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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum
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Battery Registration (inserting foot in mouth now)
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11-04-2010, 03:25 PM | #89 | |
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Here's a news flash: BMWs ARE EXPENSIVE TO MAINTAIN! They've just become expensive to maintain, they never were before. Never since they became mainstream in the 1980's were they expensive to maintain. Everyone should be suprised with this fact. |
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11-04-2010, 06:22 PM | #90 | |
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Dealer overheads and service costs are irrelevant to this argument.
Claiming and charging a time requirement of 3 hours for a 5 min job is fraud. The dealer is free to pull an arbitarily high total cost out of the air and charge it as a flat rate to get the same total cost, but it is illegal to claim time was spent working on something when infact it was not. Quote:
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11-04-2010, 08:48 PM | #91 | |
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It is not a 5 minute job. There are several people that are involved with the servicing of your car when it is at the dealer. The dealer has operating costs that he has to recover when these people get involved with processing your car through the service department. Instead of giving you an itemized bill for the Service Advisor's time, the car jockey's time, the proportioned cost of the GT1 computer system used to register the battery, the proportioned cost for the heat (or air conditioning) used to keep the service bay at the proper temperature, the proportioned cost for the lighting of the service bay - the SA desk - the cashier's desk, the cashier's time to bill you out, the accountant's time to reconcile your bill and payment at the end of the month, he just bills you for a flat hourly rate of the Tech's time, which includes all of the costs mentioned above. If you can't understand this simple concept of how a business works, it truly amazes me that you have the wherewithal to purchase, own, and operate a fine automobile such as a BMW. Whether (you think) the dealer charges a fair price is debateable, but the fact that he has to cover all these costs in the manner described, is not. |
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11-04-2010, 09:14 PM | #92 | |
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11-04-2010, 09:56 PM | #93 | |
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If no codes are being thrown use Chevron Techron fuel injector cleaner (concentrate). It solves rpm fluctuating upon cold start-up. Also, for most BMW problems start off by scanning your car with the Peake Research Tool. It contains the actual BMW codes. If you want to register a newly installed battery for free (just buy a $10 cable) and google/download BMWLogger
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11-05-2010, 01:41 AM | #94 |
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The extra cost of owning a 21st Century BMW
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11-05-2010, 02:19 AM | #95 |
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My car seems to be working fine without having it registered. I'm going to see if this BMW shop near me does it. If they do I'm sure it will not cost as much as a dealership. It would be nice if dealers had a flat fee for registering a battery. Also the dealer near me told me websites like this are BS and I should not listen to any advice given.
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11-05-2010, 04:59 AM | #96 |
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Jeez..another Battery thread...love it...at least I learned from this one...subscribed for the future...especially since I have a BT scan...
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11-05-2010, 07:26 AM | #97 | |
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Bzzzzztt.
This is illegal. People get prosecuted for doing this. Everyone understands there are overhead costs. Artificially inflating the time required to bump the total cost is still illegal. Quote:
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11-05-2010, 07:58 AM | #98 |
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If you are keeping your car for more than a couple years then DIY:
Bavtec tool enthusiast version less than $300 Bentley Service Manual at Amazon about $85 Both will quickly pay for themselves and continue to pay benefits. |
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11-05-2010, 08:34 AM | #99 | |
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The original post I responded to said he was quoted 1.7 hours. It seems a bit excessive, but 1 hour doesn't (and the poster probably should have negotiated for 1 hour of time). The dealer also has to warranty his work incase the Tech screws something up during the procedure. And it is not illegal, and not fraud, it is what the Dealer thinks his customers are willing to pay for the service. That is based on several factors, such as the customer's trust of the service department, the competition of other BMW repair facilities in the area, and the ability or inability of the customer having the knowledge and tools to do the procedure himself. If you wanted to do it yourself you'd have to have a $800 lap top, $300 BT scan tool, and the time and knowledge to perform the procedure. Do you think the better deal is for the dealer to charge $170 for the service, or you to spend $1,100 to get the equipment to do it yourself - at the risk of screwing up the ECU module by not properly performing the procedure? When BMW was selling the Z8 and dealers were charging $20K over MSRP, was that fraud? If he charged you for the service and did not perform the service, then that would be fraud. For the 90% of BMW owners, who are well off and uninterested in having deep involvement the actual maintenance of their BMW, just pay the dealer to install the battery. The dealer is going to operate his business in a manner that satisfies highest percentage of his customers. |
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11-05-2010, 11:30 AM | #100 | |
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11-05-2010, 11:46 AM | #102 |
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LOL at this whole thread, good read. I didn't mean to start a war but thanks to the guys who understood what I was trying to say. I'm surprised no one threw in a off topic or thread jack icon.
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11-05-2010, 01:40 PM | #103 | |
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If, on the other hand, if my hourly rate reflected my high overhead costs, then I can bill 1 hour for 1 hour of work. Clients can then decide if my rate is reasonable. If its not, they'll go elsewhere. Either way, I can only bill for time spent, regardless of overhead or high expenses. And ENINTY - what's up with the personal attacks? Chill bro. |
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11-06-2010, 07:26 AM | #104 | |
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In the auto repair business the book-rate for a particular repair is ALWAYS over estimated. Every professional auto mechanic tries to (and usually does) beat the book hour estimate because he gets paid by the job, not hourly, and the more jobs he can do in a day makes him more money. The reason for this is because not every repair goes as planned and the car may need to come back in for additional (repair-warranty) work on the repair job that the mechanic then has to do for free (because he was already paid for the job). There is no way you’d ever go to a mechanic and agree to pay him by the hour to make a repair on your car; it is why professional auto repair facilities quote you an estimated price for the job. It is why the auto insurance industry instilled the “book rate” concept for repairs, because the insurance company can’t control the cost of the repair if the mechanic is charging by the hour. I'm not saying the dealer is not probably making a good deal of profit on the battery registration, because he is. I'm not trying to justify it either; I'm mererly trying to explain it. One of the vary reasons I bought my BT scan tool was so I could register the battery in my car when the time comes to replace it. |
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11-06-2010, 10:06 AM | #105 | |
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The problem is that many shops are just plain stupid or don't explain the pricing properly. If the dealer tells me that a repair will cost me $170 then I can decide if that is worth it to me. If they tell me that it'll cost 1.7 hours @$100 an hour then I can understand that too. I understand the book rate too, but it is hard to justify a 1.7 hour book rate when they hand the car back to you 15 minutes later. |
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11-07-2010, 06:47 AM | #106 | |
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11-07-2010, 09:00 AM | #107 | |
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While a mechanic may get a bonus for doing jobs under book time they certainly don't get paid book time or a fixed percentage of book time. |
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11-07-2010, 04:07 PM | #108 |
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I don't want to get in the middle of this but, believe me techs do get paid "book time" of their hourly wage, at least they do here in Canada, I own a shop and I'm a tech and if one of my guys does a job that pays 2.0hr (book time) in 15 minutes or 4 days he gets paid 2.0hr x hourly wage, which say is $30.00 equalling $60.00. The shop billed those 2 hours out at $100, making them $200.00 minus the techs wage. Its called flat rate, this is not new.
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11-07-2010, 06:03 PM | #109 |
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battery registration
The discussion of the economics of what a dealer should charge is a waste of time. preaching, or whining, about it is not going to change it one iota. The solution is simple, if you don't like it, don't pay it. Find an indie mechanic, diy, or get an Acura as someone stated. To get any info from this thread requires skipping over a lot of those BS comments. But there is still some good info in this thread.
Back to the original issue, as I understand from the gems of actual info pertaining to the subject on this thread, registration appears to be just that. A recording of the event. The dealer may also clear faults but doing so is a separate event. It seems logical that operating with a dying battery may cause the recording of faults? As for the dead battery of the contributor from Tucson, my experience with living in the Sonoran Desert (Phx), is that the extreme weather kills batteries quickly. I thought the cold weather of the upper Midwest was hard on batteries, but it is nothing like the desert's extreme heat. I am glad my car's battery is not under the hood with the heat from the turbos. I learned here that my 335 has an AGM battery, but there appears to be conflicting info as to whether this is an advantage or disadvantage in the heat. My car passed its fourth BD in July so it will be interesting to see how long the battery lasts. The SLA battery in our 2004 Acura TL lasted just over four years. When a new battery is needed I will replace it with an AGM, from the dealer or otherwise. I may even register it. By the then I may have the tool to do so. A couple of anecdotes of my own. I agree that my 335 is over engineered and over complicated, but it is SO MUCH MORE FUN than the TL, I plan to keep it as long as I can. I had to get my car towed to the tire shop when one of the run flats chose to no longer run. From what the tire guy says the run flats do not care for the heat either. And the tow truck driver regaled me with his experiences picking up big BMWs and Benzs with electronic emergency brakes. He said when those batteries fail, they lock the brakes. The tow truck has to drag it out of where it is parked and on to the truck. |
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11-07-2010, 06:50 PM | #110 | ||
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+1 Last edited by SCA; 11-07-2010 at 06:57 PM.. |
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