[Mike UK]

Don't think it matters what the speed limit is, as rush hour comes, your lucky if your doing 5mph on the m1/ m25 intersection

Have to say pet hate of mine is being stuck in traffic! I never try to drive in rush hour!

[NFS]

Originally Posted by mjh93sa

Apologies for the deviation, but.....

This particular junction (M5 J12) was upgraded from a restricted juntion to an all access juntion in 2002. In order to minimise the space taken (and cost) they elected to create a junction with a single over bridge and twin small roundabouts at either side. The slip roads would all then be single lanes with a hardshoulder. This was obviously chosen after extensive traffic studies and in view of the fact that work had just commenced on the building of more than 2500 homes less than half a mile away! :sad0147:

As a result the volume of traffic trying to use the junction far exceeds the capabilities of the junction. People were therefore having to queue on the hardshoulder to avoid coming to a full stop in the nearside lane of the motorway.

Shortly thereafter an annoymous police officer reported to the local radio that they had been ordered by their superior officers that they were to get down there and book anybody stopping on the hardshoulder, something that they felt would only make a dangerous situation lethal. Needless to say that press and public pressure stopped this from happening.

Under consistent mounting pressure even the police had to admit that the junction is just plain dangerous. "We would very much like to see it improved because of the volume of traffic it is carrying. It needs to be expanded. It has no hard shoulder to operate in or to put the static traffic on to while we try to clear the roundabouts above it," said Inspector John Pickersgill of Gloucestershire Police in 2005.

In 2006, following a fatal crash at the junction the coroner called for safety improvements and finally at the end of 2006 the Highways agency put their best brains to work to find a solution. So what did they do? Basically nick about 300yards of the hardshoulder to make into an exit lane and add some automatic signs to say "Queue ahead." The cost to the taxpayer? £350,000.

Even on the first evening after this work, traffic was queued back to the exit sign 2/3rds of a mile before the exit and well onto the hardshoulder. As time passes and more of the homes in the new development are occupied it just gets worse and worse and more and more dangerous.

They are now talaking about spending even more money to add traffic lights to the roundabouts at the junction in some desperate attempt to salvage something from a complete fiasco, when what they need to do is admit they screwed up and start again.

The whole thing is made even more dangerous by the fact that it is on a curve. Therefore you can be on the traffic queue before you even realise it. The entry slips are also quite short and descend steeply with little visibility for traffic either on the motorway or joining to see each other and so merge safely.

Given the number of near misses I have seen I always aim to go through in Lane 3, it's just so much safer.

Thanks for reading!

Matt.

Before and after shots:

That sort of roundabout arrangement is only ever going to slow down traffic exiting from the motorway.

The most dangerous place to be on a motorway is the back of a traffic queue, so I fully understand why people use the hard shoulder.

It's a strange one though, because as soon as a few people start doing it, everyone has to try.

It will also delay strategic improvements. If people queued on the carriageway the motorway would stop working and it would be a higher priority to improve. By queueing on the hardshoulder people fudge it and sort of make it work, so the expenditure gets delayed.

[Hotcoupe]

Yes I know Jct 12 on the M5 very well, as we have an office not far from there.
I have missed that turn off on more then one occasion,as the Q to get off can stretch back a considerable distance and catch you out.
They will HAVE to improve that particular junction in the very near future,as the amount of new housing going up in the vicinity is unbelievable.

[mjh93sa]

Originally Posted by Hotcoupe

Yes I know Jct 12 on the M5 very well, as we have an office not far from there.
I have missed that turn off on more then one occasion,as the Q to get off can stretch back a considerable distance and catch you out.
They will HAVE to improve that particular junction in the very near future,as the amount of new housing going up in the vicinity is unbelievable.

I live one side and work the other. Whilst I can use 12 instead of 13 I hardly ever do as it's just too damn dangerous.

[dxb335d]

Originally Posted by mjh93sa

I live one side and work the other. Whilst I can use 12 instead of 13 I hardly ever do as it's just too damn dangerous.

Why is it dangerous matt?

[mjh93sa]

Use a smilie Carlos, then I'll know you're joking. Otherwise I'll have to assume you didn't read the last (rather lengthy) post I made.

[dxb335d]

Originally Posted by mjh93sa

Use a smilie Carlos, then I'll know you're joking. Otherwise I'll have to assume you didn't read the last (rather lengthy) post I made.

I didnt read it Spose its best I go back and read it then?

[mjh93sa]

Somehow I thought you didn't.

Quick summarry: Highways screwed up the redesign of the junction so that you get a mile of queuing on the hardshoulder during rush hour. Plus idiots stopping and trying to join the queue too late. Add a bend and trucks doing 56mph and you have a recipe for a major accident.

Been like it for about 5 years and they are still scratching their collective backsides instead of fixing it.

[dxb335d]

Originally Posted by mjh93sa

Somehow I thought you didn't.

Quick summarry: Highways screwed up the redesign of the junction so that you get a mile of queuing on the hardshoulder during rush hour. Plus idiots stopping and trying to join the queue too late. Add a bend and trucks doing 56mph and you have a recipe for a major accident.

Been like it for about 5 years and they are still scratching their collective backsides instead of fixing it.

Not good Matt, is it a two lane motorway but its so packed people que on the hard shoulder also?

Maybe after a few fatal accidents they will sort something, or stick a speed camera

[mjh93sa]

It's three lane, but the design bottlenecks the traffic totally. If you are using the junction you are then faced with either queuing on the hardshoulder or the inside lane of the motorway. Faced with that decision everyone get's onto the hardshoulder and herd mentality takes over.

It took a couple of fatal accidents before they used some of the hard shoulder to create more slip road length. But it still isn't enough and people are just wainting for the big accident when an HGV takes out the queue.

The last thing it needs is a speed camera. Would you want one on your route to work?

[NFS]

Originally Posted by mjh93sa

It's three lane, but the design bottlenecks the traffic totally. If you are using the junction you are then faced with either queuing on the hardshoulder or the inside lane of the motorway. Faced with that decision everyone get's onto the hardshoulder and herd mentality takes over.

It took a couple of fatal accidents before they used some of the hard shoulder to create more slip road length. But it still isn't enough and people are just wainting for the big accident when an HGV takes out the queue.

The last thing it needs is a speed camera. Would you want one on your route to work?

One option would be a defined segregation of the inner lane for exit from 1/2 mile away.

This has worked well on the A38 exit from the M6 in Birmingham.

The inner lane is signed as A38 only from around 1 mile away and segregated initially with white lining, then collapsible bollards

It shrinks the carriageway, but preserves the hard shoulder for emergencies and protects the queue.