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      04-16-2008, 12:25 PM   #89
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When have I ever advocated for independence? I simply want the Tibetan people to determine how they are governed. Why do you oppose that? Why should murderous thugs in Peking have a say in it?
What is your interest in this? Are you Tibetan?



I think the people realized CBS News could be manipulated when they were shown to have presented fraudulent documents in an attempt to smear the President.
Why do MURDEROUS THUGS in DC have a say in our lives???

Unbelievable how one sided robots can be...
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      04-16-2008, 09:00 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by ganeil View Post
When have I ever advocated for independence? I simply want the Tibetan people to determine how they are governed. Why do you oppose that? Why should murderous thugs in Peking have a say in it?

What is your interest in this? Are you Tibetan?



I think the people realized CBS News could be manipulated when they were shown to have presented fraudulent documents in an attempt to smear the President.
1) Im sure the conferderates simply wanted to govern themselfs the way they want to, why the union got to oppose that...
Sovereignty...my friend...seems to be something you don't understand...

2) To support Tibet independence because you care about the principle of Tibet soverignity is noble, to support Tibet independence out of spite for PRC and communism is as ignorant as it comes. (and it seems to me you belong to the latter group.

3) This is about 2 regimes fighting for a piece of land. The "western world" regime with the Dalai Lama as the puppet leader. and the PRC regime. Vast majority of people (and when I say vast, i mean prob 98%+) that actually live in Tibet don't give 2 shits about if they are independent or not, they care that they can eat 3 meals a day, have electricity and fresh water, their children can go to school (better if its free) and be able to afford better things in live like a house and a car. Guess whos providing all that right now...not the UN, and def not the US or UK (take a poll in Iraq and see if Iraqis rather want the way things use to be or now...)
So maybe its a victory for you if PRC just pulled out and Tibet really gained independence. you raise your hand and say something like "hurray we defeated the evil PRC, we freed Tibet, great job everyone, high five." then what? then you're going to forget about the whole thing after about 5 mins and go back to playing your ps3 on your 60" plasma while the new "Tibet nation's" economy collapse due to lack of domestic production and external funds and PEOPLE...NOT IDEALS suffer. What are you going to do Mr. Idealist, you going to go there and build roads? you going to feed the hungry children? you going to go keep order when shit hits the fan from lack of authority?

You remind me of those high school kids that buys and wears a Che shirt and call themselves revolutionaries. Get real man.

4) one more thing, you don't want the Tibetans to govern themselves the way they want to, you want the Tibetans to govern the way the Dalai Lama wants to (so in other words the way the West wants to) because admit it, he is the only Tibetan you know.
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      04-16-2008, 09:34 PM   #91
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1) Im sure the conferderates simply wanted to govern themselfs the way they want to, why the union got to oppose that...
Sovereignty...my friend...seems to be something you don't understand...
What gives you the impression that I believe Lincoln and the Union handled the issue of secession properly?

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2) To support Tibet independence because you care about the principle of Tibet soverignity is noble, to support Tibet independence out of spite for PRC and communism is as ignorant as it comes. (and it seems to me you belong to the latter group.
I have never advocated for Tibetan independence, I am an advocate for letting the Tibetans decide. The only thing standing in the way of that happening is the repressive regime in Peking.

Please stop creating strawmen to knock down. That is truly ignorant.

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3) This is about 2 regimes fighting for a piece of land. The "western world" regime with the Dalai Lama as the puppet leader. and the PRC regime. Vast majority of people (and when I say vast, i mean prob 98%+) that actually live in Tibet don't give 2 shits about if they are independent or not, they care that they can eat 3 meals a day, have electricity and fresh water, their children can go to school (better if its free) and be able to afford better things in live like a house and a car. Guess whos providing all that right now...not the UN, and def not the US or UK (take a poll in Iraq and see if Iraqis rather want the way things use to be or now...)
So maybe its a victory for you if PRC just pulled out and Tibet really gained independence. you raise your hand and say something like "hurray we defeated the evil PRC, we freed Tibet, great job everyone, high five." then what? then you're going to forget about the whole thing after about 5 mins and go back to playing your ps3 on your 60" plasma while the new "Tibet nation's" economy collapse due to lack of domestic production and external funds and PEOPLE...NOT IDEALS suffer. What are you going to do Mr. Idealist, you going to go there and build roads? you going to feed the hungry children? you going to go keep order when shit hits the fan from lack of authority?
Talk about arrogance! You claim to know what the vast majority of Tibetan people want! Maybe their history, religion, and culture mean a bit more to them than you believe? I know how this can be settled, a free and fair election. Think Peking will go for it? I don't.

Even greater arrogance! The poor Tibetans cannot care for themselves? Only the Chinese can feed, cloth, and educate them? Who knows, maybe the first act of an independent Tibet would be a free trade pact with India.

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You remind me of those high school kids that buys and wears a Che shirt and call themselves revolutionaries. Get real man.
Che, like the regime you seem to support in Peking, was a murderous thug. That is reality, man.

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4) one more thing, you don't want the Tibetans to govern themselves the way they want to, you want the Tibetans to govern the way the Dalai Lama wants to (so in other words the way the West wants to) because admit it, he is the only Tibetan you know.
With every statement, your arrogance grows. Not only do you believe you know what the people of Tibet want, you believe to know what I want!

I would not care if the Tibetan people chose to be ruled by a Lhasa Apso. It should be their decision.
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      04-17-2008, 05:56 AM   #92
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You remind me of those high school kids that buys and wears a Che shirt and call themselves revolutionaries. Get real man.

4) one more thing, you don't want the Tibetans to govern themselves the way they want to, you want the Tibetans to govern the way the Dalai Lama wants to (so in other words the way the West wants to) because admit it, he is the only Tibetan you know.


Now he called you arrogant for disagreeing with him, and then googled a few names to throw into the mix to sound more educated and smarter on the topic...
However, all he knows about China and Tibet is what the Government censorship feeds him...
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      04-20-2008, 07:36 PM   #93
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http://www.anti-cnn.com/
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      04-20-2008, 08:11 PM   #94
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Neither side is noble in this shit. People need to get off of their high horse and drop that holier than thou attitude. If you look at the history of Tibet, it has been a part of China for quite a while now. British took over it in the first half of the 20th century and then Mao reclaimed it (don't forget this very Dalai Lama signed the treaty).

Seriously Tibet has very little potential for economic development. The only reason why the western countries, esp. the US, have such vested interest in it is because it is the only way for China to reach Europe. If the US gained control of Tibet, then they would be successfully blocked China in three directions (currently, east side = Japan, south east = the Philippines, Guam, Saipan, etc, South / Southwest = India). They really don't care whether the welfare of the Tibetans.
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      04-20-2008, 08:16 PM   #95
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Neither side is noble in this shit. People need to get off of their high horse and drop that holier than thou attitude. If you look at the history of Tibet, it has been a part of China for quite a while now. British took over it in the first half of the 20th century and then Mao reclaimed it (don't forget this very Dalai Lama signed the treaty).

Seriously Tibet has very little potential for economic development. The only reason why the western countries, esp. the US, have such vested interest in it is because it is the only way for China to reach Europe. If the US gained control of Tibet, then they would be successfully blocked China in three directions (currently, east side = Japan, south east = the Philippines, Guam, Saipan, etc, South / Southwest = India). They really don't care whether the welfare of the Tibetans.

100% accurate!
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      04-20-2008, 09:10 PM   #96
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Neither side is noble in this shit. People need to get off of their high horse and drop that holier than thou attitude. If you look at the history of Tibet, it has been a part of China for quite a while now. British took over it in the first half of the 20th century and then Mao reclaimed it (don't forget this very Dalai Lama signed the treaty).

Seriously Tibet has very little potential for economic development. The only reason why the western countries, esp. the US, have such vested interest in it is because it is the only way for China to reach Europe. If the US gained control of Tibet, then they would be successfully blocked China in three directions (currently, east side = Japan, south east = the Philippines, Guam, Saipan, etc, South / Southwest = India). They really don't care whether the welfare of the Tibetans.
don't forget south korea in the north east.
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      04-21-2008, 09:29 AM   #97
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Neither side is noble in this shit. People need to get off of their high horse and drop that holier than thou attitude. If you look at the history of Tibet, it has been a part of China for quite a while now. British took over it in the first half of the 20th century and then Mao reclaimed it (don't forget this very Dalai Lama signed the treaty).

Seriously Tibet has very little potential for economic development. The only reason why the western countries, esp. the US, have such vested interest in it is because it is the only way for China to reach Europe. If the US gained control of Tibet, then they would be successfully blocked China in three directions (currently, east side = Japan, south east = the Philippines, Guam, Saipan, etc, South / Southwest = India). They really don't care whether the welfare of the Tibetans.
I wonder in how many other areas of the world you find it noble for a colonial power to remain without the express consent of the native people?

There clearly is a noble side in this conflict and it is NOT the PRC. I do not deny that the Chinese have a legitimate security interest in the area but that can be resolved within a framework of autonomy for the Tibetan people.

The number of apologists for the the thugs in Peking that exist on this board is depressing.
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      04-21-2008, 12:53 PM   #98
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I have seen this before. I think it's run by the Chinese Communist Party as a piece of propaganda. Open your eyes.

Stop reading Xin Hua, and check out something less biased. If your source of info gets their info from Xin Hua, they're full of shit.

All the 'news' you hear from China is what is released by the CPC.
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      04-21-2008, 01:01 PM   #99
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lol idk if it's run by the devil, cnn isnt any more innocent than that! good to hear all perspective and keep an open mind when reading ANYTHING from any source
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      04-21-2008, 01:17 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by ganeil View Post
I wonder in how many other areas of the world you find it noble for a colonial power to remain without the express consent of the native people?

There clearly is a noble side in this conflict and it is NOT the PRC. I do not deny that the Chinese have a legitimate security interest in the area but that can be resolved within a framework of autonomy for the Tibetan people.

The number of apologists for the the thugs in Peking that exist on this board is depressing.
How many nations have achieved autonomy or independence in the name of democracy only to become subsidized economies with corrupt and unstable governments? Just what would Tibet gain from independence?
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      04-21-2008, 04:59 PM   #101
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How many nations have achieved autonomy or independence in the name of democracy only to become subsidized economies with corrupt and unstable governments? Just what would Tibet gain from independence?
How many nations have achieved independence and thrived as vital, independent nations?

I am not sure it is up to us to decide what Tibet would gain, it is up to the Tibetans. What they would lose would be the corrupt and repressive regime they currently live under.
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      04-21-2008, 05:59 PM   #102
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all I have to say is...

I don't think politics should be involved with the Olympics...

Olympics is about the athletes that train their whole life to compete in the Olympics...

I don't see how boycotting the Olympics would benefit anyone on both sides...

China IS changing, but gradually, and you cant expect a nation of one billion people to change over one night...

my 2 cents
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      04-21-2008, 07:37 PM   #103
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Originally Posted by ganeil View Post
I wonder in how many other areas of the world you find it noble for a colonial power to remain without the express consent of the native people?

There clearly is a noble side in this conflict and it is NOT the PRC. I do not deny that the Chinese have a legitimate security interest in the area but that can be resolved within a framework of autonomy for the Tibetan people.

The number of apologists for the the thugs in Peking that exist on this board is depressing.
Hong Kong was pretty good under the British rule (I grew up there till a year after the hand over). I don't think people in Hong Kong gave express consent per se to the British Empire to rule Hong Kong....... It has deteriorated fast since then.

Instead of saying everyone is an apologists for the thugs in BEIJING (Peking is for duck only.....), why don't you go in front of a mirror and take a look at yourself and try to find out what's the problem with yourself? Take a good look at yourself, you are a cyber thug, all talk, no walk..... You spend all day bitching on the cyberspace how China do this and that to oppress their people. Why don't you do something to try to change it? Maybe try to go there and teach the people like many other do? Maybe try to go on a relief mission with the Red Cross, Medicins Sans Frontiers, or UNICEF, and get a taste of what it is like living in the poor villages? Without food and a roof over their head, the last thing that any one concerns about is freedom.
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      04-21-2008, 07:38 PM   #104
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How many nations have achieved independence and thrived as vital, independent nations?

I am not sure it is up to us to decide what Tibet would gain, it is up to the Tibetans. What they would lose would be the corrupt and repressive regime they currently live under.
Maybe the US should open up another war front in Asia to kill the regimes in China and N. Korea? After all, they are the root of all evils according to Mr. President.......
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      04-21-2008, 08:05 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by Kev View Post
Hong Kong was pretty good under the British rule (I grew up there till a year after the hand over). I don't think people in Hong Kong gave express consent per se to the British Empire to rule Hong Kong....... It has deteriorated fast since then.

Instead of saying everyone is an apologists for the thugs in BEIJING (Peking is for duck only.....), why don't you go in front of a mirror and take a look at yourself and try to find out what's the problem with yourself? Take a good look at yourself, you are a cyber thug, all talk, no walk..... You spend all day bitching on the cyberspace how China do this and that to oppress their people. Why don't you do something to try to change it? Maybe try to go there and teach the people like many other do? Maybe try to go on a relief mission with the Red Cross, Medicins Sans Frontiers, or UNICEF, and get a taste of what it is like living in the poor villages? Without food and a roof over their head, the last thing that any one concerns about is freedom.
there's a difference between hong kong people and tibetan people, people from hong kong are proud to be chinese and they don't want to seperate from the mainland nor do they want independance, they just want a change in government, democracy

Where as tibetan people just want independance
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      04-21-2008, 08:37 PM   #106
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there's a difference between hong kong people and tibetan people, people from hong kong are proud to be chinese and they don't want to seperate from the mainland nor do they want independance, they just want a change in government, democracy

Where as tibetan people just want independance
I'm not so sure about your assessment of whether the people in Hong Kong want independence or not. If you take a look at Hong Kong, we rely on China to supply everything nowadays, so there's no way we can sever ties with them, so we're pretty much stuck.
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      04-21-2008, 09:02 PM   #107
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Instead of saying everyone is an apologists for the thugs in BEIJING (Peking is for duck only.....), why don't you go in front of a mirror and take a look at yourself and try to find out what's the problem with yourself? Take a good look at yourself, you are a cyber thug, all talk, no walk..... You spend all day bitching on the cyberspace how China do this and that to oppress their people. Why don't you do something to try to change it? Maybe try to go there and teach the people like many other do? Maybe try to go on a relief mission with the Red Cross, Medicins Sans Frontiers, or UNICEF, and get a taste of what it is like living in the poor villages? Without food and a roof over their head, the last thing that any one concerns about is freedom.
I did not say everyone is an apologist for Peking (Beijing is preferred by the thugs of the PRC, I will stick with Peking,) only those here who seem to make excuses for the tyrants.

You have no idea what I may or may not do to help the world be a better place, do you?

You are quite wrong about freedom though. I have watched men give up everything they had, including their lives to secure it for their children.
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      04-21-2008, 09:08 PM   #108
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I did not say everyone is an apologist for Peking (Beijing is preferred by the thugs of the PRC, I will stick with Peking,) only those here who seem to make excuses for the tyrants.

You have no idea what I may or may not do to help the world be a better place, do you?

You are quite wrong about freedom though. I have watched men give up everything they had, including their lives to secure it for their children.
One last advise to you, "try it before you say it." I know I did, at the age of 15, in rural China for a flood relief. If you haven't tried it, you have no right to say it.
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      04-21-2008, 09:18 PM   #109
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One last advise to you, "try it before you say it." I know I did, at the age of 15, in rural China for a flood relief. If you haven't tried it, you have no right to say it.
I am afraid I do not know what you are saying?

Are you suggesting I do some relief work? Tell me does distributing food in Somalia count? How about providing security for a medical team in Colombia? Building a school in an Afghan village that had never seen one?
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      04-22-2008, 12:21 AM   #110
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Why are Americans worry about China when there are so many things we have to deal with here.....dawm

this is why we have War in this world.
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