E90Post
 


GetBMWParts
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > Carbon Fiber Exhaust...



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      10-06-2008, 09:32 PM   #1
GreenPlease
Lieutenant Colonel
 
GreenPlease's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW 335i e92
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orlando Florida

Posts: 1,635
iTrader: (2)

Carbon Fiber Exhaust...

Has anyone considered a carbon fiber cat-back exhaust? I did a but found nothing. I have to think that there is potential for ~70lbs of weight saving by switching from SS to CF.

Anyone know the limits of the resin used for CF? I want to say 350C....

Thoughts?
GreenPlease is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 09:35 PM   #2
GreenPlease
Lieutenant Colonel
 
GreenPlease's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW 335i e92
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orlando Florida

Posts: 1,635
iTrader: (2)

As an addition, the CF exhaust could be made in this manner:

1. Take a normal cat back exhaust
2. Wrap in CF, apply resin, let set
3. Cut the CF in half length wise
4. Put the CF pieces back together and wrap again with CF, apply resin

Probably missing some stuff as I've never worked with CF before, but its a start.
GreenPlease is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 09:36 PM   #3
Amir87
Gruppe Titan
 
Amir87's Avatar
 
Drives: 08 E92 SG/Coral
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: NC

Posts: 2,839
iTrader: (37)

Garage List
2008 E92 335i  [5.00]
I don't know about CF but Titanium exhaust is a great alternative to save weight.

CF mainly used for looks on exhuast ie: tips.
__________________
Amir87 is offline   Pakistan
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 09:40 PM   #4
Sniz
Lieutenant General
 
Sniz's Avatar
 
Drives: e92 335 - gone // e36 M3 turbo
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Ellicott City, MD

Posts: 10,563
iTrader: (1)

wow that would be expensive
__________________
Sniz is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 09:43 PM   #5
GreenPlease
Lieutenant Colonel
 
GreenPlease's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW 335i e92
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orlando Florida

Posts: 1,635
iTrader: (2)

Amir87

Titanium cat-back? I'd think that would actually be heavy... strong, but heavy. Aluminum's number on the periodic table is 13, Ti's is 22.

The exhaust isn't a load bearing structure, so as long as it can hold up to the pressure and heat of the exhaust gas (and occasional shock) you should be able to make it out of whatever is lightest.
GreenPlease is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 09:50 PM   #6
Mr. 5
Modder Raider
 
Mr. 5's Avatar
 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Surf City, HB

Posts: 8,624
iTrader: (31)

Garage List
2007 e90 335i  [4.00]
I'm really curious with why someone would spend a good amount of money to dress up the underside of a car that nobody will see.

Scine CF is generaly used for weight savings, it's a little ironic how one would be adding weight to their car by adding the CF-not much weight but you get the idea.
__________________
e36 M3 Coupe, e36 325i Sedan
e90 335i--SOLD

Best 60-130-------------9.15 Seconds------------------WWW.MR5RACING.COM
Mr. 5 is offline   Scotland
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 09:51 PM   #7
wj4
Major General
 
Drives: E90 manual 335i
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Burbank, CA

Posts: 7,723
iTrader: (8)

Send a message via AIM to wj4
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenPlease View Post
Amir87

Titanium cat-back? I'd think that would actually be heavy... strong, but heavy. Aluminum's number on the periodic table is 13, Ti's is 22.

The exhaust isn't a load bearing structure, so as long as it can hold up to the pressure and heat of the exhaust gas (and occasional shock) you should be able to make it out of whatever is lightest.
Titanium exhausts are thin and light..the downside is that they're pretty loud. I remember seeing a Titanium catback for an Evo getting weighted and it came out to be around 8 lbs.
wj4 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 09:58 PM   #8
GreenPlease
Lieutenant Colonel
 
GreenPlease's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW 335i e92
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orlando Florida

Posts: 1,635
iTrader: (2)

Mr. 5

I think you misunderstood. My intent was for the exhaust to be exclusively CF, not a CF wrap, thus allowing for weight savings.
GreenPlease is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 10:01 PM   #9
Mr. 5
Modder Raider
 
Mr. 5's Avatar
 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Surf City, HB

Posts: 8,624
iTrader: (31)

Garage List
2007 e90 335i  [4.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenPlease View Post
Amir87

Titanium cat-back? I'd think that would actually be heavy... strong, but heavy. Aluminum's number on the periodic table is 13, Ti's is 22.

The exhaust isn't a load bearing structure, so as long as it can hold up to the pressure and heat of the exhaust gas (and occasional shock) you should be able to make it out of whatever is lightest.
Are you serious?
What exhaust is made out of aluminum?

One would save an easy 50 pounds by changing out their Stainless cat back exhaust with a titanium exhaust.

An e46 M3 rear muffler in SS is bout 40 pounds.
The same exact muffler is 20 pounds in TI.
__________________
e36 M3 Coupe, e36 325i Sedan
e90 335i--SOLD

Best 60-130-------------9.15 Seconds------------------WWW.MR5RACING.COM
Mr. 5 is offline   Scotland
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 10:02 PM   #10
Mr. 5
Modder Raider
 
Mr. 5's Avatar
 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Surf City, HB

Posts: 8,624
iTrader: (31)

Garage List
2007 e90 335i  [4.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenPlease View Post
Mr. 5

I think you misunderstood. My intent was for the exhaust to be exclusively CF, not a CF wrap, thus allowing for weight savings.
Whoops, I re-read the process.
I jsut can't see it holding up though.
Is it possible?
__________________
e36 M3 Coupe, e36 325i Sedan
e90 335i--SOLD

Best 60-130-------------9.15 Seconds------------------WWW.MR5RACING.COM
Mr. 5 is offline   Scotland
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 10:04 PM   #11
EOE90
Colonel
 
EOE90's Avatar
 
Drives: AW Power
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Laker City

Posts: 2,426
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2006 3  [0.00]
Send a message via AIM to EOE90
what about louis voiutton wrapped exhaust?
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by buschy View Post
you cannot buy a M3 for a commuter. it is only to be used on the tract. It drives horrible on the freeway, and is very uncomfortable for any longer then 20 minutes.
EOE90 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 10:06 PM   #12
l4wr3nc3
The Law.
 
l4wr3nc3's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Rowland Heights, CA

Posts: 14,281
iTrader: (17)

Send a message via AIM to l4wr3nc3
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenPlease View Post
Amir87

Titanium cat-back? I'd think that would actually be heavy... strong, but heavy. Aluminum's number on the periodic table is 13, Ti's is 22.

The exhaust isn't a load bearing structure, so as long as it can hold up to the pressure and heat of the exhaust gas (and occasional shock) you should be able to make it out of whatever is lightest.
i stopped reading after that. You really think titanium exhaust are heavy....
__________________

2008 Lotus Exige S240 | 2007 BMW 335i
l4wr3nc3 is offline   Taiwan
0
Reply With Quote
      10-06-2008, 10:06 PM   #13
GreenPlease
Lieutenant Colonel
 
GreenPlease's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW 335i e92
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Orlando Florida

Posts: 1,635
iTrader: (2)

I'm not sure, that's why I'm asking. Once again, I'm pretty sure the resin can hold up to 350C heat and I doubt corrosion or fatigue would be an issue. My biggest ? is to whether the exhaust gases are >350C after the cat.
GreenPlease is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-07-2008, 07:33 AM   #14
BoostedBMW
Moderator
 
BoostedBMW's Avatar
 
Drives: TiAg E92 335
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC

Posts: 6,787
iTrader: (14)

Garage List
2003 S2000  [0.00]
Send a message via AIM to BoostedBMW
Quote:
Originally Posted by wj4 View Post
Titanium exhausts are thin and light..the downside is that they're pretty loud. I remember seeing a Titanium catback for an Evo getting weighted and it came out to be around 8 lbs.
+1... we are talking about an exhaust that would most likely weigh less than 15lbs (dual mufflers for the 335) if it were made out of titanium. This car is a pig to begin with so to have to go through all of the trouble of making a custom CF exhaust (I have never heard of this to be honest) seems like it wouldn't be worth the trouble. BTW, what happens when a rock hits the undersite of your CF exhaust? I know that the CF diffuser on my s2000 took a whole month to crack.

In any case, does anyone even produce a full Ti exhaust yet for this car? I can't remember if it was JIC or some other JDM brand that I think produced one.
__________________
-Michael.
Berlina Black S2000 CR is now in the garage

l 19" Rial Daytona Race l KW V2 l Eisenhaus Race Exhaust l
BoostedBMW is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-07-2008, 07:59 AM   #15
roadkillrob
Brigadier General
 
Drives: 2008 335Cic, 2011 X5 35i
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Boston

Posts: 3,801
iTrader: (14)

I would worry about the heat after the CAT - cat's operate at internal temperatures of about 1300 degrees as the chemical reactions inside the cat are made to generate heat as it takes a lot of heat to break up the molecules in the emissions. I would also worry about turbulance as the inside of the carbon piping is pretty rough.

Rob
__________________

2008 E93 335i, GIAC Stage 2, HPF IC, Injen Intake, Defective AR Design DP's with useless cats
2014 X3 35i JB Stage 1
roadkillrob is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-07-2008, 08:04 AM   #16
J.P.
Close to bein Bannned
 
J.P.'s Avatar
 
Drives: Pussy Magnet
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Hunterdon, NJ

Posts: 5,068
iTrader: (0)

Send a message via AIM to J.P.
U can buy Carbon fiber tubing. Most Aerospace wholesalers have them
just google it. Now the muffler may be a problem...
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by sexye92 View Post
JERRYS MOM= BEST HEAD OF MY LIFE
J.P. is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-07-2008, 08:05 AM   #17
thegeneral101
Colonel
 
Drives: '13 M3 LRE,'13 750Li
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Miami/Michigan

Posts: 2,301
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoostedBMW View Post
+1... we are talking about an exhaust that would most likely weigh less than 15lbs (dual mufflers for the 335) if it were made out of titanium. This car is a pig to begin with so to have to go through all of the trouble of making a custom CF exhaust (I have never heard of this to be honest) seems like it wouldn't be worth the trouble. BTW, what happens when a rock hits the undersite of your CF exhaust? I know that the CF diffuser on my s2000 took a whole month to crack.

In any case, does anyone even produce a full Ti exhaust yet for this car? I can't remember if it was JIC or some other JDM brand that I think produced one.
i agree with you, the cost would not "outweigh" the benefits
__________________
thegeneral101 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-07-2008, 08:08 AM   #18
J.P.
Close to bein Bannned
 
J.P.'s Avatar
 
Drives: Pussy Magnet
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Hunterdon, NJ

Posts: 5,068
iTrader: (0)

Send a message via AIM to J.P.
http://www.dragonplate.com/

http://www.composite-resources.com/o...s/default.html

http://www.onlinemetals.com/merchant.cfm?id=1057&step=2
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by sexye92 View Post
JERRYS MOM= BEST HEAD OF MY LIFE
J.P. is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-07-2008, 09:00 AM   #19
uberschnell
Brigadier General
 
uberschnell's Avatar
 
Drives: // 135i //, X5
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Bay Area

Posts: 3,417
iTrader: (43)

I'm not too sure how CF would handle the high-freq vibrations over the long term. Plus, the weight savings would be at the base of the car. Better to remove weight working your way down from the top, bigger bennefits.
__________________
- 08 135i - Wavetrac LSD, AST 4100, Swift springs, Brembo GT brakes, M3 front sway, Meyle HD links, Dinan Camber plates, Whiteline subframe bushings, M3 rear guide and upper link, M3 front control arms, HP custom M3 front Strut brace, Megan rear control arms, F30 brake shields -
uberschnell is offline   No_Country
0
Reply With Quote
      10-07-2008, 09:19 AM   #20
Andras
Bodhisattva
 
Andras's Avatar
 
Drives: 335i E92 MY07
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Ferrara - Italy

Posts: 181
iTrader: (1)

Exclamation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sniz View Post
wow that would be expensive
+1, just think about the price of a Gruppe M air intake and how small such intake is in comparison with a 335i exhaust
__________________
Salut, Gilles!


335I E92 6AT - V3.2 - GRUPPE M - FMI - RR DOWNPIPES - AE EXHAUST HFC
Andras is offline   Italy
0
Reply With Quote
      10-07-2008, 01:49 PM   #21
NMS335
NA Convert
 
NMS335's Avatar
 
Drives: 2008 335i Coupe
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Cincinnati

Posts: 190
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoostedBMW View Post

In any case, does anyone even produce a full Ti exhaust yet for this car? I can't remember if it was JIC or some other JDM brand that I think produced one.
Does any one know who it was that produced one? The only one that I have seen is the Erricsson (Amuse) exhaust for the e92 m3.
__________________


"Ex Vi Termini : With Strength Comes Limits"
NMS335 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      10-07-2008, 08:02 PM   #22
Leebro61
New Member
 
Drives: e92 335i
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Greenville, SC

Posts: 26
iTrader: (0)

Just run an aluminum exhaust if you are interested in weight savings. You'll still need to run steel mufflers (if you plan on running any), so traditionally we do this by using mixed material V-band clamps. No, it won't melt and how long it will last will depend on the quality of the fitment and the welding. My brother ran an Aluminum downpipe on his SFWD car for a while without issue.
Leebro61 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:11 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST