Diesel Airbus Crashes, Carbon Buildup?

Quasimodem · 09-26-2013, 05:22 PM

You guys think you have it bad when a diesel car gets carbon buildup. Wait until you fly a new diesel Airbus...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IyHaa8D8HI

N8N · 09-26-2013, 05:28 PM

Not as dumb as it sounds, isn't Diesel fuel very similar to jet fuel? One would think that this has probably happened before without anyone ever noticing.

taibanl · 09-26-2013, 06:02 PM

Yeah. This is someone trying to be funny. Diesel and jet -a are essentially the same. A jet will easily burn diesel.

Puerto Rican 335d · 09-27-2013, 05:45 AM

I thought they ran on JP-5 fuel, maybe Im getting to old on this

335dM · 09-27-2013, 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by taibanl

Yeah. This is someone trying to be funny. Diesel and jet -a are essentially the same. A jet will easily burn diesel.

Kerosene is diesel! Just very more refined and clean.
When I work as a AME a few years ago, we worked for a medium size airline company that had to pay another company to get rid of its old kerosene when we were purging the tanks. Lol instead of paying them, they asked their employees who had diesel car to take it. We were bringing 45 gallons on a trailer to bring it back home for our Tdi's
Lol that was very smart for us and them until they got caught by Transport Canada and were shut off permanently !!

Quasimodem · 09-27-2013, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335dM

Jet fuel is diesel! Just very more refined and clean.
When I work as a AME a few years ago, we worked for a medium size airline company that had to pay another company to get rid of its old fuel when we were purging the tanks. Lol instead of paying them, they asked their employees who had diesel car to take it. We were bringing 45 gallons on a trailer to bring it back home for our Tdi's
Lol that was very smart for us and them until they got caught by Transport Canada and were shut off permanently !!

Well, that sucks for the employees, I doubt there is much wrong with using aviation jet fuel in cars. at over $4.00 a gallon now for diesel, that would be a bonus of almost $200 per trailer. But I would be a bit more concerned if they were using automotive diesel in jets.

Jffeijao · 09-29-2013, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335dM

Jet fuel is diesel! Just very more refined and clean.
When I work as a AME a few years ago, we worked for a medium size airline company that had to pay another company to get rid of its old fuel when we were purging the tanks. Lol instead of paying them, they asked their employees who had diesel car to take it. We were bringing 45 gallons on a trailer to bring it back home for our Tdi's
Lol that was very smart for us and them until they got caught by Transport Canada and were shut off permanently !!

Jet fuel is not diesel.
Diesel is a heavier fuel, with a bit more energy density then jet fuel.
Jet fuel contains 12 carbon long hidrocarbon molecules while diesel carries 16 carbon long ones.

While diesel is a fuel for compression ignition engines, jet fuel can be used on compression or spark ignited engines.
Jet fuel on diesel engines will work but performance will suffer, while on gasoline engines it can improve output/fuel economy

335dM · 09-29-2013, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jffeijao

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335dM

Jet fuel is diesel! Just very more refined and clean.
When I work as a AME a few years ago, we worked for a medium size airline company that had to pay another company to get rid of its old fuel when we were purging the tanks. Lol instead of paying them, they asked their employees who had diesel car to take it. We were bringing 45 gallons on a trailer to bring it back home for our Tdi's
Lol that was very smart for us and them until they got caught by Transport Canada and were shut off permanently !!

Jet fuel is not diesel.
Diesel is a heavier fuel, with a bit more energy density then jet fuel.
Jet fuel contains 12 carbon long hidrocarbon molecules while diesel carries 16 carbon long ones.

While diesel is a fuel for compression ignition engines, jet fuel can be used on compression or spark ignited engines.
Jet fuel on diesel engines will work but performance will suffer, while on gasoline engines it can improve output/fuel economy

My mistake.
I meant kerosene
Not jet fuel ! Thanks for the correction. The jet fuel was used in our race car (gasoline car)at the drag strip while the kerosene was given to diesel guys in the hangars.

DnA Diesel · 09-29-2013, 10:24 PM

PR, JP-5 (Nato F-44) is closest to diesel, but still a partially wide-cut kerosene, not exactly the same as ASTM 975-spec D-2 Diesel, per se. JP-5 is used primarily on board naval vessels for fuelling aircraft and helicopters, and has a higher flashpoint than JP-4 (Jet B) which is a fully wide-cut kerosene. JP-8 (Nato F-34 or civvie Jet A/A-1) or JP-8 +100 (F-37) are narrow-cut kerosenes that are a balance between the stability and safety of a distillate fuel like diesel and a partial aromatic-content shorter-chain hydrocarbon. JP-8 is close enough to diesel that it can be used in multi-fuel capable vehicles, particularly military diesel-powered vehicles. JP-8 does not, however, have the same lubricity as diesel, even ULSD, so if used in diesel vehicles, requires additional additives to ensure no damage to the engine's fuel injection system result.

Having flown turbine-powered aircraft using diesel as an alternate fuel, I would be very surprised if the aircraft crashed due to being fuelled with D-2 diesel...turbofans/turboshafts run reasonably well, albeit a bit smokey, on diesel.

Regards
D.

Quasimodem · 09-29-2013, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DnA Diesel

Having flown turbine-powered aircraft using diesel as an alternate fuel, I would be very surprised if the aircraft crashed due to being fuelled with D-2 diesel...turbofans/turboshafts run reasonably well, albeit a bit smokey, on diesel.

Well, my mostly joking implication was that regularly using diesel in a jet could result in carbon buildup similar that found in automobile engines and thereby possibly cause a much worse incident than we will ever see in our cars.

Puerto Rican 335d · 09-30-2013, 07:22 AM

DNA thanks we used JP5 for Helos and Jets while I was in the NAVY for 20 years thats why I inquired about it, thanks amigo!!

335dFan · 09-30-2013, 07:59 AM

Our vehicles are special: they need JP7.

DnA Diesel · 10-26-2013, 03:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puerto Rican 335d

DNA thanks we used JP5 for Helos and Jets while I was in the NAVY for 20 years thats why I inquired about it, thanks amigo!!

De nada, PR! Some of my SH-3-flying buddies speak fondly of the smell of JP-5 that seemed to find its way on to all their gear.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335dFan

Our vehicles are special: they need JP7.

LOL...we just fly a bit lower!

Cheers
D.

335dFan · 10-26-2013, 04:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DnA Diesel

LOL...we just fly a bit lower!

D.

I wondered if anyone would pick up on JP7.

Quasimodem · 10-28-2013, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 335dFan

I wondered if anyone would pick up on JP7.

So you are saying that I am buying this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JP-7 for $4.00 a gallon? Wow, what a deal.

09-26-2013, 05:22 PM	#1
Quasimodem Colonel 145 Rep 2,383 Posts Drives: 335d Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: California iTrader: (0) Garage List 2009 335d US [0.00]	Diesel Airbus Crashes, Carbon Buildup? You guys think you have it bad when a diesel car gets carbon buildup. Wait until you fly a new diesel Airbus... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IyHaa8D8HI __________________ Speakers: CDT Audio HD-42 comps--front doors (RAAMmat deadened), CDT ES-06 6.5" woofers--kickpanl Pods, Hertz EBX202R dual 8" ported trunk sub. Amps: Phoenix Gold RSd 500.4 (comps & pods). PG RSd 600.1 (sub). Power & Ground: 4AWG Streetwires w/RockFosgt RFDB1 distro blocks. Input: HU lineout--Kicker KISL RCA adapters--RockFosgt RFIT-6 cables--Audiocontrol Matrix--Monster cables--RSd 500.4--lineout Monstr Cabl to RSd 600.1.
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09-26-2013, 05:28 PM	#2
N8N Lieutenant Colonel 168 Rep 1,843 Posts Drives: 2009 E92 335i 6MT Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Berwyn Heights, MD iTrader: (2)	Not as dumb as it sounds, isn't Diesel fuel very similar to jet fuel? One would think that this has probably happened before without anyone ever noticing.
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09-26-2013, 06:02 PM	#3
taibanl Brigadier General 280 Rep 4,121 Posts Drives: BMW Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: NA iTrader: (4)	Yeah. This is someone trying to be funny. Diesel and jet -a are essentially the same. A jet will easily burn diesel.
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09-27-2013, 05:45 AM	#4
Puerto Rican 335d Brigadier General 229 Rep 3,489 Posts Drives: Montego Blue 335d Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Puerto Rico(Dominican Republic 03/2017) iTrader: (0)	I thought they ran on JP-5 fuel, maybe Im getting to old on this __________________ RENNtech Flash(Lenny Wu)/WAGNER IC Enkei Rajin 18"/Execuhitch Hitch/Koni FSD Soft Ride Bike Rack/Brava Synthetic Motor Oil(Made in Puerto Rico)/Meth(in the works)/CBU done w Andrew EGR Race Pipe (whoa! what an animal it is now)
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09-29-2013, 10:24 PM	#9
DnA Diesel Major 27 Rep 1,110 Posts Drives: 09 335d Sport SGrey/Blk/Blk Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Ottawa, Canada iTrader: (0)	PR, JP-5 (Nato F-44) is closest to diesel, but still a partially wide-cut kerosene, not exactly the same as ASTM 975-spec D-2 Diesel, per se. JP-5 is used primarily on board naval vessels for fuelling aircraft and helicopters, and has a higher flashpoint than JP-4 (Jet B) which is a fully wide-cut kerosene. JP-8 (Nato F-34 or civvie Jet A/A-1) or JP-8 +100 (F-37) are narrow-cut kerosenes that are a balance between the stability and safety of a distillate fuel like diesel and a partial aromatic-content shorter-chain hydrocarbon. JP-8 is close enough to diesel that it can be used in multi-fuel capable vehicles, particularly military diesel-powered vehicles. JP-8 does not, however, have the same lubricity as diesel, even ULSD, so if used in diesel vehicles, requires additional additives to ensure no damage to the engine's fuel injection system result. Having flown turbine-powered aircraft using diesel as an alternate fuel, I would be very surprised if the aircraft crashed due to being fuelled with D-2 diesel...turbofans/turboshafts run reasonably well, albeit a bit smokey, on diesel. Regards D. __________________ 2016 GLE 350d - White on Black
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09-30-2013, 07:22 AM	#11
Puerto Rican 335d Brigadier General 229 Rep 3,489 Posts Drives: Montego Blue 335d Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Puerto Rico(Dominican Republic 03/2017) iTrader: (0)	DNA thanks we used JP5 for Helos and Jets while I was in the NAVY for 20 years thats why I inquired about it, thanks amigo!! __________________ RENNtech Flash(Lenny Wu)/WAGNER IC Enkei Rajin 18"/Execuhitch Hitch/Koni FSD Soft Ride Bike Rack/Brava Synthetic Motor Oil(Made in Puerto Rico)/Meth(in the works)/CBU done w Andrew EGR Race Pipe (whoa! what an animal it is now)
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09-30-2013, 07:59 AM	#12
335dFan Jumping Jack Flash 321 Rep 1,692 Posts Drives: 2021 X3 M40i Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: California (east of Sacramento) iTrader: (0) Garage List 2021 BMW X3 M40i [0.00] 2017 Toyota Prius [0.00]	Our vehicles are special: they need JP7. __________________ 2021 X3 M40i: M Sport Differential, Adaptive M Suspension. Previous BMWs: 1971 BMW 2002, 1973 BMW R75/5, and 2011 BMW 335d Previous Other Vehicles: '67 Cougar, '70 911e, '86 Jetta Diesel, '05 and '12 Foresters, et al.
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