[Mr. 5]

BTW guys,
The last time I had a computer print out of an alignment was just after I installed the Performance dampers. I had an alignment done after the M3 wishbone links were installed but it was only a front end alignment and I didn’t have anything printed out.

So this time, I could finally compare the before and after of the camber that the M3 wishbone links added.
The M3 links added -.6 degrees to the left and -.5 degrees to the right giving the total camber to -.9 degrees on the left and -.8 degrees on the right. BTW, the tolerances are -1 degree to 1 degree.

[Fraggy]

OK, I went to a shop to have the rear wheel removed so that I could see the "T" number on the spring.

I have T4 in the rear as well as the front. I guess the ride height difference from Mr.5 could be related to weight on the car. I a stroller in the rear, a small box with car goodies, and a childs car seat in the rear. Its hard to believe that that little weight could make a difference, but I guess it does???

So, in summary, I have T4 front and rear.

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by Fraggy

OK, I went to a shop to have the rear wheel removed so that I could see the "T" number on the spring.

I have T4 in the rear as well as the front. I guess the ride height difference from Mr.5 could be related to weight on the car. I a stroller in the rear, a small box with car goodies, and a childs car seat in the rear. Its hard to believe that that little weight could make a difference, but I guess it does???

So, in summary, I have T4 front and rear.

But that wouldn't change the ride height of the front that much.
I only have a car seat in the back for my daughter, but no stroller.

Again, as far as your rear springs, the only thing that I could think of regarding the ride quality of the rear is if the rubber grommet at the bottom of the spring is backwards.

[Fraggy]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

But that wouldn't change the ride height of the front that much.
I only have a car seat in the back for my daughter, but no stroller.

Again, as far as your rear springs, the only thing that I could think of regarding the ride quality of the rear is if the rubber grommet at the bottom of the spring is backwards.

Do you think the height in the front is that different?? I just took some crappy cell phone pics (forgot to clean the lens) on the passengers front as well as the rears on both sides.

Passenger Front


Passenger Front


Passenger Rear


Driver Rear



Something I just thought of. Do you think that if you buy the springs separately from the rest of the kit, they send the T3 for the front thinking you are using ZSP springs?

[marconi118]

Does anyone knows if the shock from the performance Kit for 135i are the same as the one for e90 ?

And the springs ?

[Mr. 5]

My wheel gaps are completely oposite of yours.
My fronts are like your rears and my rears are like your fronts.
Look at my front pic again.

Originally Posted by Fraggy

Do you think the height in the front is that different?? I just took some crappy cell phone pics (forgot to clean the lens) on the passengers front as well as the rears on both sides.

Passenger Front


Passenger Front


Passenger Rear


Driver Rear



Something I just thought of. Do you think that if you buy the springs separately from the rest of the kit, they send the T3 for the front thinking you are using ZSP springs?

[Fraggy]

This is so strange. I dunno anymore. Luckily, I like how the car drives now, and I cant wait to see how the M3 sways help the handling.

[Mr. 5]

You know what man, we're probably on the same page here but we're probably taking the pictures from different heights.
I took my pictures with a flash this time.
Does it still look lower to you?
The order goes as follows:

Driver's Front
Driver's Rear
Passenger's Rear
Passenger's Front

I also added a couple full car shots since somebody asked for it.

[stressdoc]

Ha! I am in between you guys! I have more gap in front than mr. 5, but less than Fraggy. Go figure.

[Fraggy]

I think this picture shows it all. Your front is definitely a bit lower than mine, but the rear is also higher. At that angle, with the light so clearly showing the edge of the tires and the fenders, my rear would look nearly flush with hardly any gap. I will try to duplicate that tomorrow sometime. I think all our cars look great, even if they look a bit different.



Since you have T3 fronts and I have T4s, maybe the higher front on my car lowers the rear a little. Kinda like with coilovers when you lower one corner, it raises the opposite diagonal corner. At least that what I was taught.

Also, I am pleased to know that my rears were not installed upside down or anything since the T4 was reading the correct way

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by Fraggy

Also, I am pleased to know that my rears were not installed upside down or anything since the T4 was reading the correct way

This is great news!

[mwahlert]

mr. 5 your car looks great....if i knew for a fact my car would sit the same way with this performance kit i'd order it....but i'm affraid of the front being higher than the rear which would drive me out of my mind....

mr. 5 - my car is originally non sport automatic 335i - the kit from tischer includes springs, dampers, and a larger FRONT anti roll bar - but not a larger anti roll bar? is bmw's stance that its not needed even on the non sport package cars? i'd love to avoid having to drop the subframe - etc.... not an easy job in your garage..

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by mwahlert

mr. 5 your car looks great....if i knew for a fact my car would sit the same way with this performance kit i'd order it....but i'm affraid of the front being higher than the rear which would drive me out of my mind....

mr. 5 - my car is originally non sport automatic 335i - the kit from tischer includes springs, dampers, and a larger FRONT anti roll bar - but not a larger anti roll bar? is bmw's stance that its not needed even on the non sport package cars? i'd love to avoid having to drop the subframe - etc.... not an easy job in your garage..

Thanks for the props.
The anti roll bar that is sold by Tischer is the front bar and not the rear. The front is easy to install on ramps. This bar is actually the same bar that is on the convertible euro cars for stability. It is the same exact diameter but is a little stiffer due to the configuration.

[mwahlert]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

Thanks for the props.
The anti roll bar that is sold by Tischer is the front bar and not the rear. The front is easy to install on ramps. This bar is actually the same bar that is on the convertible euro cars for stability. It is the same exact diameter but is a little stiffer due to the configuration.

yes i understand the kit includes the front bar - but i'm wondering why it does not include the rear....

the rear bar on the zsp car is larger than the non sport package cars, is it not?

[marconi118]

Could someone look at the part number of each shock from the performance Kit?
In my 135i kit these are Front 6788886 +6788885 rear 6788889

I am really curious to see if 135i and 335i shocks are the same so that I can build them on my 335i

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by mwahlert

yes i understand the kit includes the front bar - but i'm wondering why it does not include the rear....

the rear bar on the zsp car is larger than the non sport package cars, is it not?

I used to think so, but it is the same bar.
If you look on realoem, both bars in the rear are 13mm.

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by marconi118

Could someone look at the part number of each shock from the performance Kit?
In my 135i kit these are Front 6788886 +6788885 rear 6788889

I am really curious to see if 135i and 335i shocks are the same so that I can build them on my 335i

I'm 99% sure that the 1 series performance kit is different than the 3 series.
These are my part numbers:

Fronts: 31318036553 31318036554
Rear: 33528036026

[mwahlert]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

I used to think so, but it is the same bar.
If you look on realoem, both bars in the rear are 13mm.

so when comparing zsp to non zsp

zsp car has larger front anti roll bar, different dampers and stiffer, lower springs... but the consensus is now that both cars use the same rear bar?

the bmw performance kit includes the zsp sized front sway bar for non zsp cars?

[marconi118]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

I'm 99% sure that the 1 series performance kit is different than the 3 series.
These are my part numbers:

Fronts: 31318036553 31318036554
Rear: 33528036026

These numbers are for the M suspension for E90, but what about the numbers for the BMW performance shocks you get with the kit?
Are you dealing with european E90? (Holland = orange country..)

I am from Luxembourg

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by marconi118

These numbers are for the M suspension for E90, but what about the numbers for the BMW performance shocks you get with the kit?
Are you dealing with european E90? (Holland = orange country..)

I am from Luxembourg

The euro e90 M performance is the same exact thing as the BMW performance dampers.
I verified that when I received my dampers.
They were the same part numbers.

IMO, BMW wanted to bring the euro M performance suspension to the states so they brought it over and called it "Performance".

[Mr. 5]

Originally Posted by mwahlert

so when comparing zsp to non zsp

zsp car has larger front anti roll bar, different dampers and stiffer, lower springs... but the consensus is now that both cars use the same rear bar?

the bmw performance kit includes the zsp sized front sway bar for non zsp cars?

You need to be carefull about using the word "larger" because the bar included in the new kit is not larger, but it may be stiffer.
The bar that is included is a different configuration, but it is still the same diameter of 26.5mm.

For example, the bar that comes with the 335 ZSP narrows in the middle to a smaller diameter of 26.5mm, but the M3 bar stays the same diameter throughout. Although the bar included in the kit is not the M3 bar, it might be close to the same configuration.

[mwahlert]

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

You need to be carefull about using the word "larger" because the bar included in the new kit is not larger, but it may be stiffer.
The bar that is included is a different configuration, but it is still the same diameter of 26.5mm.

For example, the bar that comes with the 335 ZSP narrows in the middle to a smaller diameter of 26.5mm, but the M3 bar stays the same diameter throughout. Although the bar included in the kit is not the M3 bar, it might be close to the same configuration.

in your opinion do you think i will notice a significant reduction in body roll w/ the bar included in the performance kit while leaving my rear non zsp bar in place? i would have no objection to replacing the rear bar if it wasn't so much damn work....

replacing just the front bar - will it help to reduce understeer?