[mishenka]

A word of caution for those who have this beautiful right not to say a word to the police (those who live in USA ). To cut the story short and not naming any names here is the situation:

A car (not bmw) that was parked on the street in the parking lot is slowly backing up. Another car (not bmw, but thats irrelevant) is moving perpendicular to the car that is trying to back up out of the parking spot. The end result - the rear passenger corner of the bumper of the car that is backing up and the rear passenger side of the car that is driving perpendicular to the first car are collided. Period. Cop comes over in a few minutes. Writes ticket to the driver of the car that was backing up out of the parking spot for "Backing unsafely". I am not a driver of any of these cars, but related to the driver that was backing up.

Plea of not guilty is sent back to the court as a response to the above ticket along with the request for the Supporting Deposition. The attached is the Supporting Deposition that recently (finally) arrived.

All I am saying is that if nothing was said at all by the driver that was backing up then the ticket would have been based only purely on the cop's observation and, perhaps, on the words of the others (if any). You DO NOT HAVE to admit to anything especially if you do not know/do not understand/are confused in what light your words will be viewed and used. Because the truth is - they will be used against you...

I think its a very important right to remain silent... at least I think it cannot hurt to do so sometimes.

[John 070]

That's called pleading the 5th. In most cases, when you are not in the wrong, there's nothing wrong with telling the truth. The person stated they did not see the car behind them, in essence admitting fault. It takes a man to do that. It takes a weasel to say nothing or to deny it.

[NaNo_F1]

Guys, read your insurance policy as well, all of them always state "Never admit it was your fault". Not because you're a lying SOB but because you won't get screwed as well by other parties.

[sjg111]

[JL 325i]

Originally Posted by sjg111

ditto

[EDM92]

Originally Posted by sjg111

Just watched all 27 minutes of this video. I feel so much smarter.

Edit: Just finished part 2, and that was also great.

[zeenon53]

It doesn't hurt to have a refresher, I saw that video a while back.

[TheBaronSG]

Originally Posted by BMWorNOTHING

Just watched all 27 minutes of this video. I feel so much smarter.

me too.... never saying anything, ever...

[DieselPower]

Originally Posted by BMWorNOTHING

Just watched all 27 minutes of this video. I feel so much smarter.

was gonna post that vid..
Really informative and gave me a different perspective.

This is also good

[Seminole]

I was in a similar accident with my old car and I was the one backing up. There was a big tree to my right (I was parked in a rightmost endspot) that blocked my view of a corner. I slowly back out checking both sides and stop a few inches out when I can see the corner better. After looking to the right and seeing it all clear I start to back out as I'm looking to the left. At that time I'm almost halfway out of the spot and some girl in a G35 comes flying around the corner and drives right past me. I didn't have a chance to turn back to the right and see her due to her speed and ended up hitting her right wheel area with my bumper. I live in a complex where the speed limit in the parking lot is 10mph but people routinely drive double that and refuse to stop for someone already backing out. Cop comes, I admit hitting her and blame it on the fact she was traveling double or more the speed limit (and there was a witness to corroborate it) but he didn't care and gives me a ticket for backing unsafely. Took it to court, brought the witness, and the judge threw it out.

[RoundelM3]

That's why the statement cops read to you about your rights (when it's required) includes the phrase "anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law". This of course is usually only done in the case of a felony arrest. For misdemeanors/traffic stuff, the "against you" can be deleted. The cops write down or record via dashcam whatever you tell them, and you have to decide whether there's anything you want them to carry to court with them should you decide to fight the citation. The cops aren't judge and jury, and can only decide what to do based on their observations. They sometimes make mistakes, just like everyone else. I know this based on personal experience on the other side of the badge.

[ren]

very informative thread, thanks to everyone who contributed.

[Rustler]

Originally Posted by John 070

That's called pleading the 5th. In most cases, when you are not in the wrong, there's nothing wrong with telling the truth. The person stated they did not see the car behind them, in essence admitting fault. It takes a man to do that. It takes a weasel to say nothing or to deny it.

This is patently false and contrary to the spirit and foundation of our justice system. It pains me to hear someone suggest that refusing to give a statement to an authority figure while under duress is befitting a "weasel." Telling people that if they have nothing hide they may as well 'tell the truth' is a Gestapo-like tactic. The same seemingly innocuous statement can be interpreted to have an entirely different meaning. Did you not see the car because you didn't look, or because the other car was travelling so fast you didn't see it DESPITE your appropriate caution? Both interpretations are plausible, but because the statement "I didn't see the other car" is open to two different interpretations the utterer is left vulnerable.

Please take the advice of the other posters, and unless you feel comfortable advocating for yourself in front of a police officer, don't make hasty statements. This isn't about "being a man," it's about protecting yourself from misinterpretation (or even an abuse of power).

[mechanixhorseman]

Take it from a detective. If you're guilty, remaining silent is always the best idea. Will it generally make you appear more guilty to the cop/detective? Yes, but in a court of law that doesn't really matter at all. Facts and testimonial evidence are all that really matters, and your scumbag defense attorney will be much better suited to help you hide the truth than you will.

That being said, if you're at fault for a collision, no matter how minor, and you don't man up and take responsibility, you're still a toolbag.

[JuppiOne]

sometimes police DO abuse their power, about 20+ years ago, a friend of mine was riding on the hood of a very slow moving car, may be 5mph, being silly and all, someone saw him and called the police, I was not the driver nor riding on the hood, merely walking along side in the side walk, police came, all pissed off and have extremely attitude, may be because we are teenagers? asked my friend was he riding on the car, none of us said anything, we remained silence, I don;t know if not saying anything when police ask you is against the law or not? but since we don;t say anything, he got even more pissed off, then tell us to lined up on the hood of his patrol car, handcuffed us and put us in the back of his cruiser for an hour (may be more, lost track of time there), we were told that we were under arrest for "lying" to the police (namely, his fat cop ass). WTF?

Finally the Sergent arrived, after talking to the cop, he order his fat ass to let us go, cause we did nothing wrong, the only thing that was wrong was his attitude. well there goes being silent, bad cops can introduce his own evidents, and I am sure my case was not an isolated incident either

[Castel]

Originally Posted by Rustler

This is patently false and contrary to the spirit and foundation of our justice system. It pains me to hear someone suggest that refusing to give a statement to an authority figure while under duress is befitting a "weasel." Telling people that if they have nothing hide they may as well 'tell the truth' is a Gestapo-like tactic. The same seemingly innocuous statement can be interpreted to have an entirely different meaning. Did you not see the car because you didn't look, or because the other car was travelling so fast you didn't see it DESPITE your appropriate caution? Both interpretations are plausible, but because the statement "I didn't see the other car" is open to two different interpretations the utterer is left vulnerable.

Please take the advice of the other posters, and unless you feel comfortable advocating for yourself in front of a police officer, don't make hasty statements. This isn't about "being a man," it's about protecting yourself from misinterpretation (or even an abuse of power).

[mishenka]

Originally Posted by patrickch

sometimes police DO abuse their power, about 20+ years ago, a friend of mine was riding on the hood of a very slow moving car, may be 5mph, being silly and all, someone saw him and called the police, I was not the driver nor riding on the hood, merely walking along side in the side walk, police came, all pissed off and have extremely attitude, may be because we are teenagers? asked my friend was he riding on the car, none of us said anything, we remained silence, I don;t know if not saying anything when police ask you is against the law or not? but since we don;t say anything, he got even more pissed off, then tell us to lined up on the hood of his patrol car, handcuffed us and put us in the back of his cruiser for an hour (may be more, lost track of time there), we were told that we were under arrest for "lying" to the police (namely, his fat cop ass). WTF?

Finally the Sergent arrived, after talking to the cop, he order his fat ass to let us go, cause we did nothing wrong, the only thing that was wrong was his attitude. well there goes being silent, bad cops can introduce his own evidents, and I am sure my case was not an isolated incident either

I am sure that Detective Mechanixhorseman above would call you a "toolbag" and prefer that you "man up and take responsibility"

[coh4777]

Great video and I'm glad I watched it! So going back to the OP's situation or any incident where there is an accident and you are at fault, when the cops show up they always pull each party aside and ask what happened. Sounds like you just stay silent and not give your side of the story, but then can't the police determine if you were at fault and if you committed a traffic violation and issue a citation based solely on the other party's account of the accident? I suppose you just let the police report be filed and citations be issued and let your lawyer sort it all out later?

Or alternatively, let's say you were definitely NOT at fault, and don't give your account of the accident. What if the police say you are at fault purely based on the other person's story? Doesn't this put you in a worse situation than if you tell your story and get it on the poice record?

[Delta0311]

Oh I learned a long time ago when dealing with cops
1. STFU
2. Never admit to ANYTHING (more or less just stick to number one)
3. COPS ARE NOT YOUR FRIENDS!!!

[coh4777]

Originally Posted by patrickch

sometimes police DO abuse their power, about 20+ years ago, a friend of mine was riding on the hood of a very slow moving car, may be 5mph, being silly and all, someone saw him and called the police, I was not the driver nor riding on the hood, merely walking along side in the side walk, police came, all pissed off and have extremely attitude, may be because we are teenagers? asked my friend was he riding on the car, none of us said anything, we remained silence, I don;t know if not saying anything when police ask you is against the law or not? but since we don;t say anything, he got even more pissed off, then tell us to lined up on the hood of his patrol car, handcuffed us and put us in the back of his cruiser for an hour (may be more, lost track of time there), we were told that we were under arrest for "lying" to the police (namely, his fat cop ass). WTF?

Finally the Sergent arrived, after talking to the cop, he order his fat ass to let us go, cause we did nothing wrong, the only thing that was wrong was his attitude. well there goes being silent, bad cops can introduce his own evidents, and I am sure my case was not an isolated incident either

Does anyone know how long a cop can legally detain you like that without actually arresting you? I guess maybe you do it liek the video where you ask "Are you arresting me or am I free to go now?"

[mechanixhorseman]

Originally Posted by mishenka

I am sure that Detective Mechanixhorseman above would call you a "toolbag" and prefer that you "man up and take responsibility"

Sort of a douchey thing to assume, wouldn't you say?

Based on those facts alone, the poster was in the right and the "fat cop" was in the wrong. Just because I work in law enforcement doesn't mean I think all cops are always in the right. Don't be a dipshit.

However your case, if you hit someone, you are well within your rights to not incriminate yourself and try to work the system to "get away with it", but it doesn't change the fact that you are still a toolbag.

[mishenka]

Originally Posted by mechanixhorseman

Sort of a douchey thing to assume, wouldn't you say?

Based on those facts alone, the poster was in the right and the "fat cop" was in the wrong. Just because I work in law enforcement doesn't mean I think all cops are always in the right. Don't be a dipshit.

However your case, if you hit someone, you are well within your rights to not incriminate yourself and try to work the system to "get away with it", but it doesn't change the fact that you are still a toolbag.

Sorry if I offended you with my assumption. But in my case, as you put it, although I was not the driver of either vehicle, the driver is (in any collision situation) a bit nervous, doesn't believe how it could happen, doesn't considered him/herself at fault, truly believes he/she did not cause the collision. But it seems (SEEMS) like the vehicle that backed up struck the vehicle that was driving along the road. But what if the car that drives along the road, in perpendicular to the backing up vehicle, goes with excessive speed, disregarding the speed bump, disregarding the already half backed up length of the other car!, the backing up driver genuinely never saw it coming despite the fact that the driver carefully observes the space behind, on the right, on the left sequentially, and that car (the perpendicular driving one) tries to avoid the collision in the last moment, steers a bit to the left but simply did not have enough time and instead of hitting the half backed up with its front collides into it with it's passenger rear quarter. And everything happens so fast that the driver of the backed up car might think "oops.. I hit someone with my rear bumper"... This is exactly what a stressed situation will do to you. And you might say to the officer "..I hit the car.. but..." But whatever you say after "but" is kind of irrelevant - you just admitted to something you do not completely understand at this particular moment.

So, you are free to call anyone a "toolbag" for exercising their rights -it's a free country But try not to be so offended and defensive when others are making a fair assumption about you based on what you say.

By the way - even you have the right to remain silent