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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > NA Engine (non-turbo) / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > PBX vs AA



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      01-13-2011, 09:31 PM   #1
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PBX vs AA

im trying to do some work under the hood on my n52... first things first i was thinking about throwing a chip in it... now i know powerbox is under 300... but is the 500 dollars i will spend for the active autowerkz mod be that much worth it? i was also thinking about an intake... what would u recommend for me ? thanks alotttt
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      01-13-2011, 09:49 PM   #2
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As far as intake goes, just do a carbon filter delete and get an afe drop in and scoops. Cold air intakes sound good but don't do much.
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      01-13-2011, 11:26 PM   #3
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AA is better then PBX .. AA is a real tune.
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      01-13-2011, 11:48 PM   #4
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2 things you should automatically shit can from your mind right now: PBX and CAI.

I just UNINSTALLED an aFe stage 2 CAI because I lost a ton of power with it on my car. I removed the PBX after 3 weeks because it made absolutely no difference at the track.

If you want to get some real power go for the AA or OE tunes. Personally I would do exhaust before either of those. Contact Craven 328 on this board from MMW and ask for pricing on his headers and muffler. Sweetest sounding and best bang for the buck. After you do that you can get the tune modified for running with the free flowing exhaust setup you're running, that way you can maximize your gains.

As Anthony said, Carbon Filter Delete, Scoops, and K&N Drop in for your intake. That's all you need. Unless you decide to do a 3 stage manifold swap. Gotta shell out some serious cash for that though.

Hope this helps.
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      01-14-2011, 02:12 AM   #5
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Only annoying problem about a flash tune, is that every time BMW does an 'update' - they erase your custom tune and it needs to be reloaded

In the case where you have to send your ECU in for aftermarket flash, since you are not local to tuning company, this is a real PITA

I've never before seen a car company that has such a love for reprogramming the car every frackin time you bring it in. I have it in writing in my service records that no reprogramming can be done without my signature 1st. But sooner or later there is gonna be an update that I will prolly need to have done.

Hell, I've had my custom tune in my GM's (and constantly tweak them) for 10 yrs without ever having to worry about it being overwritten.

With my GM's I have the tuning software - so actually I could reload it at will if I ever needed to...
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      01-14-2011, 02:46 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1QuikWS6 View Post
Only annoying problem about a flash tune, is that every time BMW does an 'update' - they erase your custom tune and it needs to be reloaded

In the case where you have to send your ECU in for aftermarket flash, since you are not local to tuning company, this is a real PITA

I've never before seen a car company that has such a love for reprogramming the car every frackin time you bring it in. I have it in writing in my service records that no reprogramming can be done without my signature 1st. But sooner or later there is gonna be an update that I will prolly need to have done.

Hell, I've had my custom tune in my GM's (and constantly tweak them) for 10 yrs without ever having to worry about it being overwritten.

With my GM's I have the tuning software - so actually I could reload it at will if I ever needed to...
You didn't happen to be on LS1tech before this, were you? Could swear I've seen your T/A before on there back when I had mine.

Anyway, once the EZflash module gets released, its gonna make this PITA a hell of a lot easier to deal with. Stupid stealerships...
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      01-14-2011, 03:34 AM   #7
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Actually, yes I spent a lot of time over the years on that forum - same car in my sig, same handle.

I still have that car and after 35k+ in mods over the $27K I spent on the car, I pretty much am done and have it where I want it. Especially after the Lingenfelter built 427 install

I still love the design of that car and the power/handling - not gonna ever get rid of it. It's now 11 yrs old with only 34k miles on it & you don't see many of them at the car shows any more. I told my wife to just bury me in that car in one big box...

Who were you over there & what did you have? Why'd you get rid of it?

I currently have the PBX, and happy with it for what it is - but obviously would go for a full out tune if it was EZ to reload yourself. After years of playing with the LS tuning software & getting good at it - I don't think I could go through that again with BMW tuning.

I understand there's only so much you can do with the N52, but I'm not looking to go to great extremes on the BMW as I did on my LS cars as it is simply my DD.

What's this EZFlash you speak of? 1st I heard of it
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      01-14-2011, 08:06 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1QuikWS6 View Post
Only annoying problem about a flash tune, is that every time BMW does an 'update' - they erase your custom tune and it needs to be reloaded

In the case where you have to send your ECU in for aftermarket flash, since you are not local to tuning company, this is a real PITA

I've never before seen a car company that has such a love for reprogramming the car every frackin time you bring it in. I have it in writing in my service records that no reprogramming can be done without my signature 1st. But sooner or later there is gonna be an update that I will prolly need to have done.

Hell, I've had my custom tune in my GM's (and constantly tweak them) for 10 yrs without ever having to worry about it being overwritten.

With my GM's I have the tuning software - so actually I could reload it at will if I ever needed to...
To be honest they would have to deliberately flash the ECU. You will not lose your tune if they just do a firmware/ software update. I hear this so many times, and it is simply UNTRUE. Please don't worry guys, you would have to have an ECU/ engine specific issue in order for them to mess with that aspect of your modding.
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      01-14-2011, 08:09 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlpineSwift View Post
2 things you should automatically shit can from your mind right now: PBX and CAI.

I just UNINSTALLED an aFe stage 2 CAI because I lost a ton of power with it on my car. I removed the PBX after 3 weeks because it made absolutely no difference at the track.

If you want to get some real power go for the AA or OE tunes. Personally I would do exhaust before either of those. Contact Craven 328 on this board from MMW and ask for pricing on his headers and muffler. Sweetest sounding and best bang for the buck. After you do that you can get the tune modified for running with the free flowing exhaust setup you're running, that way you can maximize your gains.

As Anthony said, Carbon Filter Delete, Scoops, and K&N Drop in for your intake. That's all you need. Unless you decide to do a 3 stage manifold swap. Gotta shell out some serious cash for that though.

Hope this helps.
+1. NIGHT and DAY difference from the piggyback PBX and the AA tune. Owned both. AA FTW
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      01-14-2011, 08:12 AM   #10
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My bad

I guess I'm old school and so used to working on cars that only have ONE ECU that controls the engine - therefore any flash would overwrite the engine parameters.

Our cars have many modules to program that could be updated that have absolutely nothing to do with the actual engine parameters so updating them would have no effect on engine tune
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      01-14-2011, 12:16 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1QuikWS6 View Post
Actually, yes I spent a lot of time over the years on that forum - same car in my sig, same handle.

I still have that car and after 35k+ in mods over the $27K I spent on the car, I pretty much am done and have it where I want it. Especially after the Lingenfelter built 427 install

I still love the design of that car and the power/handling - not gonna ever get rid of it. It's now 11 yrs old with only 34k miles on it & you don't see many of them at the car shows any more. I told my wife to just bury me in that car in one big box...

Who were you over there & what did you have? Why'd you get rid of it?

I currently have the PBX, and happy with it for what it is - but obviously would go for a full out tune if it was EZ to reload yourself. After years of playing with the LS tuning software & getting good at it - I don't think I could go through that again with BMW tuning.

I understand there's only so much you can do with the N52, but I'm not looking to go to great extremes on the BMW as I did on my LS cars as it is simply my DD.

What's this EZFlash you speak of? 1st I heard of it




Meet Alice. '99 Trans Am A4. Sold her with just over 44K miles on the clock because I couldn't get around in the winter time. I was in high school then and couldn't afford a second car for the winter. What a mistake that was. I still think its been the best car I've ever owned. BMR Drop Springs, Suncoast WS6 hood and box, 30th Anniversary Stripes, Blacked out turn signals, sidemarkers, and 3rd brake light, Polished Center piece, Custom Dyno Tune, C6 Corvette 18" Black Chrome wheels, Vredestein Ultrac 275 rubber on all 4 corners, CETA Bumper. Was mostly a show car. Had plenty of power for me then. My handle is Heartbreak1 on Ls1tech. I still go there to look at the random pics thread. lol
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      01-14-2011, 01:51 PM   #12
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The AA is a customized tune that is optimal if you have aftermarket bolt ons. The PBX is a great off the shelf option but for a true tune, go with AA.
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      01-14-2011, 03:51 PM   #13
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Everything he says is Golden...

I AGREE HERE
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlpineSwift View Post
2 things you should automatically shit can from your mind right now: PBX and CAI.

I just UNINSTALLED an aFe stage 2 CAI because I lost a ton of power with it on my car. I removed the PBX after 3 weeks because it made absolutely no difference at the track.

If you want to get some real power go for the AA or OE tunes. Personally I would do exhaust before either of those. Contact Craven 328 on this board from MMW and ask for pricing on his headers and muffler. Sweetest sounding and best bang for the buck. After you do that you can get the tune modified for running with the free flowing exhaust setup you're running, that way you can maximize your gains.

As Anthony said, Carbon Filter Delete, Scoops, and K&N Drop in for your intake. That's all you need. Unless you decide to do a 3 stage manifold swap. Gotta shell out some serious cash for that though.

Hope this helps.
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      01-15-2011, 11:36 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlpineSwift View Post




Meet Alice. '99 Trans Am A4. Sold her with just over 44K miles on the clock because I couldn't get around in the winter time. I was in high school then and couldn't afford a second car for the winter. What a mistake that was. I still think its been the best car I've ever owned. BMR Drop Springs, Suncoast WS6 hood and box, 30th Anniversary Stripes, Blacked out turn signals, sidemarkers, and 3rd brake light, Polished Center piece, Custom Dyno Tune, C6 Corvette 18" Black Chrome wheels, Vredestein Ultrac 275 rubber on all 4 corners, CETA Bumper. Was mostly a show car. Had plenty of power for me then. My handle is Heartbreak1 on Ls1tech. I still go there to look at the random pics thread. lol
God that car is gorgeous
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      01-15-2011, 11:46 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick@Jlevi SW View Post
The AA is a customized tune that is optimal if you have aftermarket bolt ons. The PBX is a great off the shelf option but for a true tune, go with AA.
I agree the PBX is good too, of course it is not designed for anyone to gain any edge at the track.
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      01-15-2011, 02:17 PM   #16
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hey im on ls1tech same name as well. Modded WS6 to play with and a 2007 E92 328xi for the daily. im not planing on doing any tuning but will put the K&N drop in and carbon delete plus the bmw performance exhaust. here are my rides.



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      01-16-2011, 03:58 PM   #17
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Well, since we turned this into a T/A pic fest - here's mine:



















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      01-16-2011, 07:17 PM   #18
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niceeee
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      01-17-2011, 12:08 AM   #19
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That's the Steelers Black n Gold Tribute

What times do you run with those slicks? I can't get out of the 11's with those street tires shown - course I don't like to warm them up properly either since they're $300/tire
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      01-17-2011, 12:11 AM   #20
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well are you in the 11 with those street tires...i say that pretty fast. i was doing 12.30s when i was stock with a nitto. now with all my mods and the slicks its high 10s off the bottle
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      01-17-2011, 12:13 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1QuikWS6 View Post
That's the Steelers Black n Gold Tribute

What times do you run with those slicks? I can't get out of the 11's with those street tires shown - course I don't like to warm them up properly either since they're $300/tire
You need drag radials or slicks on different wheels for the track. Wouldn't hurt to have a set of V6 rear springs lying around to throw in when you want to go run either. Not real hard to swap rear springs on those cars.
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      01-17-2011, 12:27 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerflash View Post
well are you in the 11 with those street tires...i say that pretty fast. i was doing 12.30s when i was stock with a nitto. now with all my mods and the slicks its high 10s off the bottle
I had a sweet dual bottle NOS system at one time - decided not to install and went with a NA LS427 instead.

I don't take it to the track that often, so I'm no expert with the car in that aspect at all. Not very much traction off the line.

If you're running 10's with the stock size engine + NOS that ain't bad
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