[AltecBX]

How is BMW 3 series (other than the M3) going to compete with the new CTS in power.


The redesigned 2014 Cadillac CTS sedan that goes on sale this fall will have a 420-hp twin-turbo 3.6-liter V6 as an option, General Motors said Monday. The redesigned CTS will be unveiled later this month at the New York auto show.

The intercooled, direct-injection, all-aluminum engine will be mated to a new eight-speed automatic transmission that has the capability to skip one or more gears during shifting for performance or better fuel economy. The transmission also includes paddle shifters on the steering wheel for manual control.

The twin-turbo V6 makes its peak horsepower at 5,750 rpm and reaches peak torque of 430 lb-ft at 3,500 rpm. Official fuel-economy ratings from the Environmental Protection Agency haven't been set, but Cadillac expects the new CTS engine will be rated at 17 mpg city and 25 mpg highway, running on required premium fuel. It will be available only in a rear-wheel-drive layout.

The twin-turbo will be the highest output V6 engine in GM history, said Richard Bartlett, the engine's assistant chief engineer.

The twin-turbo V6 will also be an option on the 2014 Cadillac XTS sedan this fall. The XTS is equipped with front-drive or all-wheel drive.

Cadillac says the twin-turbo V6 will propel the redesigned, larger CTS sedan from 0-60 mph in 4.6 seconds. With the engine, the new CTS will have a top speed of 170 mph.

The twin-turbo V6 is the most powerful of three engines announced for the redesigned CTS. The engine lineup also includes a naturally aspirated 3.6-liter V6, rated at 321 hp at 6,800 rpm and 275 lb-ft of torque at 4,800 rpm; and a turbocharged 2.0-liter four-cylinder, rated at 272 hp at 5,500 rpm and 295 lb-ft at 1,700 rpm.

The turbocharged four and naturally aspirated V6 will be offered in rear-drive or all-wheel-drive configurations. The rear-drive naturally aspirated V6 will also be mated to the new eight-speed transmission, while the all-wheel-drive variant and the turbocharged four-cylinder will be mated to a six-speed automatic transmission.

All three engines for the new CTS use aluminum blocks and cylinder heads, direct fuel injection, variable valve timing, dual overhead camshafts and four valves per cylinder. The turbo four can run on regular unleaded gasoline but premium is recommended, while the naturally aspirated V6 is set up for regular unleaded or E85.



http://www.autoweek.com/article/2013...YORK/130319812

[135Pats]

That's pretty beastly power, it'll take FBO for F30 335s to run with that car on paper.

[ihc95]

Uhhhh the 5 series competes with the CTS, not the 3.

[AltecBX]

Originally Posted by ihc95

Uhhhh the 5 series competes with the CTS, not the 3.

In size yes. But not in price and engine size.

[See5]

Originally Posted by AltecBX

In size yes. But not in price and engine size.

The new CTS is moving up to the 5 series price and spec level.

This engine will go into the ATS-V to take on the M3 however. Should be a dogfight.

[cupertinosteve]

This isn't even the CTS-V, correct?

Impressive motor, but a front wheel drive as standard ... not so impressive (edited - there is a RWD version too, its the XTS that is FWD).

I guess a CTS-V AWD version would be pretty sweet.

[Fun w/N54]

No matter...think OP is making obvious statement that the 3 series will be under powered 'on paper anyway' to most non-NAs 6cyl engines and close on few NA

[spyre]

Dang, they really are trying to not be your granddads caddy anymore! It'll be interesting to see the sales volume with that motor vs the turbo 4 or the na v6. I'm sure the price jump for it will be pretty spendy.

[._.]

can not wait for the ats-v, should be a sick car.

[kenneth]

I think 2014 the M4 is rumoured to also be a V6 TT making around 450hp. So it will be in the ballpark.

[akotten]

Sweet! I still think they're ugly though :/

[CUTigers]

Originally Posted by cupertinosteve

This isn't even the CTS-V, correct?

Impressive motor, but a front wheel drive as standard ... not so impressive (edited - there is a RWD version too, its the XTS that is FWD).

I guess a CTS-V AWD version would be pretty sweet.

Correct. This is going to be an option for the regular CTS, the V still has the supercharged V8.

[Lifted07Duramax]

Id take the CTS with that TT V6 if it comes stock with 420hp its easy to say you can get over 500hp at the fly and that'd be pretty sweet

[AltecBX]

Originally Posted by kenneth

I think 2014 the M4 is rumoured to also be a V6 TT making around 450hp. So it will be in the ballpark.

I hear you, but the M3 & M4 will be 10-15k more than the CTS or ATS-V with similar features. We all know also that the tuning and aftermarket parts will also cost 25+% less with no BMW tax.


We might be moving to a 4 cyl, hybrid, and electric market 2016+, but with motors like this pushing this much power, I can see V8 extinct and V6 twin turbos pushing 450hp+ replacing those V8 with much better fuel economy.

When tuners get their hands on this motor, I can guarantee lower sales on the CTS-V across the line.

GM LF3 | 3.6L = 118hp/lr 420hp
Audi 3.0 TFSI | 3.0L = 111hp/lr 333hp
BMW S65 = 4.0 | 4.0L = 105hp/lr 420hp
BMW N54 or N55 | 3.0L = 100hp/lr 300hp

Now, if is true that BMW will have a 3.3-liter six-cylinder engine equipped with three turbos then this would put it beyond the GM at 136hp/lr 450hp

[Lifted07Duramax]

But GMs 3.6 will still have more potential power

[M3takesNYC]

Guys, bmw is simply sliding back into the spot they always had been prior to their n54 engine, which is the middle-bottom of the horsepower scale compared to competitors. This worked fine back then because they were so far ahead in chassis and handling.

At first the n54 was unmatched. Nobody else was doing much turbo stuff and bmw was by far the best. However now everyone has an amazing turbo powerplant available and once again bmw is stuck at the bottom in output. Why they released a brand new 335 with 300 hp and people bought it blows my mind when you have all the competition killing it in output.

The problem now is that these other cars are now just as good or better at handling and chassis design so being in the middle or bottom of the power range simply won't cut it.

This Cts will walk all over the 335 bigtime and yes the cts is a 3 series competitor. Always was and still is, especially for the price point being the same.

Bmw is now back to falling behind the rest with hp, atleast of their non-m cars but looks like that will continue to change with the new m3 with a ridiculously low 415hp!! sad

[Fun w/N54]

Originally Posted by M3takesNYC

Guys, bmw is simply sliding back into the spot they always had been prior to their n54 engine, which is the middle-bottom of the horsepower scale compared to competitors. This worked fine back then because they were so far ahead in chassis and handling.

At first the n54 was unmatched. Nobody else was doing much turbo stuff and bmw was by far the best. However now everyone has an amazing turbo powerplant available and once again bmw is stuck at the bottom in output. Why they released a brand new 335 with 300 hp and people bought it blows my mind when you have all the competition killing it in output.

The problem now is that these other cars are now just as good or better at handling and chassis design so being in the middle or bottom of the power range simply won't cut it.

This Cts will walk all over the 335 bigtime and yes the cts is a 3 series competitor. Always was and still is, especially for the price point being the same.

Bmw is now back to falling behind the rest with hp, atleast of their non-m cars but looks like that will continue to change with the new m3 with a ridiculously low 415hp!! sad

Well said. 300HP TT 6 cyl in 2007 was something special now some minivans have NA 270+hp 6 cyls. New top 3 series engine needs 350-375HP and the M3/M4 in the 450HP range just to keep up with Jones...and the hefty price tags!!

[335twins]

Originally Posted by M3takesNYC

Guys, bmw is simply sliding back into the spot they always had been prior to their n54 engine, which is the middle-bottom of the horsepower scale compared to competitors. This worked fine back then because they were so far ahead in chassis and handling.

At first the n54 was unmatched. Nobody else was doing much turbo stuff and bmw was by far the best. However now everyone has an amazing turbo powerplant available and once again bmw is stuck at the bottom in output. Why they released a brand new 335 with 300 hp and people bought it blows my mind when you have all the competition killing it in output.

The problem now is that these other cars are now just as good or better at handling and chassis design so being in the middle or bottom of the power range simply won't cut it.

This Cts will walk all over the 335 bigtime and yes the cts is a 3 series competitor. Always was and still is, especially for the price point being the same.

Bmw is now back to falling behind the rest with hp, atleast of their non-m cars but looks like that will continue to change with the new m3 with a ridiculously low 415hp!! sad

Well said, I hope the new m3/4 is at least 450hp...

[Slidewayz]

The CTS weighs 4,000 pounds.

[M3_WC]

Originally Posted by Slidewayz

The CTS weighs 4,000 pounds.

But on the other hand, the ATS is the lightest car in the segment. So if an upgraded version of this motor finds its way into the ATS-V (which many think it is). We could have one hell of a car.

[Fun w/N54]

I had 135 prior and enjoyed it as well. So assuming the same engine options + less weight + less cost might be suitable option as well. Let's hope they fix the loose the bug eyed look and understeer. Assume 435 will be out prior to the M235?

[redlineryder]

Detailed engine info here: http://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/n...f3-engine.html

Rumoured curb weight should be around 3600lbs for the ATS-V. The new M3/M4 is targeting e46 curb weight but it remains to be seen if they will achieve that goal.

The GM aftermarket is huge and development of parts/tuning will be immediate with vendors already established and professional, just think, no more smoke and mirrors with full transparency, more options and cheaper parts. Hopefully the engine is stout and takes well to additional power.