[Insider]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Until now, we've done all our tuning work on my personal 335i. It was one of the earliest cars to the dealer. It never had its ECU updated with the programming update. And it saw a lot of the trial and error process during the tuning adventure. Everything from the boost control solenoid we used to how the Xede was installed as all custom one-off.

Today we finally had the opportunity to install the "kit" version of the Xede on a customer's car (imsambeen). This means that the Xede was installed right next to the ECU, under the ECU cover, away from prying eyes. There was absolutely no wire cutting, drilling or anything nonreversible involved. The Xede installation process itself took about 15 minutes.

Yesterday, Sam drove up from LA. The poor guy left LA at 2AM and meet up with me at the dyno shop in the morning. Having recently taken his car to the dealership for the ECU update, we were very curious as to how it would fair, in stock form, to my non-updated 335i (when it was stock, of course). The results varied between 264-270whp and 283-285lbft. This was 7-10whp and 5-6lbft less than my personal car. The differences are reasonably small and could possibly be accounted for by statistical variance. Or the ecu update is just a bit more conservative. Regardless of lower numbers or now, we're here to tune it! Not to pout over low baseline numbers

After the baseline dyno result, the work began. One of our fabricators built a full dual 2.5" exhaust. Just like the one on my car except that it had a X-pipe integrated in it (customer requested it). Sounded and looked nice.

The next morning, the Xede "kit" was installed. Then the tuning began. Running the same very Xede map that I run in my car, Sam's 335i put down 325whp and 350lb-ft of torque. Real close to what my car did. After some custom tuning, we got it to 330whp and 357lb-ft of torque. Just 3-4whp lower than mine. I suspect this is attributal to the X-pipe which does introduce some exhaust backpressure/turbulence compared to a fully divorced exhaust set-up. But for a car that started off making only 265whp and 283lb-ft of torque, I"m really happy with the results. Here the are:

Sam's 335i Stock Vs. Stg 1 (Xede and exhaust) [pls note that hp and torque axis are scaled differently]


One thing we found out during the testing is that non-Sport packaged cars wont rev out all the way to 7000rpm in 4th gear due to the lower max speed limiter. This is why the dyno graph only goes up to 6300rpm. Just gotta take my word for it since the bottom of the page got truncated by the printer

Just in case you want to compare Sam's Stg 1 car to my personal Stg 1 car (with sport package and higher speed limiter), check it out...

Sam's Stg 1 Vs. Shiv's Stg 1


Like mentioned earlier the only hardware difference between the two cars is that Sam's car had an X-pipe joining both exhaust pipes together whereas my exhaust is completely divorced all the way from turbo to tip. I suspect this is why Sam's car makes slightly less top end power. Although it's really hard to notice on the road

We have two more customer cars to tune this upcoming week (Xede only, no exhaust) and will report the results as they come in.

Cheers,
shiv
www.vishnutuning.com

I thought somewhere else you mentioned that you were getting 370 tq to the rear wheels between 2500-4500rpm. Why don't you apply that method to the stage 1 kit?

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by roller84

Was Sam's car a stick or auto?

Also, what are the chance's that you will release an exhaust for the E90 335i?

Sam's car was Stick. Just like ours. As mentioned earlier, the only difference was that his was non-Sport, had the ECU update and an X-pipe in the exhaust.

We will be offering an exhaust for the sedan as well. Just a matter of time. I haven't even seen a sedan 335i yet.

As far as upcoming customers go, any of those cars auto?

btw, graph looks great. gains look promising. I really want to see the result without the exhaust(stg 0). If I do get my hands on the 335i, I really don't want exhaust...

I don't think any of the cars next week are auto. I could be wrong though. We'll see soon enough. The exhaust by itself isn't a big power gainer. We only saw 10whp and 10lbft of torque with it. Really not worth it by itself unless you want the car to be louder than stock. With the XEDE, though we're able to take advantage of the reduced back pressure and make some big gains. Next week, we'll see what we can make with just the XEDE (and stock exhaust). No need to speculate right now.

imsambeen, where are you!!!!!

Probably sleeping after his 6hr drive home last night. The probably didn't get home until 3am. Some people actually spend their time away from computers on Sundays

I thought somewhere else you mentioned that you were getting 370 tq to the rear wheels between 2500-4500rpm. Why don't you apply that method to the stage 1 kit?

As mentioned earlier, those results were off of my car on another Dynojet I visited last month. All the result above, for both my and Sam's car, have been off of the Modacar Dynojet which is conservatively calibrated. Besides, I use my car to push the envelope. Cusomters only get tunes which are tested and conservative. Unless they ask for balls out, of course.

-shiv

[sstarch1]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Some people actually spend their time away from computers on Sundays

I dont understand that statement.

[wj4]

Wow, this is great gains for not so much money at all for sure. And I thought the Evo IX was easy to make power, lol.
I'm looking to get sell my Evo for a 335i and will contiue to buy vishnu products.

[Ado]

Amazing stuff, I just wish there was a place here in Toronto where we could get it installed.

Anyone here know any really good shop that mod's newer Bimmers?

[Kit523]

Originally Posted by Kit523

ok so, if i get the xede only right? and letting u guys tune the car, and there is sth wrong with the car all of the sudden and i am going to send the car back to the dealer, so i need to remove the xede but the problem is here, for the xede after remove do i need to tune it back to normal mode?

and how about this, after the fix from the dealer i wanna install the xede again....do i need to get it tune it again?

[sflgator]

Originally Posted by Kit523

The "tuned" Xede computer should already have the Xede maps set, so when you take it out and then put it back in, it will revert back to the Xede's tuned maps without retuning.

[OpenFlash]

ok so, if i get the xede only right? and letting u guys tune the car, and there is sth wrong with the car all of the sudden and i am going to send the car back to the dealer, so i need to remove the xede but the problem is here, for the xede after remove do i need to tune it back to normal mode?

and how about this, after the fix from the dealer i wanna install the xede again....do i need to get it tune it again?

Not sure I follow the first question. As for the second, no you do not need to reprogram the Xede again. The map(s) is/are stored in nonvolatile memory. They are not erased if you cut power or remove it temporarily.

-shiv

[Tropicool]

sounds great, looking forward to the numbers the Xede only puts out. I don't have enough money for the exhaust now, but i can make the xede work. I'm excited...hoping to be putting down 315 at the wheels without the exhaust

[RiXst3r]

Originally Posted by cantc0pe

sounds great, looking forward to the numbers the Xede only puts out. I don't have enough money for the exhaust now, but i can make the xede work. I'm excited...hoping to be putting down 315 at the wheels without the exhaust

+1

[imsambeen]

Originally Posted by sstarch1

P.S.

imsambeen, where are you!!!!!

Okay I just woke up. I wrote a review for all you guys on the general forums -- http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37060.

thanks for you concern

Sam

[sobriquet]

I'm sure this is a stupid question, but what's a XEDE? Is this some chip that supercedes the computer's engine management while attached? However you did it, those are amazing gains.

If you don't mind me asking, how much does does it cost to have done?

[Backattack]

Originally Posted by sobriquet

I'm sure this is a stupid question, but what's a XEDE? Is this some chip that supercedes the computer's engine management while attached? However you did it, those are amazing gains.

If you don't mind me asking, how much does does it cost to have done?

Is this a custom installation? I read that you mention that not all cars are the same and that you have to tune each one... how does that work once you get the production version going?

[Annette]

Hey Shiv, first of all, thanks for all of the great work you've been doing! I had a question for you. I live in Wyoming, and I don't even think we have a dyno in the state, which means I need to come to you. How long would you need me to stay in SF for you to do the install (both the XEDE and Exhaust) and tune?

[adriver]

Originally Posted by radgator1

Nice work again Shiv

Concerning this:

One thing we found out during the testing is that non-Sport packaged cars wont rev out all the way to 7000rpm in 4th gear due to the lower max speed limiter. This is why the dyno graph only goes up to 6300rpm.

Is there a reason why you wern't able to correct this and make the non-sport car the same as Sport by allowing it to rev to redline in 4th through 6th and get the speed limiter to 155. I recall you said you wouldn't remove the 155 limit but I can't see why you wouldn't tune the non-sp to match the Sp unless it adds a deal of complexity. Can you comment please.

Thanks, Kevin

x2. Ive already seen the wheels I want to add, and will probably lighten the seats up down the road also, but this rev limit and top speed limit alone would make me want to spend the extra 1k or so for sports package, but definately not if I dont have to, and can offset it towards the xede

[RiXst3r]

Originally Posted by adriver

x2. Ive already seen the wheels I want to add, and will probably lighten the seats up down the road also, but this rev limit and top speed limit alone would make me want to spend the extra 1k or so for sports package, but definately not if I dont have to, and can offset it towards the xede

He doesnt reflash the ecu, he is just using the xede to modify sensor inputs and outputs, to "trick" the stock ecu into creating more power.... a mod to remove the speed limiter would set off red flags, and not be "undetectable" like the xede currently is.

[thd13]

Looks awesome!!!

[herbz]

question: is the exhaust prototype only a cat-back? are there any future plans to implement a full TBE in the future? just curious what the differences between a single turbo TBE and a biturbo TBE would be. any brief clarification would be nice :_)

[adriver]

Originally Posted by RiXst3r

He doesnt reflash the ecu, he is just using the xede to modify sensor inputs and outputs, to "trick" the stock ecu into creating more power.... a mod to remove the speed limiter would set off red flags, and not be "undetectable" like the xede currently is.

Where did you get that out of what I said? I know that. I actually read every page and every post of his threads. My question, again, is I know shiv does not want to remove the top speed limiter completely, but will it atleast raise the rev limiter up to 7K, and the limiter from 130 to 155?

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by adriver

Where did you get that out of what I said? I know that. I actually read every page and every post of his threads. My question, again, is I know shiv does not want to remove the top speed limiter completely, but will it atleast raise the rev limiter up to 7K, and the limiter from 130 to 155?

It'll take a bit of work. And, to be honest, it's a safety/liability issue I'd rather not get into.

Shiv

[jgannonloans]

Hey Shiv, great work man, thats some good sh.t......if i wanted to get the Xede and catback i would have to come to you uh? i guess there wouldn't be a shop in LA to do the exhaust, at least one you know of. is the catback stainless? is it even worth it to do downpipes and cats?

[Tropicool]

dynos comming later today on the 335s with the xede only?

Looking forward to it!!