[maui86]

call me stupid, but for some reason it didn't dawn on me that the dealer would hate this haha. so for those of you who have extra pipes...wont the methanol and water mix discolor the throttle body walls and what not? like they will know you were doing something funky with the discoloration on the walls haha. correct me if im wrong, just stating out something i remember seeing on another car. :-)

[maui86]

also to purchase this...is it done through active autowerks or snow performance?

[oddjob2021]

Originally Posted by maui86

also to purchase this...is it done through active autowerks or snow performance?

to purchase the kit, snow performance, for the tune I just got, active

[oddjob2021]

For the dyno and pictures of the print out, go back to page 1... i uploaded them to the first post, enjoy!

[Omar@ActiveAutowerke]

Car looks great, hope you are enjoying it. Thanks for giving us the opportunity to do the install for you and provide you with a custom tune.

Regards,

[oddjob2021]

Originally Posted by Active Autowerke

Car looks great, hope you are enjoying it. Thanks for giving us the opportunity to do the install for you and provide you with a custom tune.

Regards,

Thanks Omar, great to work with you guys too! So far the map is great, No limp, and no codes of any kind. I'll let you know if something does come up, but so far this looks like a tune you guys can constantly use

[maui86]

thanks...i'll hit up their site to check it out then. www.snowperformance.com i assume?

[ArmyBimmerDude]

Originally Posted by down4it

Well the problem is that methanol can eat metal so having it not mixed with water and sitting in your engine all the time could be bad. I dont know for a fact that you cannot mix methanol and gasoline together but until a pro told you that it was ok, i wouldnt do it...

Wow. If it eats through seals and metal, how long would one be looking at till there are serious problems? Approx. Great gains, but if its going to shorten the life of the engine significantly, no thanks.

[oddjob2021]

Originally Posted by maui86

thanks...i'll hit up their site to check it out then. www.snowperformance.com i assume?

.net, actually, but i'm sure you've figured that out by now :P

Originally Posted by ArmyBimmerDude

Wow. If it eats through seals and metal, how long would one be looking at till there are serious problems? Approx. Great gains, but if its going to shorten the life of the engine significantly, no thanks.

it only eats in complete liquid form, not atomized (by the nozzle and heat coming in) and only can eat if sitting on the walls not being blown out by other exhaust gases No real worries you gotta have unless you change your fuel to it! (Funny-cars use Nitro Methanol as fuel)

[gimp2x]

why do you keep comparing methanol injection with nitro meth fuel

they are NOWHERE near the same....its like comparing hydrogen peroxide and water

[oddjob2021]

Originally Posted by gimp2x

why do you keep comparing methanol injection with nitro meth fuel

they are NOWHERE near the same....its like comparing hydrogen peroxide and water

The reason why is two fold. First off you're exactly correct, h202 (hydrogen peroxide) has 1 more oxygen atom than h20 (water). As is the same with methanol and nitro meth. but... not only does snow performance offer nitro methanol on their site, but they say it gives an additional like 30 hp, which is amazing to me. I'm not daring enough to try that yet though. My friend with a stage 2 gli is and is putting in a nitrous kit too. but i wouldnt say they are nowhere near the same, they are similar, they have similar combustability (nitro is more) apples to oranges would be like xenon to iron, no?

[gimp2x]

Originally Posted by oddjob2021

The reason why is two fold. First off you're exactly correct, h202 (hydrogen peroxide) has 1 more oxygen atom than h20 (water). As is the same with methanol and nitro meth. but... not only does snow performance offer nitro methanol on their site, but they say it gives an additional like 30 hp, which is amazing to me. I'm not daring enough to try that yet though. My friend with a stage 2 gli is and is putting in a nitrous kit too. but i wouldnt say they are nowhere near the same, they are similar, they have similar combustability (nitro is more) apples to oranges would be like xenon to iron, no?

whoever decided that was a good idea is a pinhead, have you heard of pooling? happens with nitrous wet kits, it is VERY combustible and dangerous, this is how cars are set on fire

nitrometh is not for street use, for many reasons, cost is one, safety is another...it burns clear, rapid, and very hot, spraying it into an intake system with an electronic controlled throttle and a myriad of other traction control systems that could close the butterflies or cause an event that results in pooling is very bad, very bad

[down4it]

You said they ramped up the boost, are you running a boost guage? What psi max are you running now?

[BavarianBullet]

Originally Posted by gimp2x

whoever decided that was a good idea is a pinhead, have you heard of pooling? happens with nitrous wet kits, it is VERY combustible and dangerous, this is how cars are set on fire

nitrometh is not for street use, for many reasons, cost is one, safety is another...it burns clear, rapid, and very hot, spraying it into an intake system with an electronic controlled throttle and a myriad of other traction control systems that could close the butterflies or cause an event that results in pooling is very bad, very bad

A long time ago I went to an engine shop to work on something and they had a real engine test cell w/ water-brake dyno. I thought it was cool and I asked the owner if he ever had an engine go BOOM and really let go making a mess in the test cell.

He said "yeah but nothing spectacular. That only really happens on NitroMethane and we don't use that."

Any time you're squirting flammable liquids into your engine there's risk. That's why N20 can be quite scary.

Once during a 1/4mi event back in 2000 I saw this guy in a full fire suit running in what looked like a mostly stock mitsu eclipse and thought this guy must just be thinking really safe and over-dressing a bit as his car wasn't even in the 11s or barely so. Then on the next pass he came up to the line, launched, there was a big pop and 10+ft flames poured out of his front wheel wells! Huge fire underhood. He opened the door and rolled to the ground away from the car and was fine. That was a big N20 backfire, maybe a stuck solenoid.

Just image that happening when you step on it from a stoplight, you don't have a firesuit and your 50k car is shooting 10ft flames from all over.

IOW, I'm recommending passing on the NitroMethane too.

[oddjob2021]

Originally Posted by down4it

You said they ramped up the boost, are you running a boost guage? What psi max are you running now?

yes I'm running Rix's original mechanical boost gauge. Without it I'd be scared to hit the throttle in fear of over boosting or spiking. From what i see, I have a peak right after the 15 number (15.7 from the dyno graph) which seems correct to me

Originally Posted by BavarianBullet

A long time ago I went to an engine shop to ...

...IOW, I'm recommending passing on the NitroMethane too.

Ill pass on the message to him, however he works through a company/group called WolfCars. They specialize in VW and Audi and have had many suscessful nitrous kits work and have sold many. They never do a dry nitrous, and when they do wet, its always hand in hand with water/meth to keep things cool. But in anycase, I'll pass on the message, thanks for the story too bad for the guy though

[bdkevoIX]

Meth is not 116octane. Who would use c16 if meth was 116octane?

Meth itself in "meth injection" has no octane property. Meth reduces the temp of the air/fuel mixture which dramatically raises its detonation threhold. It burns along with the mixture, but a tiny amount compared to fuel.

You can run alot more aggressive timing on c16 than meth.

Just make sure the meth pump doesn't fail or the lines don't clog.
I've seen way too many engines go kaboom because of meth.

I would stick to good ol pump gas or c16 until a really advanced meth injection comes out.

[oddjob2021]

Originally Posted by bdkevoIX

Meth is not 116octane. Who would use c16 if meth was 116octane?

Meth itself has no octane property. Meth reduces the temp of the air/fuel mixture which dramatically raises its detonation threhold. It burns along with the mixture, but a tiny amount compared to fuel.

You can run alot more aggressive timing on c16 than meth.

Just make sure the meth pump doesn't fail or the lines don't clog.
I've seen way too many engines go kaboom because of meth.

I would stick to good ol pump gas or c16 until a really advanced meth injection comes out.

I usually dont like to come back at people, also dont like to use wikipedia as a reference but it seems who ever made the octane rating post knows whats hes talking about:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating

and to save you from searching, it says methanol is 113 excuse me i was off by 3

[bdkevoIX]

Originally Posted by oddjob2021

I usually dont like to come back at people, also dont like to use wikipedia as a reference but it seems who ever made the octane rating post knows whats hes talking about:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating

and to save you from searching, it says methanol is 113 excuse me i was off by 3

That's when the methanol is a source of fuel.
What is your gank tank filled with?
Certainly not full of methanol.

I'm not trying to pick a fight.

There are alot of success stories of meth as well as horror stories.

I just don't like the mechanism it sprays. It's just so crude in modern application.

[oddjob2021]

Originally Posted by bdkevoIX

That's when the methanol is a source of fuel.
What is your gank tank filled with?
Certainly not full of methanol.

I'm not trying to pick a fight.

There are alot of success stories of meth as well as horror stories.

I just don't like the mechanism it sprays. It's just so crude in modern application.

I can see where you're coming from. So far being a week with it, I cannot say one bad thing. In fact, I'm getting less CEL codes for my cats, which I am unsure if thats the new, custom tune or the water/meth LOL.

But as for my experiance so far? I think it should be on every single car! I even get better gas milage! 50-70 more miles per tank

[Turkishexpress]

Originally Posted by bdkevoIX

Meth is not 116octane. Who would use c16 if meth was 116octane?

Meth itself in "meth injection" has no octane property. Meth reduces the temp of the air/fuel mixture which dramatically raises its detonation threhold. It burns along with the mixture, but a tiny amount compared to fuel.

You can run alot more aggressive timing on c16 than meth.

Just make sure the meth pump doesn't fail or the lines don't clog.
I've seen way too many engines go kaboom because of meth.

I would stick to good ol pump gas or c16 until a really advanced meth injection comes out.

Finally a correct answer

[Turkishexpress]

Originally Posted by bdkevoIX

That's when the methanol is a source of fuel.
What is your gank tank filled with?
Certainly not full of methanol.

I'm not trying to pick a fight.

There are alot of success stories of meth as well as horror stories.

I just don't like the mechanism it sprays. It's just so crude in modern application.

Exactly, I think us post/current Evo guys have a little better understanding due to the usage of alky kits for a very long time. I always ran alky on the street and c16 at the track.

There is a common misconception that alky injection which is directly atomized into the intake manifold has some kind of an octane property since it is commonly used as a cheaper alternative to race gas. It really doesn't the way its used for our purposes. Its purpose is to lower intake temps. For nearly a decade alky has been very popular with turbo applications (i.e. 4G63s) for being a cheap alternative to race gas. However, it does come with its dangers. Your best insurance against any damage to your engine if pushing the boost envelope is a wideband afr gauge along with your eyes remembering to watch it closely whenever you're WOT. Furthermore, due to the nature of this set up and the sensitivity of wideband afr 02 sensors they need to be replaced often or will need to be re calibrated (which is available in some more expensive models).

BTW, I saw a couple of people mention nitromethane... Please don't mess with that stuff unless you have a full drag set up and wear a flame retardant suit while driving your car

[BavarianBullet]

FYI C16 is leaded race gas. Not exactly good for your oxygen sensors. It doesn't mean you can't run it but if you O2 sensors could talk they'd say "Ack! Get this stuff off of me!"