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      04-09-2018, 02:56 PM   #1
MrSweet1991
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Talking E90 330D Replacing Rod Bearings?

Hi All,

so car is off the road for a while and I intend to get some work done to the car. A little while back when I first purchased the car I had some "temporary" fix carried out on the sump as there was a small crack, fortunately, I've never had a drop of oil lost from the sump in the 12 months the fix was carried out but I'd like to replace it anyway.

The car has had a very small "thudding" noise for quite some time and I've always wondered whether it has anything to do with the rod bearings. I've listened to many videos to get familiar and it doesn't sound like it but nonetheless, it seems from videos on YouTube that you can actually check the rod bearings just by removing the sump. However, on the video I watched the guy had to set the timing up again and refer to the manual. I don't know if this is the same for all cars as this was a Toyota and a petrol.

So anyway, does anyone have any experience in doing this? I've got plenty of time to spend on the car so time is no issue. I know I need to drop the front subframe and support the engine from the top, but once I get the sump off is it a pretty simple procedure of removing the bearings and installing the new ones as stated on NewTis?

https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/e...arings/HqbUzCp

and also, if the rod bearings do show any signs of wear and it has "lightly" scuffed the crankshaft so that a fingernail could still run across the scratches does this "NewTis" table provide the different sizes of bearings that could be used if you buffed/sanded the scuffs out?

It would be great to see a video/writeup but videos for the E90 M57 seems pretty scarce.

Thanks all
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      04-09-2018, 04:42 PM   #2
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Normally if replacing bearing shells wouldn't the crankshaft need to be reground? You wouldn't be able to do that in situ, certainly not by sanding the crank. And if removing the crank you'd have to take the engine out.
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      04-09-2018, 06:25 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bishbosh View Post
Normally if replacing bearing shells wouldn't the crankshaft need to be reground? You wouldn't be able to do that in situ, certainly not by sanding the crank. And if removing the crank you'd have to take the engine out.
I'm watching a really long video of somebody replacing the rod bearings on an E92 M3 and the procedure itself doesn't look too bad. The only difference is they're replacing the rod bearings on the M3 because they apparently wear out and this M3 at 70k miles did have wear on the bearings but didn't have any symptoms so this bearing replacement was carried out as a preventative maintenance whereas im looking to venture into it because I can already hear a slight knock. But what I'm not sure of is, can the very early signs (very light knock) be due to the slight clearance on worn bearings or does the knock mean some sort of distortion has to have been done to the shell/rod?

Just for anyone curious as it is a good and detailed video:

https://youtu.be/G8yZgOW-14M

Last edited by MrSweet1991; 04-09-2018 at 10:21 PM.
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      04-10-2018, 02:49 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSweet1991 View Post
But what I'm not sure of is, can the very early signs (very light knock) be due to the slight clearance on worn bearings or does the knock mean some sort of distortion has to have been done to the shell/rod?
There will always be a slight clearance which needs to be within tolerances. When running, the crankshaft will be effectively suspended on a film of oil under pressure. I really don't know if there will be any distortion.

If the crank isn't damaged and it's only the conrod shells you'll be replacing then it's doable without taking the engine out. Will you be doing this job in a garage? I wouldn't dare do this on my driveway!
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      04-10-2018, 03:41 AM   #5
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Nsver heard of a 330d needing rod bearings. Sure, replace the sump pan, but I wouldn't worry about the rod bearings. The thump is something that many 330d's seem to exhibit. I've had 8 of them over the years. Could be the pressure converter needing to be replaced? Something relatively easy. I'd certainly be wary about getting into rod bearing replacement with no actual signs of failure present.
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      04-10-2018, 07:25 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattOz View Post
Could be the pressure converter needing to be replaced?
+1

Modern BMW six cylinder engine run at very high fuel pressures and the high pressure fuel pump can exhibit a rhythmic 'thumping' noise which you can actually feel through the fuel lines. Could well be normal. I'd get a reliable indy to have a listen before you start on rod bearings - given that failures are almost unknown on your engine...
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      04-10-2018, 09:36 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bishbosh View Post
There will always be a slight clearance which needs to be within tolerances. When running, the crankshaft will be effectively suspended on a film of oil under pressure. I really don't know if there will be any distortion.

If the crank isn't damaged and it's only the conrod shells you'll be replacing then it's doable without taking the engine out. Will you be doing this job in a garage? I wouldn't dare do this on my driveway!
Hi mate,

My concern is, the shells we speak of could only be replaced by stripping the engine if I'm not mistaken? The one half of the shell comes away by removing the bolts but the top shell is actually the rod connected to the piston? That's why I'm curious whether the knock could be due to worn bearings alone as opposed to the shells? And you know mate I actually would do it on the drive, all my neighbours have bloody garages and one of them stores Samosas, coke and other things while the other uses it as storage.. I'm like the only person who would really benefit from having one lol. Thanks for the reply as well they're always appreciated!
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      04-10-2018, 09:42 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattOz View Post
Nsver heard of a 330d needing rod bearings. Sure, replace the sump pan, but I wouldn't worry about the rod bearings. The thump is something that many 330d's seem to exhibit. I've had 8 of them over the years. Could be the pressure converter needing to be replaced? Something relatively easy. I'd certainly be wary about getting into rod bearing replacement with no actual signs of failure present.
I sure hope so! But here's the issue. When I purchased the car from the dealership it had a slight oil leak, he assured me it's very minor and nothing to worry about, it turned out to be the a crack in the sump.. swirl flaps where leaking oil, vacuum pump was leaking oil slightly so what's the odds the chap never really cared about the car and at some stage it did run low on oil? Then I take into account other factors like the power steering fluid was brown and the coolant was of the red type where BMW should be blue.. so I then look at it as if he couldn't keep up with the bare minimum maintenance what's the odds they didn't look after it.. I'll remain optimistic but it plays on my mind. And thank you for the reply it's appreciated! I'm going to do a video and maybe see what you guys think, you do have to really try hard to filter out the other noises as there's the hydraulic lifter tapping noises and the thudding noise is pretty muffled so it take a a lot of concentration lol
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      04-10-2018, 09:45 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil325i View Post
+1

Modern BMW six cylinder engine run at very high fuel pressures and the high pressure fuel pump can exhibit a rhythmic 'thumping' noise which you can actually feel through the fuel lines. Could well be normal. I'd get a reliable indy to have a listen before you start on rod bearings - given that failures are almost unknown on your engine...
Hi mate,

I'll sure look into the fuel pump and see if I can feel it through the fuel lines. I'll research where these are but if you have any time would you be able to point me in the right direction? I took it to a BMW specialist a few months back and he couldn't hear the noise, and to be honest I couldn't really hear it but he said he wouldn't be concerned about anything yet but the turbo boost pressure is off.. about 2 weeks later the turbo seals collapsed so he was spot on in that respect but I can't ignore the noise.. I need to know what it is but it's off the road at the moment so I can only try things myself for now.. I'll get a video later and see what you guys think.
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      04-12-2018, 01:16 PM   #10
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Hi All,

I took this video this morning, I had little time to do the video as I had to go out and unbelievably it was very hard to pick the sound up. In my opinion, the sound can be heard from say 40 seconds into the video. It's seriously hard to drown out the turbo spool and tapping of the hydraulic lifters and focus on the dull thudding noise when I'm recording at the engine but hopefully it's clear at 40 seconds, someone can hear it.


Last edited by MrSweet1991; 04-13-2018 at 09:13 AM. Reason: URL Fixed
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      04-13-2018, 09:28 AM   #11
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Sounds alright to me. The engine appears to be smooth revving and certainly not shaking like it might if something was out of balance. I'd still be interested in changing the pressure converter first (along with swirl flaps as it's an intake manifold off job) and seeing if the thud went away.
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      04-13-2018, 01:54 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattOz View Post
Sounds alright to me. The engine appears to be smooth revving and certainly not shaking like it might if something was out of balance. I'd still be interested in changing the pressure converter first (along with swirl flaps as it's an intake manifold off job) and seeing if the thud went away.
Hi mate, I've cleaned the intake manifold and the EGR as well as blanking the swirl flaps, now something interesting I just discovered is my pressure converter has been removed. I can only assume this may have something to do with the remap as the EGR is coded out? I'll have to have a look now about whether the removal of the pressure converter is normal when doing a remap otherwise I'm not sure what to say, ISTA D has never threw anything up about that either.



Update

Just realised it's located under the intake manifold, I thought it was supposed to be bolted just above the alternator where there's two holes for something.. what's supposed to be there anyway while I'm on the subject.

Last edited by MrSweet1991; 04-13-2018 at 02:05 PM.
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      04-13-2018, 06:12 PM   #13
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You're right, the pressure converter is back right, under the intake manifold. Bit of a pain to get at, but worth a look at.
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      04-14-2018, 07:14 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattOz View Post
You're right, the pressure converter is back right, under the intake manifold. Bit of a pain to get at, but worth a look at.
So out of curiosity mate, what makes you think the pressure converter maybe to do with the dull thudding noise I can here? I've never really looked into the pressure converter until yesterday when you mentioned it and most pressure converter failure symptoms involve the "duck" noise people refer to and it can also mess with the turbo I believe but I can't quite join the dots on how it may cause the thudding noise?

Do you also know if it's possible to check the pressure converter in ISTA D or INPA, as usual I will look to see if this is possible myself but if you did know how to do it and it wasn't too much trouble it would be appreciated of course
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      04-14-2018, 10:54 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSweet1991 View Post
I thought it was supposed to be bolted just above the alternator where there's two holes for something.. what's supposed to be there anyway while I'm on the subject.
Have a browse on RealOEM and you might spot what's supposed to be mounted there...

http://www.realoem.com/
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      04-14-2018, 10:56 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil325i View Post
Have a browse on RealOEM and you might spot what's supposed to be mounted there...

http://www.realoem.com/
I believe it's actually a mounting point for hoisting or holding the engine, explains why nothing is there
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      04-14-2018, 03:59 PM   #17
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The pressure converter can thud or quack. Given that the bottom end is unlikely to be shot, I'd look at the pressure converter. I could be wide of the mark, but it seems plausible.
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      04-16-2018, 04:18 AM   #18
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Agree with MattOz. Noticed a sound like bass from the subs on under the front passenger seat but when the stereo was not on. Car seemed to drive fine. Coulnt find anything on internet at the time but theres lots of info now. Took few years for me to figure out it was the egr pressure converter. It can thud for years then start quacking. Finally renewed it last summer whilst deflapping as its a inlet manifold off job. Was about 55gbp if i recall fot a pierburg one
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      04-16-2018, 06:14 AM   #19
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That sounds like vac pump rattle to me, they all do it. its deffo not bottom end, take the oil filler cap off if it rattles really bad its the vac pump and nothing to worry about.
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      04-17-2018, 04:11 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RS DAVE View Post
That sounds like vac pump rattle to me, they all do it. its deffo not bottom end, take the oil filler cap off if it rattles really bad its the vac pump and nothing to worry about.
Hi Dave,

Thanks for the input, it's not actually the rattle I'm concerned about, you are right and the brake vacuum pump does rattle and I also believe the hydraulic lifter are ticking
But 40 seconds into the video when I go to the exhaust you can hear the turning noise I'm talking about, at the start of the video the noise is really drummed out with all the rattle lol.
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      04-19-2018, 05:54 AM   #21
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The car sounds fine. My car makes a thumping noise after a drive which sounds like music from outside the car but its coming from the engine.
Ive got my inlet manifold off at the minute as my swirl flaps, vacuum pump and various other seals are slightly leaking and Im going to do the pressure converter too as from reading dozens of articles on it I think this is the cause.
These M57 engines are supposed to be bomb proof so Id doubt very much there's anything wrong with the bottom end.
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      04-19-2018, 08:13 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adammcf View Post
The car sounds fine. My car makes a thumping noise after a drive which sounds like music from outside the car but its coming from the engine.
Ive got my inlet manifold off at the minute as my swirl flaps, vacuum pump and various other seals are slightly leaking and Im going to do the pressure converter too as from reading dozens of articles on it I think this is the cause.
These M57 engines are supposed to be bomb proof so Id doubt very much there's anything wrong with the bottom end.
Hi Adam,

It's great that you're getting a lot done while the manifold is off. Do let me know if the thumping noise changes after the pressure converter is changed. How are your glow plugs and relay? Also, it might be worth having a quick check of the cylinder head connector, the gasket has a tendency to fail and it seeps coolant.. it's only 18 for the cylinder head connector and gasket from bmw. Just thought it was worth mentioning, my car is going to be insured for a day to get the tracking done, it's not the tracking I want really though it's to see if the rear wheel that I hit off a kurb in the snow can be put back straight or whether the arm or sub frame has kinked. While it's on the ramp I'm going to have a good listen right by the sump to see if the noise is louder and I'll try to get a video.
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