[chris330D]

I've read a lot of threads about jacking up the car. Seems people use either an E46 jack or a trolley jack. I want to get a trolley jack but am not sure where is best to jeck the car. I have read about the jacking points and using wood or buying a widget to fit the cups but when you go to a tyre place they seem to just run the jack under the car and lift I have bought a spare set of MV3s, thanks Jamie, and want to paint the hubs and have a set of winter tyres, got fed up with my car pretending to be bambi on ice this winter Any thoughts/recommendations appreciated.

[fastloop]

This has been discussed a number of times even recently, but have a look on eBay or CostCo for a cheap low entry jack. You can usually pick one up for ~£80-90. You'll need to look for one with a flat cup or buy an adapter/make your own to avoid crushing the jacking point.

Have a look at the links below:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=375053

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=309879

[chris330D]

Sorry, that was my point. You read all these posts about the correct lifting points and adapters etc etc but when you go to a tyre place they seem to shove a trolley jack under the car and just lift Thanks for the point about a flat cup, had a look at machine mart and they have dozens of different jacks!!

[doughboy]

Trolley jacks have a large saucer shaped lifting cup which will 'cup' the plastic jacking points without damage.

Tyre places do look where they put the jacks!

If you want a small jack, you'll need to get a pukka BMW jack or a widget to hit the jack point.

[fastloop]

Originally Posted by chris330D

Sorry, that was my point. You read all these posts about the correct lifting points and adapters etc etc but when you go to a tyre place they seem to shove a trolley jack under the car and just lift Thanks for the point about a flat cup, had a look at machine mart and they have dozens of different jacks!!

Most cars have similar lifting points and with the amount of cars that a tyre place see's everyday then it may appear that they just shove it in there, but as Mike said the do look and its just experience.

Using the factory lifting points is the easy part... the problem is when you want to use axle stands and only have a trolley jack? How do you do this when the only obvious lifting point are the factory jack points. The trick is to use the front and rear center lifting points as mentioned in the TIS doc. However you need a pretty low jack to reach the front one.

[daz72]

I recently took my winter wheels off, painted the hubs callipers and refitted my standard/summer wheels. Did the fronts first, then the rears.

I did a bit of research on here and on other boards and came up with the solution.

To get the front up I jacked up the car on the off-side rear jacking point until both wheels were in the air and high enough to get an axle stand under the front jacking point. Then repeated the process on the near-side of the car.

To get the rear up on stands, repeat - jacking up at the front sill jacking point.

I did attempt to jack the rear of the car up using the centre point in front of the differential - but the jack was approaching it's height limit way before there was anywhere near enough clearance to get stands under the side jack points.

Got myself a Clarke 1.25 ton aluminium 'racing' trolley jack from Machine Mart for about £90. Nice big cushioned lifting pad and plenty low enough to get under the jacking points. If you are still nervous about lifting directly on the jacking point 'boxes' cut a few pieces of wood to fit inside them - 2.25"x1.25"x0.75" if I remember correctly. One for the jack and one for each of the axle stands.

The Sealey VS Series Chrome Axle Stands (2 ton) are the lowest* I've been able to find. Good quality too. * minimizes the height you need to lift the car

The Sealey 1.25 ton low entry aluminium trolley jack at DemonTweeks looks identical to the Clarke one & has identical spec. With the 10% discount they are currently offering it works out about the same price.

Best get yourself a set of Sealey rubber wheel chocks too.

[chris330D]

Thanks, just what I was looking for. Have seen the Clarke jack on Machine Mart and it looked good. What winter tyres were you using? Have been looking at a set of Cintinetal Contiwintercontact TS810 Sport. I have a spare set of MV3s and there are not many out there that do 255/35 18" that I have found.

[daz72]

Through the winter I've been running Vredestein Wintrac Xtremes (205/55/16 94V XL) on 16" cross-spoke BMW alloys (style 42) off an E46. (£300 on Ebay)

Smaller wheels will provide better handling in winter conditions since they allow for the fitment of a higher profile tyre. This in turn allows for more flex in the tyre wall, meaning more of the tread remains more firmly in contact with the road. Smaller wheels will also allow for the fitment of narrower tyres which will give better grip and traction in snow and ice since the weight of the vehicle is spread over a smaller contact area.

A winter tyre, will of course perform better than summer tyre whatever fitted on the same wheel due to being a softer compound (allowing more flex) and differfnet type of tread (more able to cut into snow/ice). But I wouldn't imagine that you'll see a huge improvement without reducing the wheels down from 18"s. 17"s will make a difference. 16"s would be better.

These are the reasons I would imagine that you have not been able to find much of a choice of winter tyres to fit the MV3s. They are big tyres with a relatively large footprint beneath a short, inflexible tyre wall.

The BMW standard setup is pretty much the opposite of everything you would want from a car geared up to perform well in snow & ice. Changing the wheels addresses some of these defficiencies.
- Driven wheels are at the rear means there is very little weight over them (add bags of sand)
- Wide tyres on the driven wheels mean what little weight is over them is spread. Tyres not therefore inclined to cut into snow/ice
- Low profile tyres offering little flex in the tyre wall. When cornering and turning, some of the tread will lift from, or at least lose traction with the road.

[doughboy]

Originally Posted by chris330D

What winter tyres were you using? Have been looking at a set of Cintinetal Contiwintercontact TS810 Sport. I have a spare set of MV3s and there are not many out there that do 255/35 18" that I have found.

For this very reason I bought a set of 4 8Jx18 MV3 reps for £300 new, great quality, look BETTER the the OE ones as the finish is a bit brighter. Also sticking with OE style means no insurance implications. If I put on a set of rusty 16" steels my insurer still wanted £125 for 'modified wheels' - the same price as fitting a set of 20" bling rims!! WTF?

I went for 8J width all round, this opens up a whole new world of winter tyres as you can get 4 off 225/40/18 to use all round. This also means I can rotate front to rear when they wear too.

I plumped for Wintrac Extremes (225/40/18 all round) - They are incredible - no other words to describe them. 1 in 4 Hill starts on packed snow - no problem, braking on pack snow - no problem. Even deep slush doesn't effect grip any more than water would - awesome. And cold wet / grip is in another world too.

In the winter, even in my 335i, you don't notice the 1/2 width decrease on the rear. You can barely tell the difference visually either.

Top tip IMO.

RE Jacking, I just bought the BMW jack kit, £80 but a great jack - the best quality sturdy scissor jack I've ever used. You can lift both wheels on one side off the ground in one go by using the rear jack point and keep lifting the rear until when its about 2" clear the front lifts too. Make sure you chock the car on the other side first.

[rsmallwo]

I have a rather cheap/standard trolley jack. when I tried to use this with my E92 I found it wasn't low enough to get under the car. I rather crudly sorted this problem out by removing the wheels off the trolly jack, it now fits...just.

Also, the plastic mounting points, I've used these in the past and they just get minced. I noticed a metal lip runs (from front to back of the car) just behind these plastic points and typically on other cars the jacking point has been along this metal lip (note the metal lip is just under the cars undertray protection, stick your finger in and you will feel it). This worked fine, the undertray protection "moaned" abit as the cars weight was take through it and it might have left a mark but nothing major.

Maybe I'm just a cowboy and should be shown the error of my ways, maybe not.

[doughboy]

Originally Posted by rsmallwo

I have a rather cheap/standard trolley jack. when I tried to use this with my E92 I found it wasn't low enough to get under the car. I rather crudly sorted this problem out by removing the wheels off the trolly jack, it now fits...just.

Also, the plastic mounting points, I've used these in the past and they just get minced. I noticed a metal lip runs (from front to back of the car) just behind these plastic points and typically on other cars the jacking point has been along this metal lip (note the metal lip is just under the cars undertray protection, stick your finger in and you will feel it). This worked fine, the undertray protection "moaned" abit as the cars weight was take through it and it might have left a mark but nothing major.

Maybe I'm just a cowboy and should be shown the error of my ways, maybe not.

Hmmmm.

The reason a trolley jack has wheels is not for your convenience but because the jack needs to move as you jack up.

The trolley jack pad moves upwards in an arc so as you lift the car the jack base needs to pull itself further under the car to stay under the lift pad.

With no wheels the jack will be fixed to the floor and will try to pull the car sideways as you lift causing mega strain to the jack and car body

V dangerous IMO.

[daz72]

Originally Posted by doughboy

Hmmmm.

The reason a trolley jack has wheels is not for your convenience but because the jack needs to move as you jack up.

The trolley jack pad moves upwards in an arc so as you lift the car the jack base needs to pull itself further under the car to stay under the lift pad.

With no wheels the jack will be fixed to the floor and will try to pull the car sideways as you lift causing mega strain to the jack and car body

V dangerous IMO.

+ 1

When jacking up the car, my trolley jack moved under the car by probably a good 3" - 4", and then back again when lowering it.

If the jack is not allowed to move toward the car, then either the car has to move towards the jack (not going to happen!) or there has to be some slippage between the jack-pad and the car.

Believe me - you do not want your jacking point slipping off your jack at the top of the lift. Jacks don't bend. Floorpans do!

Put the wheels back on your jack and make yourself some small ramps with 3 or 4 layers of plank offcuts to give you enough clearance to get your jack under the car. Either that or get a low entry jack as discussed above.

[chris330D]

[QUOTE=doughboy;7260873] Also sticking with OE style means no insurance implications. If I put on a set of rusty 16" steels my insurer still wanted £125 for 'modified wheels' - the same price as fitting a set of 20" bling rims!! WTF?

Agreed regarding insurance, that's why I got the MV3s as they are original fitment to my car (M Sport). That way there can be no arguements about 'modifications'. £125 is scandalous! I will be buying the Contis which should guarantee a mild winter!

[daz72]

Originally Posted by doughboy

For this very reason I bought a set of 4 8Jx18 MV3 reps for £300 new, great quality, look BETTER the the OE ones as the finish is a bit brighter. Also sticking with OE style means no insurance implications. If I put on a set of rusty 16" steels my insurer still wanted £125 for 'modified wheels' - the same price as fitting a set of 20" bling rims!! WTF?

That's ridiculous!

My insurer didn't want any more money at all. Simply to be advised when I put the alternative 16" wheels on, and when I replaced them with the original standard 18"s.

I notify them by email which they confirm receipt of. Sorted!

[rsmallwo]

Originally Posted by daz72

+ 1

When jacking up the car, my trolley jack moved under the car by probably a good 3" - 4", and then back again when lowering it.

If the jack is not allowed to move toward the car, then either the car has to move towards the jack (not going to happen!) or there has to be some slippage between the jack-pad and the car.

Believe me - you do not want your jacking point slipping off your jack at the top of the lift. Jacks don't bend. Floorpans do!

Put the wheels back on your jack and make yourself some small ramps with 3 or 4 layers of plank offcuts to give you enough clearance to get your jack under the car. Either that or get a low entry jack as discussed above.

Cheers for the info guys, thing is the car felt really "solid" without having the jacks wheels in place, it actually felt safer which is odd.

I did place some pads underneith the wheeless trolley jack as so to not damage the garage floor so it could move over this pad but a few mm, not the few inch's your talking about though!!!

Think I'll try to run the wheel I'm lifting onto some wood to give it some height so I can get my jack (with wheels) under there. I only need to get the wheel about an inch off the gorund to get my jack under anyway.