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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum
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Tuner Says jb3/4 is horrid?!?!
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06-07-2012, 10:54 AM | #23 |
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LOVE my JB4... Can not beat the bang for buck. And get a CDV (clutch delete valve) something like 20$ bucks will cure your hard 1-2 shift... it did for me! Enjoy the beast!
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06-07-2012, 10:56 AM | #24 | |
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that tune would cost me $895 for the cobb + $1000 for him. he'd also need the car for 3 days and that i should expect 200-400 miles on it to be put on. sorry, but cobb opened up a bag of potential abuse my these asshats.
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06-07-2012, 11:03 AM | #25 |
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Tunes work on this platform that wouldn't work(ie grenaded engines) on other platform due to the excellent knock detection/deterrent system. Riding the knock sensor and O2 sensor biasing/rail pressure manipulation worked in the early days but there are good options available now.
Give your tuner a try and see how it goes. |
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06-07-2012, 11:04 AM | #26 |
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To be fair, most tuners creating custom flash maps refer to both piggybacks as junk.
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06-07-2012, 11:10 AM | #27 | |
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Given that the EJ series Subaru motors aren't exceptionally stout, a Subaru tuner (such as myself) would immediately disregard any tuning "solution" that didnt over ignition timing control. In fact, I'd say that any actual tuner (of any platform) would feel the same way. It just so happens that the n54/msd80/81 is tolerant of what can only be described as incomplete tuning. |
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06-07-2012, 11:11 AM | #28 |
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Just follow the money trail, with a JB4 you don't need a tuner to get 400whp.
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06-07-2012, 11:21 AM | #29 | |
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As mentioned by Shiv from Vishnu, if you were to rely on the knock sensors to control ignition you would have a yard sale of parts as the subaru motors are not tolerant of knock abuse and their electronics can't reduce ignition timing like the BMW DME. The BMW DME and it's knock detection is far superior to other platforms, so one can get away with simply raising boost and adding fuel, to a certain extent. Try that on other platforms and you will be rebuilding motors on a daily basis. Last edited by E3r2E9r; 06-07-2012 at 11:30 AM.. |
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06-07-2012, 11:28 AM | #30 | |
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Before I get an earful about how the plug-in systems do this w/o forcing you to spend an additional $xxx, I know. |
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06-07-2012, 11:58 AM | #31 | |
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06-07-2012, 12:04 PM | #32 | |
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06-07-2012, 12:29 PM | #33 | |
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Mike |
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06-07-2012, 12:53 PM | #34 |
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i am with JB since day one very happy no issues.
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06-07-2012, 01:39 PM | #35 |
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Correct me if I'm wrong but that is a separate unit that needs to be purchased? What percentage of people actually use it? I never here much talk about it. How does one know how much ignition to reduce? CPS module is great but someone would still need to tune it and I doubt many go through the motions to accurately dial it in. I've done some research but I dont hear many people tweaking their CPS modules, correct me if I'm wrong, I'm willing to listen.
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06-07-2012, 01:55 PM | #36 |
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Personally i think jb4 and procede work but they dont fit my needs, i want a system that will allow me to add timing, take away timing and have full control of the system (including fuel pressure etc) thats why you will see cobb start exploding in sales as soon as end user tuning is available
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06-07-2012, 01:59 PM | #37 | |
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planning on going with your own custom single turbo or twin upgrade? |
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06-07-2012, 02:01 PM | #38 | |
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BMS has always been clear that the benefits with CPS are minimal on pump gas and nonexistent with meth but many come from other platforms like Subus where it's absolutely necessary. The concept of a truly superb adaptive ignition system and what BMW has done with it are foreign to them. So it's easier to just let those customers run the CPS module so they can feel warm and fuzzy. Normally it's only suggested for those with large turbos or nitrous, those running exceptionally poor fuel quality, or those who want to run a boost profile that dramatically differs in shape from the OEM profile. Mike |
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06-07-2012, 02:03 PM | #39 |
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Sorry but a whole lot of nonsense here.
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06-07-2012, 02:17 PM | #40 |
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I have the JB4 and love it. The way it changes how the car drives is awesome and i also drive my car every day so driveability is not an issue.
In regards to the hard first to second shift, all 6mt 335's do that until you delete the clutch delay valve. Search CDV, CDV delete, CDV mod, or clutch delay valve and you'll understand what i'm talking about.
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06-07-2012, 02:26 PM | #41 |
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Make a claim and use verifiable proof to support your argument without relying on hearsay, sweeping generalizations and proof by verbosity.
If A is true in B, it does not mean that A is true in C. I'm sure most of us would appreciate a well thought out argument by yourself proving why ignition control is a necessary function for a tune to possess for the vast majority of people.
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06-07-2012, 02:33 PM | #42 |
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Funny how tuners knock the JB but when they tune "correctly", they either don't make numbers that are as high, or make much lower numbers "mod for mod". I can't think of any blown or damaged engine threads from JB since I joined this site.
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06-07-2012, 02:36 PM | #43 | |
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I think the BMS tuning line up would greatly benefit from this tuned ignition not just from a mechanical standpoint but from marketing and tuning stand point. People want to know all the bases are covered in a tune, I think they are long over due but glad to see there is improvements being made. The CPS add on is great but I would venture to say the majority wouldnt understand or see the benefit, however, if they knew correct tuning theory and practices they would think twice about it. You will have to excuse my stretches for excellent tuning but you have to understand I come from a background where I understand engine tuning and therefore seek the best and ideal way. Thanks for clearing that up. |
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06-07-2012, 02:40 PM | #44 | |
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For instance, when I tuned my last car myself, I didn't have a sophisticated DME to back me up, if my car knocked, it did not reduce ignition. So if I asked for 20 degrees ignition up top, it gave it to me. A conservative approach might not make exactly the same power, but you will know day in and day out it will be consistent and through different weather changes and even elevations should be acceptable/safe/reliable. One could easily tune to be on the verge of knock but with a ECU that doesnt adapt like this BMW platform if the conditions arent the same as the day you tuned, you will be calling a tow truck to go home. |
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