E90Post
 


VIBE Motorsports
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Suspension | Brakes | Chassis > More 135i/335i Suspension R&D - E9X M3 rear camber link and damper



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      02-02-2009, 11:46 PM   #1
HP Autosport
United_States
406

 
Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Barbara, Brembo, GIAC, Koni, Ohlins, Performance Friction, Quaife, Stoptech, Vorshlag


Posts: 11,388
iTrader: (29)

More 135i/335i Suspension R&D - E9X M3 rear camber link and damper

Okay, so we have done the E9X front M3 tension rods, lower wishbones, and anti-roll bar. Moved on to the rear of the vehicle and done the guide rod, upper camber links, subframe bushings, and the rear anti-roll bar.

It's time to sort out the remaining rear-end pieces, up the spring rates and speed up the respond time on both the spring(lighter springs) and dampers. However, the last piece to be addressed will be the rear toe link, and we are working very closely with "orb" to finalize on the design, this particular R&D will take a few months.

Back to the other rear-end pieces....this process will take several days or maybe longer depends on how much time we have. Rear E9X M3 light weight alloy lower camber links will replace the heavy 135i/335i steel counter parts. The M3 camber link is a good 2 lbs!!! lighter per unit and of a much stronger design with less flex. The dampers will be better positioned to have a quicker reaction time to bumps and no longer be in the soft and flexible 135i/335i rubber saddles. Coil-over style spring with helper spring, proper spring stack adapters, and spring thrust sheets will be used. We will start with a rate of 784 in/lbs and move up from there. Dampers will be Koni double adjustable units valved properly to handle the spring rates we toss at them.

Here are some photos...notice the difference between the E9X M3 lower camber and the 135i/335i piece.

Added a new photo here...R&D is almost done!
Attached Images
     

Last edited by HP Autosport; 02-06-2009 at 10:56 PM.
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 03:23 AM   #2
scollins
Bootleggin' 'n Gunrunnin'
No_Country
34

 
scollins's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 e70 X5 35d
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Renton, WA


Posts: 2,345
iTrader: (3)

Nice! "Good things come to those who wait" seems to be working out for me.

Keep up the great work!
__________________
Scott
2010 E70 X5 35d
Alpine White on Black with Dark Bamboo trim
ZAP | ZCW | ZPP | ZPS | ZRC | ZTP | 322 | 328 | 330 | 386 | 4AZ | 4UB | 655 | 6FL | 6NF
2008 Ducati 1098S Red naturally....
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 04:26 AM   #3
andrew@southernBM
Australia
34

 
andrew@southernBM's Avatar
 
Drives: 135i, M3 92 SC'd, M235i
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Melbourne, Australia.


Posts: 1,467
iTrader: (0)

Wow, great work, keep up the development HP
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 05:23 AM   #4
LaYzEe
Major
18

 
LaYzEe's Avatar
 
Drives: AW E92 335i
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Bay Area, Ca


Posts: 1,040
iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by scollins View Post
Nice! "Good things come to those who wait" seems to be working out for me.

Keep up the great work!
+1!!!!!!!!!

cant wait to hear more news about this
__________________
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 09:50 AM   #5
stressdoc
Moderator
Dominica
134

 
stressdoc's Avatar
 
Drives: F80 YMB
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: MO


Posts: 10,159
iTrader: (0)

It makes me wish BMW had just made all the E9x with these quality aluminum parts to begin with and raised the price a couple hundred $.
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 10:32 AM   #6
flukey
Go big or go home!
United_States
16

 
Drives: E90 335xi
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Iowa


Posts: 948
iTrader: (9)

I'm wishing some aftermarket company will develop upgraded front suspension components for the XI folks!
__________________
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 11:00 AM   #7
mwahlert
Lieutenant Colonel
29

 
mwahlert's Avatar
 
Drives: 2008 335i
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Durham, NC


Posts: 1,556
iTrader: (7)

Garage List
2007 335i  [0.00]
when you see all of these individual m3 suspension components you start to understand why the m3 is so much more expensive than a e9x

i don't understand why they didn't just use the same components across the entire platform and bump the price a couple of bucks across the board...
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 05:21 PM   #8
cyphr
Major
21

 
cyphr's Avatar
 
Drives: 08 335xi coupe
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Boston


Posts: 1,231
iTrader: (12)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mwahlert View Post
when you see all of these individual m3 suspension components you start to understand why the m3 is so much more expensive than a e9x

i don't understand why they didn't just use the same components across the entire platform and bump the price a couple of bucks across the board...
Although the m3 and 335 share the same chassis, you're pretty much comparing apples to oranges. The m3 is designed to be a track machine, whereas the 335 is marketed more as a sport touring car. It's a bit much to ask for the same suspension components for cars that serve different purposes. But that doesn't mean these won't be on my wishlist!
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 06:31 PM   #9
Fraggy
Brigadier General
United_States
46

 
Fraggy's Avatar
 
Drives: 2007 e90
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: San Diego


Posts: 3,321
iTrader: (11)

Ok STOP STOP STOP!!!!! LOL

I cant keep up with all that I need to do to my car
__________________
Step--Premium--Sport--Nav--20% Tint--Blacklines--18" Beyern Mesh--Michelin Super Sports--Bastuck Exhaust--M3 Steering Wheel--BMW Performance Springs--Koni--M3 Front/Rear Sways--
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 06:45 PM   #10
flukey
Go big or go home!
United_States
16

 
Drives: E90 335xi
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Iowa


Posts: 948
iTrader: (9)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraggy View Post
Ok STOP STOP STOP!!!!! LOL

I cant keep up with all that I need to do to my car
Neither can I! I want all these rear M3 kits...
__________________
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 06:58 PM   #11
HP Autosport
United_States
406

 
Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Barbara, Brembo, GIAC, Koni, Ohlins, Performance Friction, Quaife, Stoptech, Vorshlag


Posts: 11,388
iTrader: (29)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraggy View Post
Ok STOP STOP STOP!!!!! LOL

I cant keep up with all that I need to do to my car
We promise this will be the next to last thing we are developing for the 335i suspension!
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 07:18 PM   #12
mwahlert
Lieutenant Colonel
29

 
mwahlert's Avatar
 
Drives: 2008 335i
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Durham, NC


Posts: 1,556
iTrader: (7)

Garage List
2007 335i  [0.00]
wait - i'm confused - are you guys designing your own part? the m3 part can't be used like the front suspension components?
Appreciate 0
      02-03-2009, 07:33 PM   #13
HP Autosport
United_States
406

 
Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Barbara, Brembo, GIAC, Koni, Ohlins, Performance Friction, Quaife, Stoptech, Vorshlag


Posts: 11,388
iTrader: (29)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mwahlert View Post
wait - i'm confused - are you guys designing your own part? the m3 part can't be used like the front suspension components?
Perhaps R&D is a better term. The components look like they will bolt on, but in reality many parts will need to be added to make it all work properly.

We have to figure out which spring diameter, height, and rate to use. Damper style and valving also had to researched.

The final phase will be completely from scratch.

Stay tuned!
Appreciate 0
      02-05-2009, 06:09 PM   #14
seccsc
Second Lieutenant
United_States
2

 
seccsc's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 335i
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: VA


Posts: 278
iTrader: (0)

Subscribed.... I can't wait to hear the updates.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      02-05-2009, 07:09 PM   #15
Chowbow
pew pew
80

 
Drives: 三三五i
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CA


Posts: 6,729
iTrader: (5)

Garage List
Wait, so is this basically the M3 lower control arm we're seeing? I know that the rear shocks are different, the lower mounting points are as pictured with the shock/damper installed. I've never actually went to look at the M3 LCA though.

For current non-M owners though that would mean getting at least a different set of rear shocks that are M3 specific, right?

And really, not to throw fuel into the fire, but I remember seeing these from Turner. It utilizes the stock 335i LCA, but you take out the rubber shock mount and use these solid ones: http://www.turnermotorsport.com/html..._ID=TSU9006RU2. They have a matching upper RSM to match too. Just something to ponder.
__________________
CSL replicas are now CSL counterfeits. Jesus saves, like Valentine1.
Appreciate 0
      02-05-2009, 07:10 PM   #16
Chowbow
pew pew
80

 
Drives: 三三五i
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CA


Posts: 6,729
iTrader: (5)

Garage List
Oh, and great work BTW.
__________________
CSL replicas are now CSL counterfeits. Jesus saves, like Valentine1.
Appreciate 0
      02-05-2009, 07:22 PM   #17
Mr. 5
Modder Raider
Scotland
267

 
Mr. 5's Avatar
 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Surf City, HB


Posts: 8,626
iTrader: (31)

Garage List
2007 e90 335i  [4.00]
That looks to be a very nice quality product!
__________________
e36 M3 Coupe, e36 325i Sedan
e90 335i--SOLD

Best 60-130-------------9.15 Seconds------------------WWW.MR5RACING.COM
Appreciate 0
      02-06-2009, 01:44 AM   #18
HP Autosport
United_States
406

 
Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Barbara, Brembo, GIAC, Koni, Ohlins, Performance Friction, Quaife, Stoptech, Vorshlag


Posts: 11,388
iTrader: (29)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chowbow View Post
Wait, so is this basically the M3 lower control arm we're seeing? I know that the rear shocks are different, the lower mounting points are as pictured with the shock/damper installed. I've never actually went to look at the M3 LCA though.

For current non-M owners though that would mean getting at least a different set of rear shocks that are M3 specific, right?

And really, not to throw fuel into the fire, but I remember seeing these from Turner. It utilizes the stock 335i LCA, but you take out the rubber shock mount and use these solid ones: http://www.turnermotorsport.com/html..._ID=TSU9006RU2. They have a matching upper RSM to match too. Just something to ponder.

In addition to Orb's reply...Those are meant for racing only and will transmitt much more impact harshness and noise to the cabin, not to mention you must purchase a race damper using Spherical Bearing or Rod-End to complete the install.
Appreciate 0
      02-06-2009, 01:46 AM   #19
HP Autosport
United_States
406

 
Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Barbara, Brembo, GIAC, Koni, Ohlins, Performance Friction, Quaife, Stoptech, Vorshlag


Posts: 11,388
iTrader: (29)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chowbow View Post

For current non-M owners though that would mean getting at least a different set of rear shocks that are M3 specific, right?
.
We will offer a couple of different coil-over packages with our custom dampers and springs, either in a 335i or 335i/M3 style damper combo.
Appreciate 0
      02-06-2009, 02:33 AM   #20
Chowbow
pew pew
80

 
Drives: 三三五i
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CA


Posts: 6,729
iTrader: (5)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orb View Post
The BMW links cost less than the turner adapters and a much better solution.

Orb
Quote:
Originally Posted by HP Autowerks View Post
In addition to Orb's reply...Those are meant for racing only and will transmitt much more impact harshness and noise to the cabin, not to mention you must purchase a race damper using Spherical Bearing or Rod-End to complete the install.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HP Autowerks View Post
We will offer a couple of different coil-over packages with our custom dampers and springs, either in a 335i or 335i/M3 style damper combo.
Good to hear guys. Just a suggestion... The upper shock mount, in my experience, is a weak point too. The bushing is soft and in more than one instance it has gotten bound up between the shock and the body of the car. I don't think the Turner motorsport upper RSM is quite the solution, and it's incredibly expensive, but maybe something you guys can improve on?

Harold, good to hear a customizable solution is coming.
__________________
CSL replicas are now CSL counterfeits. Jesus saves, like Valentine1.
Appreciate 0
      02-06-2009, 03:07 AM   #21
HP Autosport
United_States
406

 
Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Barbara, Brembo, GIAC, Koni, Ohlins, Performance Friction, Quaife, Stoptech, Vorshlag


Posts: 11,388
iTrader: (29)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chowbow View Post
Good to hear guys. Just a suggestion... The upper shock mount, in my experience, is a weak point too. The bushing is soft and in more than one instance it has gotten bound up between the shock and the body of the car. I don't think the Turner motorsport upper RSM is quite the solution, and it's incredibly expensive, but maybe something you guys can improve on?

Harold, good to hear a customizable solution is coming.
Haven't seen any rear upper damper mount failures onthe E8X/9X chassis yet, but will look into it.

Harold
Appreciate 0
      02-06-2009, 03:14 AM   #22
Chowbow
pew pew
80

 
Drives: 三三五i
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CA


Posts: 6,729
iTrader: (5)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by HP Autowerks View Post
Haven't seen any rear upper damper mount failures onthe E8X/9X chassis yet, but will look into it.

Harold
It happened on mine during an autoX. It busted the bushing that goes on the "shock side" of shock mount. It did not affect the "trunk liner side" bushing.

It happened on a pretty rough site with lots of elevation changes. It seems the bushing got unloaded and shifted a bit when the suspension became fully unloaded at the peak of an undulation. Then, when the weight of the car came back down to load the suspension, the "nipple" on top of the bushing had shifted underneath the sheet metal and the weight of the car was smashing down on that nipple, destroying the bushing.

In fact, a tougher polyurethane bushing with a taller nipple might be enough to prevent that in the future.
__________________
CSL replicas are now CSL counterfeits. Jesus saves, like Valentine1.
Appreciate 0
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:59 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST