chaz58]

YOu really, really have to define what you mean by "improve handling"

The e90 is the best handling car in its class, so for many people it has "the best handling".

However, your personal preferences may lean toward something else (i.e tracking the car, autocross).

What do you want?

Some people want the car to handle flatter (this is not necessarily better, but may "feel" better)
Some people want the car lower (again, this may or may not improve your handling)
Some people want the car to feel less floaty.


What do you want?


Shocks/struts are often the best place to start for better handling. You could do swaybars without the shocks, but you run the risk of overpowering your shocks (you are in effect increasing the spring rate), and of shortening the life span of the shocks. Still, it might give you what you want (if you know what you want).

Is there something about the handling of your car that bothers you? If not, why not leave it alone?

[AllBlackS]

I'm on ZSP springs, Koni FSD, H&R front/rear swaybars and Michelin PS2 non-runflats (stock 18 inch staggered size), and I am very very pleased with this set up. I often do fast twisty/rough road drives and they have held out extremely well. Tight, flat, super comfortable, and no wallow/float at highway speeds. I've taken my car to it's maximum speed, and it was rock solid!

I say if you don't track regularly- in which case you'll want coilovers, save your money and go with the FSDs/swaybars.

[marcel b]

A full customizable suspension indeed probably only makes sense if you track your car, or really push it at some nice twisty roads.
On my Z4M I had KW 3 suspension which was OK standard, and really good after I let some experts customize it and set up the geometry. Car was completely different afterwards
I will do the same now again. I will take KW Clubsport including the Clubsport Swaybars and let it set up by some experts. It also has adjustable camberplates in the front so you can get some more negative camber, which you need if you go with some real sticky tires like Michelin CUP or even better Dunlop Direzza's Such tires make an incredible difference in performance. On the downside, the wear more on the normal road, tire pressure is more important to keep an eye on, and in the rain they are more tricky. (in standing water) And then ofcourse you have the price.... (the Dunlops are quite loud as well, so these I would just use for tracking)

Another thing which has a positive impact on your handling / performance is a set of light alloy wheels. Reduces unspring mass makes the wheel turn (and break) easier and also let the follow the road better. So stay with 17 or 18 inch and don't go to 19 or 20 inch!

[chaz58]

+1. This will probably work well for the OP.

You could put the sway bars in first, but really - consider saving some $$$ up for the FSD instal later.

Originally Posted by AllBlackS

I'm on ZSP springs, Koni FSD, H&R front/rear swaybars and Michelin PS2 non-runflats (stock 18 inch staggered size), and I am very very pleased with this set up. I often do fast twisty/rough road drives and they have held out extremely well. Tight, flat, super comfortable, and no wallow/float at highway speeds. I've taken my car to it's maximum speed, and it was rock solid!

I say if you don't track regularly- in which case you'll want coilovers, save your money and go with the FSDs/swaybars.