[Turkish Mafia]

I recently brought my 2007 E92 335i into a shop I hadn't been before and ran into a few surprises. I would like some advice and thoughts please.

While taking the oil pan off, several screws broke in half in their housing. When the oil pan was off, two screws broken in half were found INSIDE the oil pan. The oil pump, was missing 2 of 3 screws which explained the broken screws inside the oil pan.

I was told by the shop that someone must have overtightened the screws previously and possibly tampered with the engine without my knowledge.

I have had my car since brand new, 4 miles on the odometer. I have never left my car for service overnight except for turbo replacement in which the car was left in service for only 24 hours. There are no records indicating that the oil pan or oil pump were touched - unless it was done without documentation and without my knowledge.

Anyone have thoughts regarding this issue? Seen anything like this?

[pruettfan]

Originally Posted by Turkish Mafia

I recently brought my 2007 E92 335i into a shop I hadn't been before and ran into a few surprises. I would like some advice and thoughts please.

While taking the oil pan off, several screws broke in half in their housing. When the oil pan was off, two screws broken in half were found INSIDE the oil pan. The oil pump, was missing 2 of 3 screws which explained the broken screws inside the oil pan.

I was told by the shop that someone must have overtightened the screws previously and possibly tampered with the engine without my knowledge.

I have had my car since brand new, 4 miles on the odometer. I have never left my car for service overnight except for turbo replacement in which the car was left in service for only 24 hours. There are no records indicating that the oil pan or oil pump were touched - unless it was done without documentation and without my knowledge.

Anyone have thoughts regarding this issue? Seen anything like this?

That techs explanation makes no sense. Unless there is a specific job they can point to that the oil pump was worked on there is no chance anyone would touch it for any other job. The aluminum bolts that BMW uses do have a tendency to break from time to time, I have not heard of the oil pump being an issue but I have heard of bolts in the heads and valve covers breaking. I know your car is beyond warranty (unless you have an extended) but since you are the original owner I would call BMW customer care and discuss the issue with them. For original owners they will often times take care of all or a portion of the costs for a strange component failure like this.

[feuer]

24h turbo replacement? anyhow, what was the reason for this particular shop to be removing the oil pan. Fill us in on that first.

[Turkish Mafia]

Originally Posted by feuer

24h turbo replacement? anyhow, what was the reason for this particular shop to be removing the oil pan. Fill us in on that first.

Original problem was oil leak from oil pan.

I agree that the the shop's explanation doesn't make sense. Could the shop have done it purposefully for some devious reason? I've already caught a few subtle lies about small things, so I don't particularly trust this shop. Nothing I can prove at the moment though.

Why would the oil pump even need to be removed?

[Needbmwpartzz]

I would like to see the broken bolt...the piece and remnants left in threads.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by Turkish Mafia

Original problem was oil leak from oil pan.

I agree that the the shop's explanation doesn't make sense. Could the shop have done it purposefully for some devious reason? I've already caught a few subtle lies about small things, so I don't particularly trust this shop. Nothing I can prove at the moment though.

Why would the oil pump even need to be removed?

There is no need to remove the oil pump for oil pan gasket. Also, shop would not break the bolts intentionally. They might just tell you you need work done that you don't actually need. What I think happens is misunderstanding due to possible lack of communication within the shop personnel combined with bad luck on their end. The tech was thinking they are doing something else on your engine, went with the impact driver and broke off some bolts in the process.

[Turkish Mafia]

Originally Posted by feuer

There is no need to remove the oil pump for oil pan gasket. Also, shop would not break the bolts intentionally. They might just tell you you need work done that you don't actually need. What I think happens is misunderstanding due to possible lack of communication within the shop personnel combined with bad luck on their end. The tech was thinking they are doing something else on your engine, went with the impact driver and broke off some bolts in the process.

Impact-driver wasn't used. Also, I was told by the shop that supposedly one of the bolts outside of the oil pan was held together with red silicone suggesting that it broke in the housing during a previous repair and was put back together haphazardly.

Again though, the oil pan was never touched to my knowledge and I am first owner...

Very frustrating issue.

The oil pump is what bothers me most. Have I really been driving with one bolt holding the oil pump all this time (according to the shop)? Or, is the shop lying to me for some reason I can't figure out?

[mxchris727]

I know that M60 engines have the oil pump bolt issue due to vibration. They would most of the time just back out rather than breaking. Maybe the car used to be a track car and was consistently at redline.

[Turkish Mafia]

Originally Posted by mxchris727

I know that M60 engines have the oil pump bolt issue due to vibration. They would most of the time just back out rather than breaking. Maybe the car used to be a track car and was consistently at redline.

I'm first owner. Never tracked.

[bmw325i-06]

Hi there,

while replacing my oil pan gasket on '06 325i, I also found a broken oil pump bolt inside the oil pan with half of it still inside. I proceeded to remove the rest of the bold holding the pump in place and one broke of while being taken out. to my luck it didn't snap off inside.
Now my big question is how do I remove the oil pump so that I can extract the broken bolt from the block???
I can't seem to be able to remove the oil pump sprocket off the pump so that I can take the chain off of it thus removing the pump...any help is much appreciated!

Thanks!

[Turkish Mafia]

Originally Posted by bmw325i-06

Hi there,

while replacing my oil pan gasket on '06 325i, I also found a broken oil pump bolt inside the oil pan with half of it still inside. I proceeded to remove the rest of the bold holding the pump in place and one broke of while being taken out. to my luck it didn't snap off inside.
Now my big question is how do I remove the oil pump so that I can extract the broken bolt from the block???
I can't seem to be able to remove the oil pump sprocket off the pump so that I can take the chain off of it thus removing the pump...any help is much appreciated!

Thanks!

Hi sorry for late reply. Are you first owner? Any work done on the oil pan gasket and oil pump previously? Did you ever resolve this?

[JuniorB]

I've removed the oil pump on my n54, so ill let you know what I saw. The pump is held in by 3 bolts, and holds a sprocket that is spun by the chain. If you broke two bolts, the vibration would have knocked the pump in the pan and it would of been major damage. I also found that there not super tight and should come right out. Broken bolts on any pan will happen, trans, or oil. The heat, weather, age and metal, all play a role. You may be able to skip over one of them, drilling it out and tapping is more work than needed. There are so many of them, that it wouldn't make a difference. I found that BMW uses no silicone on this engine, make sure there are no groves in the case on the pump from hitting the crank.

[07lilredwagon]

I have never heard of this one...broken oil pan bolts, yes...(Ill bet somewhere along the line, someone tried to just tighten some of your oil pan bolts due to that leak starting some time ago....they took their chances with those whimpy TTY bolts) but I have never heard of the oil pump bolts breaking.....

It is possible, though from the sound of things...either way, you got really lucky and found this in time. you need to put your own eyes on the busted parts and make an assessment. ...then just make the best decision you can

If the bolts are broken, I would replace ALL 3 with new bolts for peace of mind.

ask the mechanic if he will please chase the threads for the oil pan bolts...then lube them lightly and install. those TTY bolts suck in my opinion....

JP

[Vandalle]

Hey folks, I need some expert advise on what happened to my precious E92. Bought it from the dealership in 2014, and drove it lightly, never tracked it, and it barely has 20,000 Kms on it. Every service was done at the dealership and that has been mostly oil changes and new tires every now and then.

All of a sudden, a month ago, my brother took it for a spin and it stalled on him on the highway. He pulled over and the car had to be towed to the dealership.

Long story short, the dealership said the engine won’t crank and asked me to pay roughly 2k to open it up. They sent me pictures of what they found. Please see attached pics. Crank and piston bores shot, and they found a key and a lozenge wrapper inside the oil pump or pan; I can’t figure it out because I don’t know the parts exactly.

Question is: how would something like that be where it is based on the pictures? Could someone sabotage me by opening the oil cap under the hood and throw a key and a wrapper in there? And if they did, would it make it’s way into what you see in the pictures? I’m devastated to say the least and don’t know if I should get the police involved to do a criminal investigation. But first I’d like some expert opinion on how that thing found it’s way in there if you guys know engine and oil parts and how they work. Appreciate your help folks.

[nsjames]

your engine suffered from oil starvation.
it's wasted.

if an oil return passage to the block was large enough to pass the key, then yes, a key in the oil filler would let it get to the pan.

[Vandalle]

Originally Posted by nsjames

your engine suffered from oil starvation.
it's wasted.

if an oil return passage to the block was large enough to pass the key, then yes, a key in the oil filler would let it get to the pan.

So in the picture, the key is sitting in an oil return passage? Can you describe or point me to a picture that shows the different components, chambers, and pipes oil flows through in this engine? And isn’t there a mesh to trap objects pouring into the engine oil intake?

[relative4]

You may get more useful insights from the forum relevant to that engine.

Criminal investigation into whom? Got a jilted ex? Maybe that's the key they didn't give you back when you broke up. What's their favorite brand of "lozenge"?

[nsjames]

in the picture that key and wrapper is sucked into an oil pump pickup.

that restriction would make it hard for the pump to suck oil from the pan. You then lose oil pressure, or get aerated oil. Either way it's real bad for all the bearings. It's most definitely the reason that your crank and bearings are smoked.

how it got down in there is the mystery.
I'm not familiar enough with the v8 engines to know about the oil passages.
on my n52 there is no foreign object screen on the oil fill. You open it up and see valvetrain.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by nsjames

I'm not familiar enough with the v8 engines to know about the oil passages.
on my n52 there is no foreign object screen on the oil fill. You open it up and see valvetrain.

I would say that's with all cars almost tbh.

[Vandalle]

Thank you all for your help. I better post this where folks who know S65 engines dwell. Much appreciated.

[gbalthrop]

Originally Posted by Vandalle

...Can you describe or point me to a picture that shows the different components, chambers, and pipes oil flows through in this engine?

WHAT engine is that??? I thought you said "your E92 died"? I didn't realize BMW ever put a DOHC V8 in an E92.

WHAT exactly is that part that the key & wrapper are stuck in? Isn't the Oil Pickup & Strainer attached to the tube at the rear of the pan which then splits into TWO tubes? Are there TWO oil pumps on that engine?

Where the key & wrapper are can't be oil pickup. It HAS to be a vent or return related to the oil pumps driven off the lower end of the timing chain on either side. Never worked on a DOHC V8, so can't help.

George

[Biginboca]

Originally Posted by gbalthrop

WHAT engine is that??? I thought you said "your E92 died"? I didn't realize BMW ever put a DOHC V8 in an E92.

WHAT exactly is that part that the key & wrapper are stuck in? Isn't the Oil Pickup & Strainer attached to the tube at the rear of the pan which then splits into TWO tubes? Are there TWO oil pumps on that engine?

Where the key & wrapper are can't be oil pickup. It HAS to be a vent or return related to the oil pumps driven off the lower end of the timing chain on either side. Never worked on a DOHC V8, so can't help.

George

George,

That’s a e92m3 with a s65 motor. It has a front and rear oil pick up instead of a dry sump.

He should have posted on the m3 forum.