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      05-11-2008, 06:20 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by dxb335d View Post
330i is never as quick as a 335d

it just aint happening mate


at the wheels gibbos stock 335d made 238bhp scottc 330i made 190

let alone the torque,mmm

acceleration it will not live with it 0-60, 0-100 1/4mile and wil be trounced over the ton

the diesel you had must been a shiight one.

Go check stats for them, they only just break into the 14's over the quarter at under the ton, a second behind the 335d (stock also) which is over the ton
Here's the Stats Carlos 330i 0-62 6.0 (Manual) 6.2 (Auto) 335d 6.1 (Auto)
http://www.bmw.co.uk/bmwuk/pricesand...-bmwuk,00.html
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      05-11-2008, 06:23 PM   #46
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BMW have the 330i at 6.0 seconds flat and the 335d at 6.1 seconds flat.
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      05-11-2008, 06:24 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by Real Thing View Post
Here's the Stats Carlos 330i 0-62 6.0 (Manual) 6.2 (Auto) 335d 6.1 (Auto)
http://www.bmw.co.uk/bmwuk/pricesand...-bmwuk,00.html
and what you getting at there?
0-62 the 335d is quicker. whatever those stats are i care not

a stock 335d will do 0-100 in 13.5 secs. a stock 330i manual will do it in 15.5 (all proven) secs whether it is the same 0-60 or not (which it aint)

just like the quarter times for both cars, the 335d is considerably quicker
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      05-11-2008, 06:26 PM   #48
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BMW have the 330i at 6.0 seconds flat and the 335d at 6.1 seconds flat.
and real tests shows its slower!
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      05-11-2008, 06:31 PM   #49
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and what you getting at there?
0-62 the 335d is quicker. whatever those stats are i care not

a stock 335d will do 0-100 in 13.5 secs. a stock 330i manual will do it in 15.5 (all proven) secs whether it is the same 0-60 or not (which it aint)

just like the quarter times for both cars, the 335d is considerably quicker
I'm sure BMW will get round to changing them when they get your report Carlos
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      05-11-2008, 06:34 PM   #50
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I'm sure BMW will get round to changing them when they get your report Carlos
ok lets say the 330i standing start is quicker, the 335d will still trounce it to 100mph as proved everywhere!! and annihilate it to 150+

In gear it 40-140 it would leave one standing! Let along the tunability of it also compared to the N/A 330i!
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      05-11-2008, 06:40 PM   #51
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Fair enough mate, I was just reporting on our findings, which on the road made the choice of the two cars purely which you preferred you wouldn't buy either because of actual times, and this was a petrol vs diesel debate and the costs of owning each which is why I mentioned it.

Looking round at 330i times for 1/4 mile most are at 14.3 seconds for the older car, which was also .5 seconds slower to 60mph, so I would expect .8 seconds off the 1/4 mile from older car to newer one?? Even if you just knock the .5 seconds off then it is sub 14 seconds.
As I say, not much in it, not enough to loose sleep over and you have the fun of it being petrol, I would easily loose a second of 1/4 mile for that.


http://www.dragtimes.com/BMW--330i-Drag-Racing.html
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      05-11-2008, 06:43 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by gIzzE View Post
Fair enough mate, I was just reporting on our findings, which on the road made the choice of the two cars purely which you preferred you wouldn't buy either because of actual times, and this was a petrol vs diesel debate and the costs of owning each which is why I mentioned it.

Looking round at 330i times for 1/4 mile most are at 14.3 seconds for the older car, which was also .5 seconds slower to 60mph, so I would expect .8 seconds off the 1/4 mile from older car to newer one?? Even if you just knock the .5 seconds off then it is sub 14 seconds.
As I say, not much in it, not enough to loose sleep over and you have the fun of it being petrol, I would easily loose a second of 1/4 mile for that.


http://www.dragtimes.com/BMW--330i-Drag-Racing.html
thats in the USA Mate all cars run quicker there!!

a 258bhp 330i in the uk runs late 14's a 272bhp one will run mid 14's both UNDER 100MPH and take 15 odd seconds to to 100mph

the stock 335d is doing 100mph in 13's

Would a 330i live with M3 on the drag strip.... NO!!

335d does lol

a stock e9x 330i will NEVER break into the 13's mate over the quarter in the UK.
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      05-11-2008, 06:48 PM   #53
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I should add that I am not really interested in 100mph+ speeds and times any more.
After owning and older E30 325i I realise that the fun comes from other areas in this country, too many times in the 535d I could have had a 5 year ban if I had been caught, the tuned 335i was even worse, as was the CSL, but at least with the CSL you could do 50 miles on back roads and not break the speed limit and still have an absolute hoot.

Put it like this, the 330i is for me a more fun car than the 335i, I think it is because you have to work it, again the extra torque and the turbos of the 335i make it all a bit numb, get back in a NA straight six and there is something special there.

It maybe because I have not tried a manual 335i either though, getting back in a manual does make you feel more connected, and loose some of that 'press and go' feeling.
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      05-12-2008, 02:47 AM   #54
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This is where it started to get interesting, the consumption.
While hammering them the 335d was showing 28mpg and the petrol was showing 26mpg, so only 2mpg between them, but we do know that diesels excel when sat at just under 2000rpm on a steady cruise, so that is 65mph in the 335d, but who buys a 335d to sit at 65mph??
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Looking round at 330i times for 1/4 mile most are at 14.3 seconds for the older car, which was also .5 seconds slower to 60mph, so I would expect .8 seconds off the 1/4 mile from older car to newer one?? Even if you just knock the .5 seconds off then it is sub 14 seconds.
Good posts gIzzE !

The main economy benefit of diesels is that they run much more efficiently at part load and it's interesting to see that the 335d mpg is actually similar to the petrol car when both are being pushed.

As I recall EVO magazine show the 0-100mph of the OLD e46 330i as 14.5 secs. I'm pretty sure that the 258hp and 272hp e90 330i's would both be around that mark. Regardless, like you I'm not particularly interested in 100mph+ speeds.

0-60 is important, because accelerating up to the national speed limit is fun and legal I haven't driven at 100mph+ for years (on the road) so performance at that speed means little to me.

Personally I think the older 330i is a superbly balanced package. It has just enough power for the chassis. Enough to provoke oversteer and balance the car on the throttle (if you are able), but not so much that you have to reign yourself in all the time.

The 272 sounds great. I could use some extra economy (I average 25mpg at the moment) and a little bit of extra power wouldn't go amis.

What I do love is the sound of the engine and the buzz you get when you manage a perfect upshift right at the redline. 1-2 at 35mph and 2-3 at 68mph by that point (less than 7 seconds later) you are in license losing territory and that's where I back off.

There is a LOT of fun to be had getting there though.
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      05-12-2008, 02:50 AM   #55
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We then reset the OBC and went for a steady run into town, round the inner ring road, so a few roundabouts and sets of lights, and then out into the sticks and round the back roads for 15 odd miles at a steady pace.
The 335d was showing 37mpg by the time we got back and the 330i was showing 34mpg.
Of course you are comparing an auto with a manual which will have a reasonable effect I'd guess and also, the new 330i has all these claimed MPG improvements and the 335d you are comparing it to does not (yet).

I get 25.6 in my auto old style 330i so that would be a more accurate comparison to the 335d in MPG terms.
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      05-12-2008, 03:15 AM   #56
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when sat at just under 2000rpm on a steady cruise, so that is 65mph in the 335d, but who buys a 335d to sit at 65mph??
Why is that? 2000 rpm in the current manual 330d is 80 mph. Is the gearing really that different for autos?
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      05-12-2008, 05:09 AM   #57
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Of course you are comparing an auto with a manual which will have a reasonable effect I'd guess and also, the new 330i has all these claimed MPG improvements and the 335d you are comparing it to does not (yet).

I get 25.6 in my auto old style 330i so that would be a more accurate comparison to the 335d in MPG terms.
The new auto gearbox/software brings the manual and auto figures pretty close to each other consumption wise.
The first loaner 272bhp 330i I has was an auto saloon, and even though I only used it for work and hence optimal journey times for consumption, that returned over 34mpg which is pretty impressive for such a car.
I completley forgot about that car, in fact I didn't even realise it was an ED car when I had it, in fact I only really thought about it last night after posting.
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      05-12-2008, 05:30 AM   #58
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my 330d auto shows 2000rpm too at 80mph.. but I think the speedo is out by 3 mph at this speed judging by my tomtom.
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      05-12-2008, 05:40 AM   #59
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at 100mph the 335d is pulling 2550rpm in top!
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      05-12-2008, 06:07 AM   #60
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Good posts gIzzE !

0-60 is important, because accelerating up to the national speed limit is fun

What I do love is the sound of the engine and the buzz you get when you manage a perfect upshift right at the redline. 1-2 at 35mph and 2-3 at 68mph by that point (less than 7 seconds later) you are in license losing territory and that's where I back off.

There is a LOT of fun to be had getting there though.
Agree 100%. I drove the 335D and found it utterly souless and uninvolving, good as it is. I don't dispute for one moment that it's a rapid car, although I am sick and tired of hearing about it ad nauseam. No wonder there's a negative reaction from some people on here.

Horses for courses, naturally, but I like the sound of an engine revving and redlining. I used to have huge fun in my VVTI Celica 'cos you had to work it to get the most out of it. My mates' Honda Type R is a hoot to drive and my RX8, redlining at 9000rpm was a scream. Yes there are faster cars, but not many could keep up with it around the twisties on a dry day. Personally I don't give a monkeys about drag times and over the ton. It's yawn inducing.
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      05-12-2008, 06:32 AM   #61
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Sorry, the 65mph at 1800rpm was not exact, it was a figure plucked out of the air, that was not really the point either, the point was, to see really high mpg figures in a 335d you need to be sat cruising at a constant speed, and if you are going to do that you may as well buy the 320d, if you start to push the 335d the mpg figures plummet.


I agree RockIt, I have been there and done that, I think you have to work out what you want from a car, my old man loves his 730d, he has been a Merc man for years, loved that big wafty feel of an S320cdi and the comfort of it all, and I guess loved to say down the golf club that he drives a Mercedes S Class. But after getting my mum a 118d he suddenly decided that he might just have a go with a BMW himself, after 12 months with the 730d sport and 18k miles later he is hooked.
He even went and had a look at a 6er coupe to get something a little more nimble, but he is a big guy and it is too small, but he now says that thinking back the last time he really, really enjoyed just going for a drive for the sake of it was in his 535i E34 5 series, so probably around 1989, he thought that maybe it was just because he was younger, but thinking back now it was probably because it was a light weight, manual, rwd chuckable car.
These days they are all getting fare too cocooned, too safe, too separated to drive, turbos do not help in this repsect and nor does auto.
My last 10 cars have been autos, but getting back into the E30 325i manual with no traction control, revving to 70000 rpm and holding it in 3rd on the twisties between 50 and 70mph makes me realise there is more to a car than being able to overtake something on lane 4 of the motorway quicker than the next person.

I seriously think my next car may well be a NA manual petrol car, it may be a Z3 M Coupe and the 320d with be the everyday tool, but it is funny that it took a 20 year old car that cost less than my wheels on the E91 to make me realise this.
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      05-12-2008, 07:09 AM   #62
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Gizze, your post have made me think about what I want in a car.

6 cylinder petrol manual makes a lot of sense. Drive normally and get reasonably good mpg. & also you have a fun car at your disposal if you want to drive it. Best of both worlds really.
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      05-12-2008, 07:22 AM   #63
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... it is funny that it took a 20 year old car that cost less than my wheels on the E91 to make me realise this.
:

Without wishing to crack the can or worms open even further....

The price of fuel is becoming ridiculous, but it seems to be the same pretty much all over the world. I don't think it will be much longer before we start to see some serious unhappiness and the government being forced to do something more than just freezing fuel duty (and waiting for the crude price and so revenue to go up). To the average bloke on the street the increased costs are affordable if undesirable. But for hauliers who's costs before the recent price hike were 10s of thousands per month it is hitting extremely hard. One of the guys we use has cut his fleet from six wagons to two as the utilisation must be as high as possible to remain in business.

However, given the current circumstances petrol begins to make more sense again. Petrol cars are closing the performance gap on the diesel (who'd have thought you'd ever say that ) and the fuel consumption figures are closing. Insurance, which used to be cheaper for diesel has also (unfortunately) caught up.

However, the two are and remain completely different beasts. Whilst there are those who love the sound of revving to the redline in a petrol, there are an equal number who love the low down torque and effortless driving of the diesel. Given that total ownership costs are becoming more similar the choice becomes more one of just what you want to be driving everyday.

Also, as others have said, performance figures are largely sales hype. I could care less that my car will do 150mph. I'm certainly not going to risk that on the roads, and on a nice wide track you don't get the feeling of speed from stuff whizzing past close enough to feel it. A quick 0-60 is nice to get away from the oiks in Corsas and stay with Porch Boxters (they really don't like diesel estates keeping up with them ), but beyond that it's meaningless. Handling something that you cannot quantify as objectively is much more important to me than saving another half second on getting a ban.

I've always throught that a great fun track car would be something along the lines of a manual 330i (or d) fitted up with a set of spacesaver tyres. It's not about how fast you're going, but about the experience of driving on the edge.

We each have our own views though and in some cases they are quite different.
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      05-12-2008, 07:25 AM   #64
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im a petrol man thru and thru, and would have never bought a diesel before this one.

The 335d does excell in every department, apart from the lack of revs.

My next car will be a petrol without a doubt!

Will this hurt diesel residules do you think then?
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      05-12-2008, 08:07 AM   #65
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im a petrol man thru and thru, and would have never bought a diesel before this one.

The 335d does excell in every department, apart from the lack of revs.

My next car will be a petrol without a doubt!

Will this hurt diesel residules do you think then?
I'm sure the diesel residuals will not be noticably altered by one more 335d Carlos.
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      05-12-2008, 08:08 AM   #66
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I'm sure the diesel residuals will not be noticably altered by one more 335d Carlos.
confused by what you said mate?

What i mean is, with diesel prices etc and the predicted future oil prices. Will Diesels lose there advantage on the used market?
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