[Lifted07Duramax]

The VRSF looks better and costs quite a bit less.
http://www.vr-speed.com/performance/...-335i-171.html

Does anyone have any experience with both? Or maybe tell me why the AP costs so much more than the VRSF

[psmitty95]

I don't usually post this but

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

I believe he mentioned AP which would be Agency Power. Not many people push the Agency Power lineup or run them.

[E90Company]

I would look at the BMS downpipes over the VRSF's. The quality of the pipes are almost a ten-fold increase over the VRSF's, they have perfect fitment, and the welds look amazing. It also looks like actual quality stainless, unlike VRSF's polished (almost to hide something which can be seen on the inside. The metal is crap) finish. I personally couldn't tell the difference between these or Macht Schnell/AR downpipes. The inside of the pipes is also butter smooth with nothing inside them (On VRSF pipes I have seen rust and rough edges inside). They even come with gaskets that are basically OEM+, and don't have any of the reported issues AR's gaskets do.

Best part of it all is they were 415$ shipped. That and Terry's service is amazing, if you ever were to have an issue he would fix it instantly. Here is a picture of mine before they went on:

Also attatched are pictures of VRSF downpipes from a quick google search on a VRSF downpipe review (clicked the first link that popped up) Here you can see the metal quality as well as rust and rough insides. In that review it also shows a bent-to-fit pipe where the V-Band connects. Not good.

[Tiago@VRSF]

Originally Posted by E90Company

I would look at the BMS downpipes over the VRSF's. The quality of the pipes are almost a ten-fold increase over the VRSF's, they have perfect fitment, and the welds look amazing.

I've seen the BMS pipes first hand and I have first hand experience with their manufacturer of these pipes. Our welds are almost identical and the weld slag left inside each pipe is similar depending on the pipe. The only difference is the finish and place of manufacture. They use a brushed steel finish and are made in Taiwan vs our pipes made with stainless steel and made in China. Taiwan as well as many countries in Asia import their steel from China so you're dead in that water with that one.

Originally Posted by E90Company

It also looks like actual quality stainless, unlike VRSF's polished (almost to hide something which can be seen on the inside. The metal is crap) finish.

The brushed finish you see on the BMS pipes follow the same process as ours, where material is removed from the surface. Please stop misinforming the public if you don't have first hand experience with manufacturing.

Originally Posted by E90Company

I personally couldn't tell the difference between these or Macht Schnell/AR downpipes.

The BMS DP's and the MS are manufactured in the same factory.

Also, I'm sure Andrew would disagree with that AR statement.

Originally Posted by E90Company

The inside of the pipes is also butter smooth with nothing inside them (On VRSF pipes I have seen rust and rough edges inside). They even come with gaskets that are basically OEM+, and don't have any of the reported issues AR's gaskets do. Also attached are pictures of VRSF downpipes from a quick google search on a VRSF downpipe review (clicked the first link that popped up) Here you can see the metal quality as well as rust and rough insides. In that review it also shows a bent-to-fit pipe where the V-Band connects. Not good.

You're going to take high contrast/flash pictures of the insides of our pipe and compare them to the outside of a different pipe? Of course they aren't going to look the same. How bout you show the same picture of any downpipe that has a welded flange. It'll look the same.

What you're looking at is the cleanup from the welds that penetrated through the pipe. This is done to ensure the longevity of the pipe and it's cleaned up in order to help flow. Does it look pretty in that picture? No. Does the aesthetic matter in terms of performance? Absolutely not.

[Tiago@VRSF]

Also, here's some reviews that we gathered from the forums based on member's experiences with our downpipes:

http://www.vr-speed.com/vrsf-3-stain...l#product-tabs

Here's some pics I took of a random DP at the shop to try to calm the guys who clearly have an agenda:



Here's the Google images feed of most of our downpipes. Unaltered with nothing to hide:

https://www.google.com/search?q=vrsf...w=1769&bih=897

And here's some professional pictures of our downpipes. There are no edits to the DP's themselves to make them appear any more attractive than they currently are.






Also, I'd really like to apologize to the OP. I didn't mean to hijack your thread and throw your search off track, I just can't let these claims stand without getting an honest word in.

[fasteddie222]

[Tiago@VRSF]

...

[E90Company]

Originally Posted by Tiago@VRSF

Who's we?

We as in all forum members. We are not vendors and have nothing to sell, as I said. So when a forum member makes a comment about a product, there is no motive of a sale behind it. Deleted my comment out of respect for your business.

[Lifted07Duramax]

No need to apologize about a thread jack, this is the kind of replies I like to see.
Is VRSF a true 3"? I see the AP goes down to 2.6" which is no big deal really just wondering

Also do you have any dyno graphs of an installed VRSF downpipe on a stock 335i and/or one with a JB4 and what map was it running

Dumb question here, does having a catless downpipe increase intake temps?

[E90Company]

Originally Posted by Lifted07Duramax

No need to apologize about a thread jack, this is the kind of replies I like to see.
Is VRSF a true 3"? I see the AP goes down to 2.6" which is no big deal really just wondering

Also do you have any dyno graphs of an installed VRSF downpipe on a stock 335i and/or one with a JB4 and what map was it running

Dumb question here, does having a catless downpipe increase intake temps?

All downpipes taper to just under 2.5" to match the factory catback. Dyno graphs between downpipes will all show similar gains if not the exact same. Downpipes don't increase IAT's

[Juicer]

I have owned and self installed both the AR (on a my previpous 135i) and the VRSF (on my current 335i). Both installed fine. Basically the same.

For my AR pipes it was slightly hard to screw in one of the O2 sensors. On the VRSF it took a few minutes more to line up the midpipes.

Sound is the same. The dimensions are the same. Both are 3" at the turbo end and taper to about 2.5 at the midpipes.

I think both AR and VRSF are good pipes. I went with the VRSF on my latest n54 based on price. No real advantage that I could see with the AR pipes. Same basic thing IMO.

[racerg35335]

Pay more if if want to put the name in your sig ..put ar ap. Etc. If you want the same performance for less buy vrsf/ Bms... its simple and I do not own either. No fitment issues from any.

[BEAR-AvHistory]

Once upon a time there was one vendor of DP’s who could charge whatever they wanted & they did. Now there are many vendors so the law of supply & demand swings toward more supply = lower price. To pay $800 for two pieces of pipe seem IMHO to be nutz. The “you get what you pay for” comes out a lot in defending an overpriced commodity item.

Interesting that one vendor said two pipes that competes with his come out of the same factory Mach Schnell @$600 & BMS @ $375. Wonder what the extra $275 you get what you pay for buys you? When you are buying a commodity item if they fit, accessories like O2 sensors go in easy & the specs for diameter are the same why would you not go for the best price?

Check with installers to see what pipes they had trouble with, stay away from those & buy the least expensive of what is left.

[Lifted07Duramax]

Just like with vettes screw spending 1500 on headers when a good pair can be had for 750.
I hate the pay for what you get statement. All Bout reviews IMO

[psmitty95]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

I believe he mentioned AP which would be Agency Power. Not many people push the Agency Power lineup or run them.

Whoops your right I skipped over it and read AR instead...


Well anyways OP I have the VRSF downpipes and couldn't be more pleased. They were inexpensive and had perfect fitment along with looking like they were high quality. The funny thing is mine wasn't even a production set, I was the one test fitting for xi but they still looked great and fit perfectly. I posted a review a little while ago which has some pictures in case you want to check it out. I'd highly recommend VRSF for both their pipes and the customer service that Tiago provides. I've emailed Tiago countless times and he replies extremely fast and always answers all my questions. They are backed by a lifetime warranty so if anything somehow goes wrong you're covered.

Review:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=756178

[The Ghost]

This topic has never been covered before.

[Lifted07Duramax]

Originally Posted by The Ghost

This topic has never been covered before.

Kind of hard to do a search on the forums with only two letters AP

[Tiago@VRSF]

To be honest this topic hasn't really been talked about in the past simply because AP's aren't very popular. A majority of the people in here (including myself) assumed the the title stated AR vs AP.

[Deemo]

Originally Posted by Lifted07Duramax

Kind of hard to do a search on the forums with only two letters AP

try "agency power downpipes", if you really want to go with those. But imo look used to see if you can find any good deals. They're just metal pipes after all. Just don't get raceland dps. They all pretty much do the exact same and provide very similar gains. I picked up Active Autowerke pipes for $320 off here.

[Lifted07Duramax]

Originally Posted by Deemo

try "agency power downpipes", if you really want to go with those. But imo look used to see if you can find any good deals. They're just metal pipes after all. Just don't get raceland dps. They all pretty much do the exact same and provide very similar gains. I picked up Active Autowerke pipes for $320 off here.

Right now VRSF is offering their downpipe and intercooler for $758 shipped, thats the price of some DPs alone

[Envuks]

Did a bunch of posts get deleted in this thread? Seems odd...

Mainly mine. I don't feel like I said anything against forum rules.

I did express how happy I was with my vrsf downpipes. So much so that I'm not sure why anyone would buy any DP other than vrsf