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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > *NEW* Stock Turbo World Record, 500rwhp 540rwtq!!!



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      04-03-2015, 04:47 PM   #1
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New stock turbo World Record
Well got it done today as promised with Terry helping me dyno tune. 80F rainy and muggy outside, plenty of humidity, and it didn't matter, got the new WR thanks to the MMP turbo intakes! Will post more data later but here is the dyno picture for now. This was on my own personal daily driver car with 90k miles on it, 2007 6AT 335i coupe. Also ran leak down on it recently and 2 cylinders are at about 20% so not the most power producing engine out there Click here to enlarge A healthier engine will definately see more power.

power mods:
MMP turbo intakes
JB4 custom tuning backend and user settings
fuel-it stage 2 LPFP
dual meth injection
DPs without cats
Big Tom intercooler
TFT charge pipe
custom 3" intercooler up pipe
NGK .022" gapped spark plugs

fuel:
straight E85

run 21 is 4th gear, run 23 is 5th gear.

oh and this is on a 6AT with 3% more drivetrain loss than MT. Adjusted for MT drivetrain loss, this would be 512whp

Previously I had my car tuned to the absolute max on the dyno and my results in 4th gear was 447whp and in 5th gear was 456whp. I was running 100% E85 and the same amount of meth. All I did was change to the MMP intakes and dyno tune for the added performance of these intakes and I made 490whp in 4th and 500whp in 5th. That is a delta of +43whp in 4th and +44whp in 5th, pretty consistent. If you look at the logs where max HP is made for each Dyno pull, this is done with a delta of 3psi for these gains, pretty awesome gains for only 3psi! Also the conditions on the dyno prior to inlets was a Density altitude of 1208 ft and on the dyno day with the new inlets was 2873 ft so alot worse in DA, it was a hot muggy day, I told Terry I didn't think we could hit the record on that day but he urged me on to keep the dyno appt, glad he did

So with the same car, maxed tuned for each setup, on the same dyno, and with worse conditions, here are actual deltas and results, not speculations based on different cars, different drivetrains, different dynos, etc, etc, etc leading to bad conclusions

below is the comparison plot of max effort dyno comparison pre and post MMP intakes all else equal. 1st log below is the log for the the dyno pre MMP intakes with max effort tuning. 2nd log below is the log for the dyno post MMP intake installation with max effort tuning.

As you can see, the top end is where the MMP intakes shine and net +44 max whp and +56 whp at 6k rpm and also broadened the power band by shifting the max hp up by 200 rpm and alot more area under the curve. Not only that, I am able to maintain at least 500 ft lbs from 3200-5250 rpm.

You can see from the dyno logs before MMP intakes WGDC was 100% maxed out at 5500 rpm and only holding 20.8psi taper to 16.5psi, turbos completely tapped out! After MMP intakes WGDC only gets to 86% at 5700 rpm and able to make 25 psi, taper to 21.6 and back up to 22.6psi. This clearly shows with Dyno data and logs that there is a HUGE performance gain on stock turbos by upgrading to the MMP intakes!

Edit 6/21/16
More info about MMP inlets and how to
Purchase can be found here:
www.MMP-e.com
This thread is filled with old info and pricing about the inlets. They are much cheaper now and a 100% complete kit ready to go and make power.
Attached Images
    

Last edited by MM Performance; 04-05-2015 at 01:12 AM.
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      04-03-2015, 04:56 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlickSilver
New stock turbo World Record
Well got it done today as promised with Terry helping me dyno tune. 80F rainy and muggy outside, plenty of humidity, and it didn't matter, got the new WR thanks to the MMP turbo intakes! Will post more data later but here is the dyno picture for now. This was on my own personal daily driver car with 90k miles on it, 2007 6AT 335i coupe. Also ran leak down on it recently and 2 cylinders are at about 20% so not the most power producing engine out there Click here to enlarge A healthier engine will definately see more power.

power mods:
MMP turbo intakes
JB4 custom tuning backend and user settings
fuel it stage 2 LPFP
dual meth injection
DPs without cats
Big Tom intercooler
TFT charge pipe
custom 3" intercooler up pipe
NGK .022" gapped spark plugs

fuel:
straight E85

run 21 is 4th gear, run 23 is 5th gear.

oh and this is on a 6AT with 3% more drivetrain loss than MT. Adjusted for MT drivetrain loss, this would be 512whp

will post logs later today once I have time to sift through 25 dyno logs and figure out what goes to what, lol, also have a video I will post later as well
Nice 👍 must be a blast to drive
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      04-03-2015, 04:58 PM   #3
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Nice
How are you running straight e85
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      04-03-2015, 05:05 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rawimage View Post
Nice
How are you running straight e85
Filling up with it....


Its been discussed 1000009 times. It very possible, but there are no gains after a certain percentage.



OP GOOD JOB!
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      04-03-2015, 05:30 PM   #5
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Impressive man.
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      04-03-2015, 05:43 PM   #6
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Any idea what boost and timing you are running?
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      04-03-2015, 05:47 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferocity02
Any idea what boost and timing you are running?
25psi taper to 21psi. 15* timing. Will post logs later tonight or tomorrow. Tired right now and need to spend time with the family since I spent the morning Dyno tuning with Terry
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      04-03-2015, 07:01 PM   #8
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Sick numbers man but 15 degrees timing 25 pounds of boost on stockers lol damn hopefully ur only running that tune just that once
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      04-03-2015, 07:02 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlickSilver View Post

oh and this is on a 6AT with 3% more drivetrain loss than MT. Adjusted for MT drivetrain loss, this would be 512whp
Hate to poo poo on your parade, but...
I'm not actually sure if the E90 has this, but some new high end automatics now have a solid part in the torque converter that grabs on at both ends when you reach a certain speed so it's more efficient power transfer from engine to wheels. So, some new automatics don't have more drivetrain loss than a manual.
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      04-03-2015, 07:02 PM   #10
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Awesome numbers man! Congrats!

Numbers like these on stockers weren't thought to be very possible even less then a year ago!

Last edited by 335NJ; 04-03-2015 at 07:29 PM.
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      04-03-2015, 07:08 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atinybug
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlickSilver View Post

oh and this is on a 6AT with 3% more drivetrain loss than MT. Adjusted for MT drivetrain loss, this would be 512whp
Hate to poo poo on your parade, but...
I'm not actually sure if the E90 has this, but some new high end automatics now have a solid part in the torque converter that grabs on at both ends when you reach a certain speed so it's more efficient power transfer from engine to wheels. So, some new automatics don't have more drivetrain loss than a manual.
mine is an original build 01/2007
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      04-03-2015, 07:15 PM   #12
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Actually, after doing some internet research (because hey! if it's on the internet it must be true!) it seems all 335i autos come with a lock up torque converter that actually engages at very low speeds, some people are saying as low as 20ish mph.

and some more internet research:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZF_6HP26_transmission
Quote:
It also has the capability to achieve torque converter lock-up on all six forward gears, and disengage it completely when at a standstill, dramatically closing the fuel efficiency gap between automatic and manual transmissions.
used in E90 2005-present

sorry, impressive numbers anyway

Last edited by atinybug; 04-03-2015 at 07:23 PM.
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      04-03-2015, 09:55 PM   #13
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The drivetrain comment comes from many many Dynos on this forum that have shown time and time again that the AT is 3% more drivetrain loss than the MT. I have been in the N54 scene since 2008 so I've seen them time and time again. Also I think even Dinan published those figures, 12% for MT and 15% for AT after many many Dyno pulls they ran.
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      04-04-2015, 09:27 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlickSilver
The drivetrain comment ones from many many Dynos on this forum that have shown time and time again that the AT is 3% more drivetrain loss than the MT. I have been in the N54 scene since 2008 so I've seen them time and time again. Also I think even Dinan published those figures, 12% for MT and 15% for AT after many many Dyno pulls they ran.
I'm mt and have xdrive lol
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      04-04-2015, 12:27 PM   #15
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STD correction factor? Not 500 whp....

thanks for playing
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      04-04-2015, 12:29 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Milan
STD correction factor? Not 500 whp....

thanks for playing
Understand your point which you are probably alluding to SAE correction, but all dyno records on this platform have standardized on STD correction factor and smoothing 5. Go and check all the record dynos for N54 and let me know if you find any different. STD correction factor is chosen as it is a means for comparison to other records recognized on this platform and has been chosen as the Dyno standard on this platform by the tuners in the past 9 yrs.
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      04-04-2015, 01:51 PM   #17
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Where do you buy the MMP Intake? Ive been googling it and cant find anything on it.

Great gains. Its nice to see for people (like me) who dont really want to shell out the cash for an aftermarket turbo.
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      04-04-2015, 01:52 PM   #18
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      04-04-2015, 02:00 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levanime View Post
Wow.. Intake seems to be helping a lot..
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      04-04-2015, 02:15 PM   #20
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The ZF automatic in the 335i is similar to one used in multiple cars and has full lock up not too much off idle. There is no "coasting" with the 335 auto. It's locked up and provides engine braking when slowing down.

I also love how people think that drive train loss is a constant percentage. It may be a constant number of HP, but it is not a constant percentage of power.

It might be easier to model that way, but it is not.

Flame suit on...

BTW - I am an engineer and have studied fluid dynamics and other topics of motion and power delivery.
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      04-04-2015, 06:06 PM   #21
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The losses are not constant percentages but the 12% for MT and 15% for AT are used generally since those are the losses at peak power for a typical stock turbo dyno curve shape. The losses at say 2500 RPM are less, but who cares. 6MT would have had more power at the wheels.

This is 6HP19TU also called as 6HP21 and has higher drivetrain losses than the modern 8HP units.
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      04-05-2015, 12:55 AM   #22
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So here is the dyno data I said I would post once I had time to organize the data. Previously I had my car tuned to the absolute max on the dyno and my results in 4th gear was 447whp and in 5th gear was 456whp. I was running 100% E85 and the same amount of meth. All I did was change to the MMP intakes and dyno tune for the added performance of these intakes and I made 490whp in 4th and 500whp in 5th. That is a delta of +43whp in 4th and +44whp in 5th, pretty consistent. If you look at the logs where max HP is made for each Dyno pull, this is done with a delta of 3psi for these gains, pretty awesome gains for only 3psi! Also the conditions on the dyno prior to inlets was a Density altitude of 1208 ft and on the dyno day with the new inlets was 2873 ft so alot worse in DA, it was a hot muggy day, I told Terry I didn't think we could hit the record on that day but he urged me on to keep the dyno appt, glad he did

So with the same car, maxed tuned for each setup, on the same dyno, and with worse conditions, here are actual deltas and results, not speculations based on different cars, different drivetrains, different dynos, etc, etc, etc leading to bad conclusions

below is the comparison plot of max effort dyno comparison pre and post MMP intakes all else equal. 1st log below is the log for the the dyno pre MMP intakes with max effort tuning. 2nd log below is the log for the dyno post MMP intake installation with max effort tuning.

As you can see, the top end is where the MMP intakes shine and net +44 max whp and +56 whp at 6k rpm and also broadened the power band by shifting the max hp up by 200 rpm and alot more area under the curve. Not only that, I am able to maintain at least 500 ft lbs from 3200-5250 rpm.

You can see from the dyno logs before MMP intakes WGDC was 100% maxed out at 5500 rpm and only holding 20.8psi taper to 16.5psi, turbos completely tapped out! After MMP intakes WGDC only gets to 86% at 5700 rpm and able to make 25 psi, taper to 21.6 and back up to 22.6psi. This clearly shows with Dyno data and logs that there is a HUGE performance gain on stock turbos by upgrading to the MMP intakes!

I will update this data in the first post for completeness there.
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Last edited by MM Performance; 04-05-2015 at 01:13 AM.
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