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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > test drive: Procede V2 vs. Dinan Flash



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      02-27-2008, 12:45 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Driver72 View Post
Up the v2's user torque settings to 92% (where it could and maybe should be) and you two do a back to back drive again.
Then give your impressions a second time.
The low end torque of the PROcede will be a bit more prominent with more boost, and pull even harder above 5500 rpms.

I'd think the Dinan tune does feel like the v1.47 since both have boost levels in the low 13's and come on strong quickly down low in the rpm range.

Thanks for the write up.
+1. I run my PROcede v2 with TQ Curve set at 94% across the board; the low end TQ and HP are significantly better than when set at the default 90%.
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      02-27-2008, 12:56 PM   #24
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And therein lies one of the strengths of the V2 -- if you want to adjust it, you can.

Likewise for the Dinan, for those that want no business messing with anything, just pay the $ and forget about it.

Either one makes more business for TireRack...
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      02-27-2008, 01:00 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vase330 View Post
Before I bought this car, I was thinking of and test drove a vette 06 C6. I know the Z06 is ridiculous fast, but my point is we are actually splitting hairs here. Ours cars are very refined so like I said, it doesn't feel as fast as it really is.

Vette C6 was raw and felt like a sledge hammer. Was it that much faster than my Dinan 335? No. I dare say I can go dead heat or very close, yet my car "feel" nowhere close to as fast or as untammed. The Vette feel crazy, almost crude at times. My car is just smoooth. In real and absolute terms, they are almost equal.
If you are referring to the C6 Z06 in your second paragraph as well I want some of what you are smoking. They run 10 second 1/4's with just drag radials. I'm yet to see a 335 do that with any amount of mods.
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      02-27-2008, 01:44 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vase330 View Post
I don't know. For all practical purposes, the car is driven on the streets and public roadways, you are rarely going to be in the 5K+ rpm. At a mere 4K rpm the car is literally a missile you must pay attention to or wind up causing an accident. IMO the practical range is below 4K rpm. Those saying you really feel the drop off after 5500 rpm are in the extreme minority. The raucous at 5K rpm makes any higher rpm power change almost imperceptible at all. By the time you hit 4K rpm in any gear, you are already backing off anyway.
I agree with you 100%. Unless you're tracking the car it's not practical and almost unnecessary to take the rpms above 5k. I took the car up to it's electronically limited speed of 150mph during my European Delivery, and it accomplishes that speed at only 5100 rpm. If anyone's gonna want to race you from one stop sign to the next, i think having the low end torque is much more beneficial.
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      02-27-2008, 01:49 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vase330 View Post

Vette C6 was raw and felt like a sledge hammer. Was it that much faster than my Dinan 335? No. I dare say I can go dead heat or very close, yet my car "feel" nowhere close to as fast or as untammed. The Vette feel crazy, almost crude at times. My car is just smoooth. In real and absolute terms, they are almost equal.
Plus, if you've got an LSD putting all the power of your Dinan 335 to the ground, watch out!
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      02-27-2008, 01:49 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotrod2448 View Post
If you are referring to the C6 Z06 in your second paragraph as well I want some of what you are smoking. They run 10 second 1/4's with just drag radials. I'm yet to see a 335 do that with any amount of mods.
Anyone who thinks a 335i, modded or not, can truely outperform a stock BASE C6 is not thinking clearly.

Stock to stock there's no comparison. C6 > 335i.

Modded to Modded, there's no comparison. C6 > 335i.

Give me $2000 for some LT headers a CAI and a tune on a, '08 C6 w/the LS3 and I will show you a car that can run 11.7-11.8 ET's at 119+. Or 11.6's at 126+ for about $4,000.


Modded vs. stock you can make a Civic run faster than a 335i or C6 or even C6Z. It all depends how deep your pockets are.
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      02-27-2008, 02:03 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotrod2448 View Post
If you are referring to the C6 Z06 in your second paragraph as well I want some of what you are smoking. They run 10 second 1/4's with just drag radials. I'm yet to see a 335 do that with any amount of mods.
I think we've all lost sight of the point here fella's. This is an E90 forum, and you're comparing apples to oranges if you start comparing the Dinan or V2 335 with a Z06 or Murcielago or Pagani Zonda. No the 335 does not even come close to some of the fastest supercars in the world, cause if any of us owned cars like that, we probably wouldn't be on this E90 board. What the 335 is....is a pretty quick entry level compact luxury car for the $$$. And with a few mods you will often find yourself being the fastest thing on the road (during your drive to work or the mall) as you dont come across those supercars (at least I dont where I live) on a regular basis.

I think the point vase330 was trying to make was that compared to the "average" car on the road, a 335 is pretty quick, and a modified 335 is impressively quick. But face it guys, as much as we love our 335's, they are just another car on the road in the big scheme of things. When you start driving cars that cost $100K and above, up to the $1.5M Veyron, then you're in a different league.
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      02-27-2008, 02:44 PM   #30
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jam0321 it was really nice meeting up with you today. Here is my take on the Dinan vs V2 comparison I think jam0321 pretty much hit it on the head with his comparison:

The first thing I noticed when driving the Procede V2 just after driving my Dinan car was the difference in low end torque. The Dinan seems to have alot more low end torque over the V2. Were the V2 comes alive (or I should say the difference is noticed) above 5500rpms. The V2 is really smooth and can be deceiving. It doesn't feel like you are moving that fast until you watch how fast the mph and the tach are going. The Dinan starts to taper off a little after 5500rpms but definitely pulls to redline much better over stock. The V2 feels like it doesn't taper off at all.

The throttle response is not all that different as I thought it was going to be. You don't have to push the pedal down far at all with the V2 to get it going. With the Dinan you may have to go a little bit further but it is not a major difference. When you first get the Dinan flash the throttle response is worse but improves over time.

After have now driven both I personally prefer the Dinan tune. I am not just saying this because I purchased it. I like the low end torque and occasionally get my car above 5500rpms. The low end torque is a blast for spirited driving on the streets. Don't get me wrong though, the V2 is a very good tune and I also wouldn't mind having it on my car but the Dinan is right for me.

It would definatley be interesting too see the V2 and Dinan go head to head, especially from a stop. But like jam0321 already mentioned it would not have been wise of us to be racing each other in the middle of the day or at all for that matter. (Major consequences in CA for street racing).

I am looking forward to when Dinan releases there Stage II tune.

Thanks again to jam0321, it was fun.


Thanks for the reviews guys. Still curious about an all out Head to Head drag, just to see some empirical data!! Anyways, what you have both described mirrors exactly what some Dinan dynos illustrate.

I don't have my drag software installed anymore, but I would think the best shift point for the Dinan would be 6,100rpms anyways. So the "flat" acceleration above 5,500rpms mentioned by both these guys, is short lived anyways. From what I can tell, on the Dinan tune you loose 67ft-lbs of torque from 4,900rpm to 6,100rpms. I think the Procede reacts differently, so reving to redline is needed.

Here:


You gain more HP and more TQ by shifting at 6100rpms, so until you get at higher speeds (4 & 5th gear) redlining the Dinan tune, (to me), seems unnecessary.


SO without really having a side by side (head to head) comparison, it would be hard to know. Though, I am looking forward to seeing it !

Last edited by Numb3rs; 02-27-2008 at 03:38 PM.
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      02-27-2008, 02:55 PM   #31
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Thats not what I said man. Read it again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hotrod2448 View Post
If you are referring to the C6 Z06 in your second paragraph as well I want some of what you are smoking. They run 10 second 1/4's with just drag radials. I'm yet to see a 335 do that with any amount of mods.
I said my Dinan 335 is not even comparable to a Z06. All I said is my Dinan 335i is very close if not equal to a base C6. If you think I am wrong about that, go drive both and report back. And don't let the unrefined raw brute of the vette C6 full you.
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      02-27-2008, 02:57 PM   #32
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full but yes, the modded 335i will be "about" the speed of a Corvette C6..

all crank calculations..

Dynos
==================
Stock 335i : 260 / 280
Vishnu Stage 1 (Procede + Exhaust) : 339 / 370
My mods : 360 / 380

RANK RANK Price per HP
228 51 221 51 Mercedes C300 $34,125 $149.67
243 50 255 45 Audi A4 $39,750 $163.58
250 49 236 50 Audi TT Roadster $36,800 $147.20
265 48 243 49 Audi A5 $39,900 $150.57
268 44 258 41 Mercedes C350 $37,725 $140.76
268 44 258 41 Mercedes E350 $52,025 $194.12
268 44 258 41 Mercedes CLK350 (Coupe) $47,275 $176.40
268 44 258 41 Mercedes CLK350 (Convertible) $55,325 $206.44
272 43 254 46 Lexus ES350 $33,720 $123.97
288 42 317 35 Lexus SC (Coupe) $65,455 $227.27
295 40 252 47 Porsche Boxster S $55,500 $188.14
295 40 252 47 Porsche Cayman S $58,900 $199.66
305 39 329 31 335i $50,000 $163.93
306 38 277 39 Lexus IS350 $35,905 $117.34
325 37 273 40 Porsche 911 Carrera $71,300 $219.38
340 36 302 37 Audi S4 $56,775 $166.99
342 35 339 30 Lexus GS $52,620 $153.86
350 33 325 32 Audi A6 $42,950 $122.71
350 33 325 32 Audi A8 $70,690 $201.97
354 32 325 32 Audi S5 $50,500 $142.66
355 29 376 26 Mercedes SLK 55 AMG (Roadster) $58,544 $164.91
355 29 376 26 Mercedes SLK 55 AMG (Convertible) $58,544 $164.91
355 29 295 38 Porsche 911 Cabriolet $90,000 $253.52
380 28 367 29 Lexus LS $62,000 $163.16
382 22 391 18 Mercedes E550 $60,525 $158.44
382 22 391 18 Mercedes S550 $87,525 $229.12
382 22 391 18 Mercedes CLK550 (Coupe) $55,975 $146.53
382 22 391 18 Mercedes CLS550 (Coupe) $68,775 $180.04
382 22 391 18 Mercedes CL550 (Coupe) $104,425 $273.36
382 22 391 18 Mercedes CLK550 (Convertible) $64,025 $167.60
399 21 435 11 335i Vishnu Stage 1 (Chip+Exhaust) $53,000 $132.83
412 20 317 35 Audi RS4 $70,000 $169.90
416 19 371 28 Lexus IS F $56,000 $134.62
424 18 447 10 335i with Everything (My stuff) $55,000 $129.72
435 17 398 16 Audi S6 $72,350 $166.32
436 15 428 13 Chevy Corvette (Coupe) $46,950 $107.68
436 15 428 13 Chevy Corvette (Convertible) $55,425 $127.12

450 13 428 13 Audi A8 v12 $120,100 $266.89
450 13 398 16 Audi S8 $93,300 $207.33
475 11 465 5 Mercedes CLK 63 AMG (Convertible) $82,956 $174.64
475 11 465 5 Mercedes C63 AMG $63,000 $132.63
480 9 430 12 2009 NISSAN GT-R $0.00
480 9 460 9 Porsche 911 Turbo $122,900 $256.04
500 7 383 24 BMW M5 Sedan $82,900 $165.80
500 7 383 24 BMW M6 Convertible $96,690 $193.38
505 6 475 4 Chevy Corvette Z06 $72,125 $142.82
507 5 465 5 Mercedes E63 AMG $79,050 $155.92
510 3 612 2 Mercedes S600 $145,025 $284.36
510 3 612 2 Mercedes CL600 (Coupe) $148,225 $290.64
518 2 465 5 Mercedes S63 AMG $118,110 $228.01
604 1 738 1 Mercedes S65 AMG $169,074 $279.92

I know the numbers don't tell the whole story, but that's my take (and excel chart).... so not quite as fast as C6... actually not even close according to Numb3rs's Numbers... 316 / 350 on his chart..

316 / .85 => 371.76
350 / .85 => 411.76

371.76 / 411.76 crank compared to 436 / 428 for Corvette C6
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      02-27-2008, 03:21 PM   #33
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Talking I meant fool. But you get what I am saying though..

The C6 might be faster as I said, but not by much at all. Its very close. No blow out here.
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      02-27-2008, 03:33 PM   #34
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Quote:
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The C6 might be faster as I said, but not by much at all. Its very close. No blow out here.
I agree. As mentioned in one of my first posts I was in the market for a new 08' Corvette, but I am willing to forgo a tad bit of performance for a more refined experience.

It just gets old after a while.
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      02-28-2008, 12:14 AM   #35
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It just gets old after a while.
brute force never gets old...
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      02-28-2008, 12:14 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmizer2167 View Post
Anyone who thinks a 335i, modded or not, can truely outperform a stock BASE C6 is not thinking clearly.

Stock to stock there's no comparison. C6 > 335i.

Modded to Modded, there's no comparison. C6 > 335i.

Give me $2000 for some LT headers a CAI and a tune on a, '08 C6 w/the LS3 and I will show you a car that can run 11.7-11.8 ET's at 119+. Or 11.6's at 126+ for about $4,000.


Modded vs. stock you can make a Civic run faster than a 335i or C6 or even C6Z. It all depends how deep your pockets are.
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      02-28-2008, 12:55 AM   #37
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Man, you drive an 06 325. You need to live with a 335 to really appretiate it.

I think these cars are faster than many people realize. I Vette feel fast just standing there. Fire it up, and the rumble and shaking gives the impression of caged angry lion ready to pounce. menacing. The 335i on the other hand doesn't announce itself at all. Its stealthy. coming from a E46 330ci I was underwhelmed by my first two E90 test drives. I felt a difference but not that much at all. Why? I really did not get it aggressively. Thats a big difference, the car is a very civilized daily driver with an alter ego personality. You spank the car watch out, it might bite back. The Vette looks and sounds mean. Its full on all the time.

OT:

And yes a Modded 335i does come very close to a C6. So much so its just splitting hairs to argue that point. Then again its just my opinion after several drives in both cars. I also own a 08 Toyota RAV 4 V6 which I think is pretty quick for a cute-ute. The performance difference with a 335 and that car is so big its a joke. But I had my E46 330 I just sold recently, and I'd drive the RAV and 330 and think they were almost even in performance even though my 128K 330 was actually more refined than my brand new RAV. Justifies price difference actually. I sold the 330 because of serious reliability issues and it was a money pit from the beginning anyway. One of the worse BMWs I have had. Worst was the 01 E46 M3 I owned for short while. I am just objective here.

Back OT:
Dinan 335i is roughly equivalent to a V2 335i. Its up to you to decide if the warranty - issues is worth the price. I personally like the edge taken off the initial start of throttle. Car is a lot easier to drive that way. Its smooth as hell and very willing to wind up too.
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      02-28-2008, 11:07 AM   #38
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Man, you drive an 06 325. You need to live with a 335 to really appretiate it.
you don't know me or what I have in my garage.....
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      02-28-2008, 10:12 PM   #39
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Talking Grumpy I am not dissing you. I just pointed out.

Ok, no disrespect intended. I just pointed out what your signature says, and I assumed you therefore have limited expirience with the 335i. As for your garage, maybe you have an F-16 for all I know.
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      02-28-2008, 10:41 PM   #40
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Ok, no disrespect intended. I just pointed out what your signature says, and I assumed you therefore have limited expirience with the 335i. As for your garage, maybe you have an F-16 for all I know.
no disrespect taken and the F16 is out back, garage is too small...
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      02-29-2008, 02:17 PM   #41
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I agree. As mentioned in one of my first posts I was in the market for a new 08' Corvette, but I am willing to forgo a tad bit of performance for a more refined experience.

It just gets old after a while.
To each their own.

To me, I'll take raw and unrefined any day because once you live with 'refined' for more than 6 months, it's hard to stay awake at the wheel...
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