E90 320d/163 engine stops randomly

bimmerbilly · 08-16-2013, 03:44 PM

I'm bumping this post because i have the exact same issue as this. I managed to swap out the DDE relay but unfortunately, it didn't solve the issue.

I had the turbo replaced a few months ago, so i have a strong feeling it won't be related to that - but you can never write these things off i suppose.

Any ones thoughts on the crankshaft sensor? I am having issues where at any point, with no warning the car could cut, any speed what so ever or even idling. It can be quite dangerous as you can imagine but it doesn't happen that often that a indie wouldn't be able to replicate it on demand. I've read that it might not throw any error codes if was related to the crankshaft sensor, once plugged in.

Any other thoughts would be amazing!

Rory · 08-21-2013, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MX20

Sorry all, I did not visit the forum for a very long time.
In my case it was a relay. I do not know which one but FWIW it was blue

I just had to replace that relay on my 320d as well, it was cutting out just after starting the engine. Google was my friend and was an easy fix

CnSky · 08-27-2013, 05:01 PM

Rory what kind of symptoms were you having to change the DDE relay?

My 320D E92 At is not responding to throttle out at slow speed very randomly and when i break to a stop it then cut outthe engine?

Anything like what you experienced?

CnSky · 08-27-2013, 05:04 PM

Bimmerbilly did you ever solve the issue I have the same problem.

Rory · 08-29-2013, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CnSky

Rory what kind of symptoms were you having to change the DDE relay?

My 320D E92 At is not responding to throttle out at slow speed very randomly and when i break to a stop it then cut outthe engine?

Anything like what you experienced?

No , mine was only occasionally when starting the engine, it would turn over then nearly catch but fail and give warnings on the dash. Hope you get your problem sorted soon

badsha · 08-31-2013, 05:04 PM

I had same problem as described changed The blue relay but did not help.. Then changed The cranc shaft sensor and The at has been perfect since! Cheap part but horror to shift!!!!

g1de0n · 05-14-2015, 09:34 AM

Hi all, I am having the same issue on my E91 320D 163hp 2005. (at least symptoms look very similar) First of all sorry for my English, not my mother language.
Time to time especially when I stop on red light or parking, car is loosing rpm, engine gets weird vibrations and turn off.
It can happen after just 20 minutes of easy driving, so I don't think any electronic is getting too hot. It happens very randomly, sometimes I drive 500km with no problem.

At this situations I cannot start engine until I get the key out (lock the car) and wait a minute.
If it happens on highway engine stops and stars almost immediately. You would feel kind of forward-backward shake. (I am afraid it can damage main chain)

Diagnostic doesn't point on the source of my problem. As preventive step I already replaced sky-blue relay.
December-April I was enjoying my car, now it happens again. It means relay was not problem in my case.

If it would be crankshaft sensor, wouldn't diagnostic confirm that? I am not tight-fisted to spend 50EUR on new crankshaft sensor, I just always prefer to work logically.
(meaning I know what/why I am doing)

I would be glad if you guys share your experience. Thanks!

gIzzE · 05-14-2015, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by g1de0n

Hi all, I am having the same issue on my E91 320D 163hp 2005. (at least symptoms look very similar) First of all sorry for my English, not my mother language.
Time to time especially when I stop on red light or parking, car is loosing rpm, engine gets weird vibrations and turn off.
It can happen after just 20 minutes of easy driving, so I don't think any electronic is getting too hot. It happens very randomly, sometimes I drive 500km with no problem.

Have you checked the hoses for an air leak?

Aragorn30d · 05-14-2015, 03:07 PM

Most ECU's treat the crank sensor input as a fairly major primary input. If the signal vanishes, it simply assumes the engine has stopped, and thus fuel delivery stops.

It often wont flag a fault code, because it just assumes the engine has physically stopped, and thus doesnt see it as a fault.

Sometimes ECU's will use alternative speed inputs (say the cam sensor) to keep running, and those ones will then often be able to realise the crank sensor is broken and log a fault code for it. Other times the ECU might notice the crank signal becoming unstable or jumping around, and will log a code for that.

Essentially dont assume no fault code means the crank sensor is fine.

GerhardNL · 09-14-2015, 05:06 AM

Thanks for all the help in this post! (esp. Aragorn30d's last line in the post above this one) I'll post my experience here for future reference:

My 2006 E91 330d manual would cut out at random moments without throwing an error code (about 290.000 km's on it/180.000 miles). It could go a week or more without cutting out or do it twice on one day. What happens is that the car just stops running all of a sudden, the revs go down and the trottle won't respond. Also brake and steering power would be gone. Electronics like radio stay on. Pressing the clutch and starting again could be done successfully right away (even when still rolling on the motorway). After some research we concluded it could be the crankshaft position sensor. One of the things that led us here was the fact that pulling the crank sensor plug made the car shut off without throwing an error code.

So I changed it last Saturday. It was quite a job to replace it (I'm no mechanic but managed with the instructions of a friend who is). Removing the starter motor was necessary to reach it and even then it wasn't easy. But on the other hand: if I can do it it's far from impossible. Took me the better part of a day. I didn't take the inlet manifold off as some say you should but that would probably make it easier to reach.

When I took out the old sensor it had some metal particles on it so maybe that was my problem but of course I changed it for a new one anyway.

So far, so good: she starts and runs fine and haven't had any cut outs yet. I'll update after a while to tell if it stays this way.

Update #1: it's been over 2 weeks and about 2.000 km's and no cut-out yet (this would have been very improbable before).
Update #2: over 20.000 km's now since changing the part and still no cut-out has occured.

adi_stezar · 10-07-2016, 03:03 AM

One up for the crankshaft sensor. I had same issues, engine would cut-off randomly in traffic. Initially I changed the blue relay as it was the easiest option but that proved to be a waste of money

. Eventually I replaced the crankshaft sensor and the car had been fine since. The car is a 2007 e90 320d. Pretty hard to replace though, labor was much more than the part itself.

520dE61LCI · 11-12-2017, 05:22 PM

Hi all!

sorry to bring this topic to the TOP again...but I'm having a similar problem and your help will be very precious.

I've a E61 520d 163cv (sorry to ask this in an e90 topic)

I've the car for a few months and for 5 ou 6 times the car turn off without any error.
It is a manual gearbox: I press the clutch and the Start button and the car turn on again without any issue

Everytime this happen there was no warning, no error... if it happen in the highway I only notice because the gas pedal is not "responding" anymore...radio / lights keep working

It had happen in difference scenarios:
- in the traffic when I was stop in a red light
- In the Highway.
- with fuel tank almost empty
- with the fuel tank full

It can be the cranckshaft sensor as in many cases described in this topic, but I've a doubt regarding what happen to the RPM meter if the issue is in this sensor.

I think this is the same sensor that check the engine RPM, so....if this sensor is faulty and the engine turn off, shouldn't the RPM meter be at 0 even if it happen in 5th gear per example (if the sensor if faulty how can the rpm be accurate even if the car turn of and is only running with inertia)?
in my car the RPM meter is still working when this happen, it only go to 0 when I press the Clutch per example, or when I brake until the car stop (when it happen in the highway, obviously if I am in the traffic the engine stops and rpm goes to 0).
I can only start the engine again after it is completely stopped (0rpm)

So...the question is....what happen to your RPM meter when you had this problem?
was any error saved in the ECU? Even if the car didn't show any warning?
I've reset the errors from the ECU a few days ago...and I am waiting for this to happen again to check the ECU errors...but it looked like there was nothing related to this....

Many many thanks in advance!!!!

adi_stezar · 11-13-2017, 06:12 AM

The crankshaft sensor is not completely faulty, otherwise your engine wouldn't start anymore. The signal is cut for a very short period, enough to make the ecu stop the engine but not enough for you to notice the problem on the rpm meter. Ecu will not show any error because it threats lost signal from the sensor as an simple engine stop. All your signs are same to what i had and it was fixed by replacing the sensor.

520dE61LCI · 11-13-2017, 11:11 AM

Many Thanks for your reply!!

I'll change the sensor within the next weeks and I'll update the topic as soon as I've a conclusion!

Hope problem is solved

Cheers!!!

520dE61LCI · 04-05-2018, 05:30 AM

Thanks!!!!!!
Problem solved, crankshaft sensor changed 2 months ago...car never stopped again!

charlesfslater@gmail.com · 04-04-2023, 10:18 AM

Hi,
In reference to the "low windshield fluid" warning associated with stalling, I have had the same experience many times with my E90 323i 2008. About 2 months ago I had the software updated and a new battery installed (together with it's registration) at a BMW dealer to combat the stalling issue. The stalling issue ceased until yesterday when the "low windshield fluid" warning appeared and the vehicle stalled - at 3 times within a few kilometres.
I returned to the dealership this morning, related my experience to the workshop manager and, wuth the washer fluid on empty, took him for a test drive. Luckily the vehicle eventually stalled!
The vehicle is going in for a check up next week. Will advise you of the outcome.
BTW in previous stalling situations over a couple of years, momentarily before stalling I had noticed the washer fluid warning appearing but always thought it was a coincidence!

08-16-2013, 03:44 PM	#23
bimmerbilly Registered 0 Rep 4 Posts Drives: 320d MSPORT e90 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Bristol iTrader: (0)	I'm bumping this post because i have the exact same issue as this. I managed to swap out the DDE relay but unfortunately, it didn't solve the issue. I had the turbo replaced a few months ago, so i have a strong feeling it won't be related to that - but you can never write these things off i suppose. Any ones thoughts on the crankshaft sensor? I am having issues where at any point, with no warning the car could cut, any speed what so ever or even idling. It can be quite dangerous as you can imagine but it doesn't happen that often that a indie wouldn't be able to replicate it on demand. I've read that it might not throw any error codes if was related to the crankshaft sensor, once plugged in. Any other thoughts would be amazing!
	Appreciate 0 Quote

08-27-2013, 05:01 PM	#25
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	Rory what kind of symptoms were you having to change the DDE relay? My 320D E92 At is not responding to throttle out at slow speed very randomly and when i break to a stop it then cut outthe engine? Anything like what you experienced?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

08-27-2013, 05:04 PM	#26
CnSky Major 330 Rep 1,028 Posts Drives: BMW 530E 2017 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Ireland iTrader: (0)	Bimmerbilly did you ever solve the issue I have the same problem.
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08-31-2013, 05:04 PM	#28
badsha Private First Class 35 Rep 119 Posts Drives: BMW E90 318d 2006 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Norway iTrader: (0)	I had same problem as described changed The blue relay but did not help.. Then changed The cranc shaft sensor and The at has been perfect since! Cheap part but horror to shift!!!!
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-14-2015, 09:34 AM	#29
g1de0n New Member 0 Rep 8 Posts Drives: E91 320D M47N2 Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Slovakia iTrader: (0)	Hi all, I am having the same issue on my E91 320D 163hp 2005. (at least symptoms look very similar) First of all sorry for my English, not my mother language. Time to time especially when I stop on red light or parking, car is loosing rpm, engine gets weird vibrations and turn off. It can happen after just 20 minutes of easy driving, so I don't think any electronic is getting too hot. It happens very randomly, sometimes I drive 500km with no problem. At this situations I cannot start engine until I get the key out (lock the car) and wait a minute. If it happens on highway engine stops and stars almost immediately. You would feel kind of forward-backward shake. (I am afraid it can damage main chain) Diagnostic doesn't point on the source of my problem. As preventive step I already replaced sky-blue relay. December-April I was enjoying my car, now it happens again. It means relay was not problem in my case. If it would be crankshaft sensor, wouldn't diagnostic confirm that? I am not tight-fisted to spend 50EUR on new crankshaft sensor, I just always prefer to work logically. (meaning I know what/why I am doing) I would be glad if you guys share your experience. Thanks! __________________
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-14-2015, 03:07 PM	#31
Aragorn30d Lieutenant Colonel 175 Rep 1,596 Posts Drives: E90 330d Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Fife iTrader: (0)	Most ECU's treat the crank sensor input as a fairly major primary input. If the signal vanishes, it simply assumes the engine has stopped, and thus fuel delivery stops. It often wont flag a fault code, because it just assumes the engine has physically stopped, and thus doesnt see it as a fault. Sometimes ECU's will use alternative speed inputs (say the cam sensor) to keep running, and those ones will then often be able to realise the crank sensor is broken and log a fault code for it. Other times the ECU might notice the crank signal becoming unstable or jumping around, and will log a code for that. Essentially dont assume no fault code means the crank sensor is fine.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

09-14-2015, 05:06 AM	#32
GerhardNL New Member 2 Rep 9 Posts Drives: E91 330D MT Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Netherlands iTrader: (0)	Thanks for all the help in this post! (esp. Aragorn30d's last line in the post above this one) I'll post my experience here for future reference: My 2006 E91 330d manual would cut out at random moments without throwing an error code (about 290.000 km's on it/180.000 miles). It could go a week or more without cutting out or do it twice on one day. What happens is that the car just stops running all of a sudden, the revs go down and the trottle won't respond. Also brake and steering power would be gone. Electronics like radio stay on. Pressing the clutch and starting again could be done successfully right away (even when still rolling on the motorway). After some research we concluded it could be the crankshaft position sensor. One of the things that led us here was the fact that pulling the crank sensor plug made the car shut off without throwing an error code. So I changed it last Saturday. It was quite a job to replace it (I'm no mechanic but managed with the instructions of a friend who is). Removing the starter motor was necessary to reach it and even then it wasn't easy. But on the other hand: if I can do it it's far from impossible. Took me the better part of a day. I didn't take the inlet manifold off as some say you should but that would probably make it easier to reach. When I took out the old sensor it had some metal particles on it so maybe that was my problem but of course I changed it for a new one anyway. So far, so good: she starts and runs fine and haven't had any cut outs yet. I'll update after a while to tell if it stays this way. Update #1: it's been over 2 weeks and about 2.000 km's and no cut-out yet (this would have been very improbable before). Update #2: over 20.000 km's now since changing the part and still no cut-out has occured. Last edited by GerhardNL; 02-15-2016 at 04:48 AM.. Reason: Update
	Appreciate 1 tadaska113.50 Quote

10-07-2016, 03:03 AM	#33
adi_stezar Registered 0 Rep 2 Posts Drives: e90 320d Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: Romania iTrader: (0)	One up for the crankshaft sensor. I had same issues, engine would cut-off randomly in traffic. Initially I changed the blue relay as it was the easiest option but that proved to be a waste of money . Eventually I replaced the crankshaft sensor and the car had been fine since. The car is a 2007 e90 320d. Pretty hard to replace though, labor was much more than the part itself.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-12-2017, 05:22 PM	#34
520dE61LCI Registered 0 Rep 4 Posts Drives: 520D E61 Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: PT iTrader: (0)	Hi all! sorry to bring this topic to the TOP again...but I'm having a similar problem and your help will be very precious. I've a E61 520d 163cv (sorry to ask this in an e90 topic) I've the car for a few months and for 5 ou 6 times the car turn off without any error. It is a manual gearbox: I press the clutch and the Start button and the car turn on again without any issue Everytime this happen there was no warning, no error... if it happen in the highway I only notice because the gas pedal is not "responding" anymore...radio / lights keep working It had happen in difference scenarios: - in the traffic when I was stop in a red light - In the Highway. - with fuel tank almost empty - with the fuel tank full It can be the cranckshaft sensor as in many cases described in this topic, but I've a doubt regarding what happen to the RPM meter if the issue is in this sensor. I think this is the same sensor that check the engine RPM, so....if this sensor is faulty and the engine turn off, shouldn't the RPM meter be at 0 even if it happen in 5th gear per example (if the sensor if faulty how can the rpm be accurate even if the car turn of and is only running with inertia)? in my car the RPM meter is still working when this happen, it only go to 0 when I press the Clutch per example, or when I brake until the car stop (when it happen in the highway, obviously if I am in the traffic the engine stops and rpm goes to 0). I can only start the engine again after it is completely stopped (0rpm) So...the question is....what happen to your RPM meter when you had this problem? was any error saved in the ECU? Even if the car didn't show any warning? I've reset the errors from the ECU a few days ago...and I am waiting for this to happen again to check the ECU errors...but it looked like there was nothing related to this.... Many many thanks in advance!!!!
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11-13-2017, 06:12 AM	#35
adi_stezar Registered 0 Rep 2 Posts Drives: e90 320d Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: Romania iTrader: (0)	The crankshaft sensor is not completely faulty, otherwise your engine wouldn't start anymore. The signal is cut for a very short period, enough to make the ecu stop the engine but not enough for you to notice the problem on the rpm meter. Ecu will not show any error because it threats lost signal from the sensor as an simple engine stop. All your signs are same to what i had and it was fixed by replacing the sensor.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-13-2017, 11:11 AM	#36
520dE61LCI Registered 0 Rep 4 Posts Drives: 520D E61 Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: PT iTrader: (0)	Many Thanks for your reply!! I'll change the sensor within the next weeks and I'll update the topic as soon as I've a conclusion! Hope problem is solved Cheers!!!
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04-05-2018, 05:30 AM	#37
520dE61LCI Registered 0 Rep 4 Posts Drives: 520D E61 Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: PT iTrader: (0)	Thanks!!!!!! Problem solved, crankshaft sensor changed 2 months ago...car never stopped again!
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04-04-2023, 10:18 AM	#38
charlesfslater@gmail.com Registered 0 Rep 3 Posts Drives: BMW E90 323i Auto (2008) Join Date: Jan 2018 Location: Johannesburg iTrader: (0)	Hi, In reference to the "low windshield fluid" warning associated with stalling, I have had the same experience many times with my E90 323i 2008. About 2 months ago I had the software updated and a new battery installed (together with it's registration) at a BMW dealer to combat the stalling issue. The stalling issue ceased until yesterday when the "low windshield fluid" warning appeared and the vehicle stalled - at 3 times within a few kilometres. I returned to the dealership this morning, related my experience to the workshop manager and, wuth the washer fluid on empty, took him for a test drive. Luckily the vehicle eventually stalled! The vehicle is going in for a check up next week. Will advise you of the outcome. BTW in previous stalling situations over a couple of years, momentarily before stalling I had noticed the washer fluid warning appearing but always thought it was a coincidence!
	Appreciate 0 Quote