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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > New & Preowned BMW Ordering / Pricing / Tracking Information Forum (including European Delivery) > Check my math / 335i Sedan Lease

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      01-01-2008, 05:04 PM   #1
First Lieutenant

Drives: 2013 M5 / Singapore Grey / DCT
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Arizona

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Check my math / 335i Sedan Lease

I attempted (and failed) to negotiate a lease deal w/ the only BMW dealer in my town (Tucson, AZ) yesterday. I'm posting the details here and on the edumunds lease thread to see if my deal seems crazy, and to get validation that I wasn't incorrect in my calculations.

Car Details:
* 335i Sedan w/ 6spd manual
+ ZSP Sport Package
+ ZPP Premium Package
+ iDrive Navigation
+ iPod /USB Adapter
+ Metallic paint (color: Sparkling Graphite Metallic, interior Gray / Burl Walnut trim)
(MSRP 46,900 including dest)

Lease: 3 Year (36 Month) / 12k/year. $3000 out of pocket.

After an hour of back and forth (they started out at $732 w/ tax), they came out with two pieces of paper with lease numbers on them. The first piece of paper had the dollar amounts for the lease, the second had stuff like taxes, money factor, residual on it. At one point I pulled out my PDA w/ pocket excel and wrote the #'s down off their sheet (not sure that they liked me doing that).

I offered them $44900 ($2000 off MSRP) to start with. They "accepted" this but then added $825 to that for the "aquisition fee".

================================================== =====
Paper #1: Money Factor .0020, Residual 63%.

Paper #2:
Doc Fee $239 (bogus?)
License $665 (this is accurate)
Dwn Pmt Sales Tax $108
First Pmt $652
Total $1661

Lease Numbers:
MSRP $46900
Sale Price $45725 -- they added an $825 aquisition fee here
Residual Amount $29547
Capcost Reduction $1339 -- My 3k after taking out those fees.
Net Cap Cost $44386
Total Depreciation $14839
Depreciation fee $412
Finance Fee $188 -- This seems bogus to me! this is not @ .0020 MF?
Monthly Payment $652
================================================== ==========

Tax is 8.1%...

At this point I argued that "Paper #2" must have not used .0020 as the money factor, in fact it looks like they used .0025. The salesman threw me a sheet of paper, actually a printout from edmunds.com, on how a lease is calculated and said "All leases are calculated the same, look for yourself, your calculations are wrong". So I told him to use his calculator and the formula on the paper he printed out:

(Negotiated Price + Residual Value) * Money Factor = Finance Fee.

He did and when it came out to $147 he put away the paper and said "well we don't do leases like that, we use the computer." and stepped away.

At this point I think I pissed them off, he brought out the "general manager" who said he was "already feeling bad about this deal" and he had "never seen a price this low with so little profit in his 16 years at BMW".

I told him I couldn't buy a car with these numbers not adding up, and he insisted along with the salesman that the MF was .0020 and I was wrong. So I walked. He also claimed that they have only $2800 in margin to work with and I was already 'getting' $2000 of that. That doesn't match up with the invoice information readily available.

I dont think I was wrong.. besides the stupid fees, which I dont think are legit, They were doing two shady things:

#1 -- not being truthful about the money factor
#2 -- adding the aquisition fee to the negotiated price, which means it then
increases the term depreciation! Fees dont depreciate, the car does.

I really believe $590 a month is possible with $3k out of pocket, does that seem crazy?
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      01-01-2008, 10:20 PM   #2

Drives: 335xi/6MT/Sport- SOLD
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Woodside, CA

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I am not sure I followed your history very well, but to respond to the last line- I would think that is reasonable.

I just leased an 07 335xi with sticker of $49,500 (nearly identical specs as yours other than the xi- even the colors are the same), driveaway $1300 and monthly of $585 including sales tax. 33 months, 12K per year. The MF was 0.0019

When I tried do do the same lease on an 08 in order to spec my 1st choice colors, the number increased to $645 (higher MF, less disounting).
07 335xi SG/Gray/6MT/ZSP/ZPP/ZCW/Nav/CA/162's SOLD
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      01-02-2008, 12:04 AM   #3
First Lieutenant

Drives: 2013 M5 / Singapore Grey / DCT
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Arizona

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That is encouraging, was your car on the lot? I wonder if ordering has any effect. From the other place I posted this I now realize that adding the acquisition fee to the sale price makes no difference because either way it takes away from my cap-cost reduction.

But I guess (based on internet info) the aquisition fee is 625 so they were adding $200, and they seem to have had the MF at .00255 and an additional .00015 for waiving a security deposit.
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      01-02-2008, 05:01 AM   #4

Drives: 2014 Tesla P85D
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Gilbert, AZ

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I just wanted to say good job on walking out... Sounds like a B.S. dealership.

I had a similar experience with my Audi lease. I negotiated a price on the car, and when I walked in to sign I had my laptop with me, and sure enough none of their numbers worked out. I was ready to walk because they weren't using the right MF, and had increased their profit from "$1000 over invoice" to "$1200 over invoice".

Salesmen probably hate informed customers, and I think leasing is the most dangerous thing someone can do without being informed. A lot of people just work with "How much per month" which gives them so many opportunities to build in some bullcrap fees, often even above MSRP! At least with a purchase, the worst "scam" they can do is give you a high interest rate which you can renegotiate or bring your own bank in for...
Was: 2008 335xi sedan 6MT Black Sapphire Metallic
Is: 2014 Tesla P85D (Blue Metallic)
Wife's: 2013 Infiniti G37 S sedan 6MT, Black
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      01-02-2008, 10:40 PM   #5
Second Lieutenant

Drives: E60 M5
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Chevy Chase, MD

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Please check my post that I just updated regarding my lease horror story while I was signing the papers.
Just to let you know I leased an 08 335i sedan. The sticker was $49,350 and negotiated $2500 off of that. There is also a 5% sales tax on top of that plus security deposit and tags. I put down $2k and my lease payment is $662
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