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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > NA Engine (non-turbo) / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > Free Power (charcoal filter removal)



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      02-27-2006, 08:17 AM   #133
ben1364
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lux.sh
Not really, if you take it offensively, you are being way too personal.
After all, he did start the sarcasm saying tuning involves replacing spark plugs and dropping in an air filter.
Im sure he knew thats not what I meant. I've seen his posts before, and he is a very smart guy, well informed about cars.

Attitudes are attitudes, this is internet. No reason to be so serious about it.
Luxy is correct regarding my sarcastic comment about
Split Fire plugs, etc. Perhaps I should have used a different analogy to make my point about shade tree tuning.
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      02-27-2006, 01:20 PM   #134
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Ok back on topic if that's is Ok with everyone. Regarding my questions above - who can provide answers? (reference this post:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=127 )

E90hawaii - you have to cut the filter out. No way to remove it without destroying it and permanently modifying the upper part of your stock intake. But frankly, if you do it cleanly, I would be absolutely shocked if a dealer EVER noticed this mod.
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      02-27-2006, 01:55 PM   #135
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But frankly, if you do it cleanly, I would be absolutely shocked if a dealer EVER noticed this mod.[/quote]

Given that BMW and BMW dealers are free to browse this fourm, I suspect that some might look for charcoal filters that have been tampered with given that the replacement is quite pricy and that removal may effect the emmissions warranty. I seem to recall that the part costs over $400.
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      02-27-2006, 01:57 PM   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ben1364
But frankly, if you do it cleanly, I would be absolutely shocked if a dealer EVER noticed this mod.
Given that BMW and BMW dealers are free to browse this fourm, I suspect that some might look for charcoal filters that have been tampered with given that the replacement is quite pricy and that removal may effect the emmissions warranty. I seem to recall that the part costs over $400.[/quote]

$417 but that was for the entire intake housing assembly
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      02-27-2006, 02:17 PM   #137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by porscheneer
Given that BMW and BMW dealers are free to browse this fourm, I suspect that some might look for charcoal filters that have been tampered with given that the replacement is quite pricy and that removal may effect the emmissions warranty. I seem to recall that the part costs over $400.
$417 but that was for the entire intake housing assembly[/quote]
Yeah right. The dealers are all over this website. And they're just lookin' for a way to stick it to ya!

Strange that they haven't found one CDV removal.
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      02-27-2006, 03:07 PM   #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noflash
$417 but that was for the entire intake housing assembly
Yeah right. The dealers are all over this website. And they're just lookin' for a way to stick it to ya!

Strange that they haven't found one CDV removal.[/quote]

I suspect that techs at better BMW dealerships sometimes notice when CDVs have been altered but I don't think the CDV affects emmissions. Dealerships are sensitive about tampering with emmissions systems. As regards the $417 figure, I don't think the charcoal filter is available except as part of the housing.

Last edited by ben1364; 02-27-2006 at 03:08 PM. Reason: addition
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      02-28-2006, 08:15 AM   #139
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Correct it is a one piece heat molded sub assembly
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      03-01-2006, 02:09 AM   #140
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Well I think I have most of my answers. According to this link: http://www.realoem.com/bmw/select.do the ECU as well as all other relevant parts and sensors, except for the airbox itself, are the same part number for both Euro and US 330's.

So the only unknown is whether or not the ignition/fuel mapping is the same, which I would venture to guess is EXTREMELY likely although I have no way to confirm this, obviously. Assuming so, then there will be no negative effects in removing the charcoal filter (other than the highly unlikely warranty issues if a dealer decides to be proactive and directs their mechanic to take time to specifically check my BMW for this specific mod) and this mod can only help performance, not harm it nor the engine.

Anybody know if the software updates are the same for Euro vs US 330's?
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      03-01-2006, 03:41 AM   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepermax
Well I think I have most of my answers. According to this link: http://www.realoem.com/bmw/select.do the ECU as well as all other relevant parts and sensors, except for the airbox itself, are the same part number for both Euro and US 330's.

So the only unknown is whether or not the ignition/fuel mapping is the same, which I would venture to guess is EXTREMELY likely although I have no way to confirm this, obviously. Assuming so, then there will be no negative effects in removing the charcoal filter (other than the highly unlikely warranty issues if a dealer decides to be proactive and directs their mechanic to take time to specifically check my BMW for this specific mod) and this mod can only help performance, not harm it nor the engine.

Anybody know if the software updates are the same for Euro vs US 330's?
I highly doubt removing this filter will mess around with ignition/fuel mapping. I don't see the relationship there. I can see how it might alter the airflow if any, but give me a break.
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      03-01-2006, 09:59 AM   #142
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Agreed, with such a minor intake modification the chances of creating a too-lean condition at upper rpms is almost nill.
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      03-01-2006, 06:54 PM   #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lux.sh
I highly doubt removing this filter will mess around with ignition/fuel mapping. I don't see the relationship there. I can see how it might alter the airflow if any, but give me a break.

Agreed, if Europe doesnt have it and isnt blowing their engines, then we can take it out...
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      03-06-2006, 09:54 PM   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poldim
Agreed, if Europe doesnt have it and isnt blowing their engines, then we can take it out...
So did you do it? If so what are your impressions?
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      03-06-2006, 10:54 PM   #145
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Question regarding emissions:

How much fuel vapor actually escapes out the airbox intake when the engine is shut off? With port injection, all the entire intake system up to the ports contains only air. When the engine is shut off, where is the pressure difference that would flow air + fuel vapors back out through the intake manifold, piping, and airbox? And wouldn't the stock (paper) filter trap most of that?

My intuition says the charcoal filter in the intake system is another politically-correct step taken by a government bureau regardless of the true benefits and the cost to the manufacturer/consumer. Hard to see how any real amount of vapors would escape totally; more likely they would just sit in the intake tubing and upper section of the airbox until the next time the engine fired up, when they would get sucked into the engine along with the intake air.

Have any of you folks who have removed the charcoal filter noticed any gas fumes underhood, near the airbox or intake pipe, after the change?
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      03-06-2006, 11:01 PM   #146
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wstrohm
Question regarding emissions:

How much fuel vapor actually escapes out the airbox intake when the engine is shut off? With port injection, all the entire intake system up to the ports contains only air. When the engine is shut off, where is the pressure difference that would flow air + fuel vapors back out through the intake manifold, piping, and airbox? And wouldn't the stock (paper) filter trap most of that?

My intuition says the charcoal filter in the intake system is another politically-correct step taken by a government bureau regardless of the true benefits and the cost to the manufacturer/consumer. Hard to see how any real amount of vapors would escape totally; more likely they would just sit in the intake tubing and upper section of the airbox until the next time the engine fired up, when they would get sucked into the engine along with the intake air.
Maybe with the valvetronic system and the absence of a throttle butterfly, there is more chance for gas vapours to come up thru the open valves.
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      03-07-2006, 09:41 AM   #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David325Australia
Interesting but I'm not tempted at this time. My 325 has plenty of power and torque for me.

All the best to everyone who removes the fiter.
I would be pretty sure that we have the Euro spec filter which seems to be better...
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      03-07-2006, 12:36 PM   #148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamieA
I would be pretty sure that we have the Euro spec filter which seems to be better...
Wait a minute do the Aussie's have the charcoal filter?
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      03-07-2006, 12:37 PM   #149
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visor,

Very good point. But I did notice in the link posted previously that Toyota had added that charcoal filter also... and they do have throttle bodies with butterflies. However the BMW intake system may be more prone to vapor diffusion, as you wrote.
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      03-07-2006, 02:02 PM   #150
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In answer to your question Wstrohm, I have not noticed any strange fuel smells around the engine after shutting down. My guess is that the carbon filter is a bit redundant - if any vapors do escape the intake manifold, they are trapped by the normal filter.
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      03-07-2006, 04:19 PM   #151
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Scarabeo,

Thanks for your reply.
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      03-07-2006, 06:21 PM   #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarabeo
In answer to your question Wstrohm, I have not noticed any strange fuel smells around the engine after shutting down. My guess is that the carbon filter is a bit redundant - if any vapors do escape the intake manifold, they are trapped by the normal filter.
Neither do I, and I have a US model with the filter removed. I should probably mention that I have a finished garage attached to my house, so if there were smelly fumes escaping after shut down, I would certainly smell it.
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      03-08-2006, 04:11 AM   #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by porscheneer
Wait a minute do the Aussie's have the charcoal filter?
A good question.

I am only going by wild assumption because we seem to get the Euro specs here for every other aspect of the car (except for the position of the steering wheel of course )

I would like to hear from anyone who actually knew the answer to this question...
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      03-08-2006, 07:07 AM   #154
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A better question might be, "Why does BMW equip NA and perhaps cars for certain other markets with the charcoal filter if it serves no purpose?" It is out of sight and does not add perceived value to the package.
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