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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > Regional Forums > UK > UK Technical Forum > 335i Turbos - Stage 2 now installed and reviewed!!



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      11-05-2009, 10:46 AM   #45
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Lookin good Tony!
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      11-05-2009, 10:55 AM   #46
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nice stuff!

looking forward to your impressions.

will you get this dyno'd again for comparison?
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      11-05-2009, 10:58 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sniz View Post
nice stuff!

looking forward to your impressions.

will you get this dyno'd again for comparison?
The car has to be remapped again to take into account the new turbo performance so it'll be on the dyno again. I don't know how hard I want to push the car - theoretically I should be able to get over 500bhp quite easily, but I'm not really keen on the idea as having 470bhp with room to spare is more in keeping with the idea of durability!
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      11-05-2009, 11:04 AM   #48
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More pictures -

TD have machined completely new wastegate bushes from stainless billet to replace the worn bushes. These will be much more durable!


New wastegate bush machined from stainless billet

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New wastegate bush installed

Name:  New wastegate bush from the other side - small.jpg
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      11-05-2009, 11:04 AM   #49
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Jeez, you must have ragged that poor car everywhere tone
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      11-05-2009, 11:11 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by creepy coupe View Post
Jeez, you must have ragged that poor car everywhere tone
Not really... I think it's the 150+ laps of the 'Ring that's done it
Still, someone's got to find out what the factory parts can handle, right?!
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      11-05-2009, 11:11 AM   #51
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TD are really doing a great job! new wastegate rod bushing, wastegate seat etc!!!

BMW should have done al this to solve the turbo rattling problem!!!!

Inpatient to have more pictures about the wastegate seat and the flap...
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      11-05-2009, 11:13 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post
TD are really doing a great job! new wastegate rod bushing, wastegate seat etc!!!

BMW should have done al this to solve the turbo rattling problem!!!!

Inpatient to have more pictures about the wastegate seat and the flap...
BMW can't do anything like this, because it requires a complete redesign of the turbo by Mitsubishi. The amount of work gone into it is just too costly for an OEM fix.
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      11-05-2009, 11:18 AM   #53
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I might just buy a set of used turbos and send these over to have them re-built when my turbos go kaboom!
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      11-05-2009, 11:20 AM   #54
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strange thet mitsu designed such a crap turbo, normally they are doing well

why TD isn't installing a bigger exhaust turbine wheel? Only bend the OEM fins?

Really hope the spooling time won't be increased by the mod... pulling hard from 1500rpm till 7K would be insane
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      11-05-2009, 11:44 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post
strange thet mitsu designed such a crap turbo, normally they are doing well

why TD isn't installing a bigger exhaust turbine wheel? Only bend the OEM fins?

Really hope the spooling time won't be increased by the mod... pulling hard from 1500rpm till 7K would be insane

You're right, only the compressor wheel has been enlarged and not the exhaust turbine wheel. The exhaust turbine hasn't been enlarged because it's really hard to get a bigger exhaust wheel into the housing for a few reasons. Firstly the size of the shaft, journal bearings and thrust bearings would all be different so as well as sourcing a new shaft you would need to find something that has the same outside-diameter journal bearings. This would be like searching for a needle in a hay stack. The second would be trying to re-profile the turbine housing would be very difficult especially for a one off. It would be possible in batches but then you come back to the first problem of finding the right size parts!

And just to clarify one point - the OEM blades aren't "bent" - Turbo Dynamics use a cylindrical grinder to remove literally a very tiny slice of material
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      11-05-2009, 11:53 AM   #56
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WOW this is really High tech processing.

Hopefully they keep all the tools for future use, I think if everything goes well for you I will go to them with my spare turbo set

Do they specify the extra performance of the turbos cfm psi and spool time?
Or is it a surprise when you will test it?
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      11-05-2009, 12:09 PM   #57
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excellent, good luck
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      11-05-2009, 12:14 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E92Fan View Post
The car has to be remapped again to take into account the new turbo performance so it'll be on the dyno again. I don't know how hard I want to push the car - theoretically I should be able to get over 500bhp quite easily, but I'm not really keen on the idea as having 470bhp with room to spare is more in keeping with the idea of durability!
Looks all really neat and professional. Inspires confidence and makes me wish to have that, too!

One question: Can you drive the car with the upgraded turbos without the remap? Or do you believe that will trigger a limp mode? I assume you will have to drive the car to DMS for the remap, don't you?

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      11-05-2009, 12:14 PM   #59
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what about the ASR turbine? only intoxicating info?

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      11-05-2009, 12:35 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post
what about the ASR turbine? only intoxicating info?
ASR is using Garrett ball bearing turbos and have not upgraded the Mitsubishi ones like Turbo Dynamics do. But there's no detailed info about what they have done, at least so far and to my knowledge.

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      11-05-2009, 12:44 PM   #61
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from the picture found on this forum it seems the housings are the same as OEM

indeed ball bearing would be better for the TD upgrade?!
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      11-05-2009, 12:45 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marconi118 View Post
what about the ASR turbine? only intoxicating info?
From Turbo Dynamics -

"Looking at the ASR turbine wheel, they have changed the CHRA (core assembly) for a Garrett CHRA which not only means a lot of machining and probably a welded adaptor ring on the turbine housing. It also means that you would have to change the oil and water lines which I can imagine isn't easy!"

I'm not a turbo expert by any stretch in terms of the design and components, so I'll leave it at that for now!
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      11-05-2009, 12:55 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick.CBR View Post
This is awesome info. I love the good images of the progress. I really believe this level of attn to detail will win customers down the road. It's great to see the quality of their work.

On another note - it will be interesting to see what the next few years brings with regard to the mitsu turbos used on the N54 engine. I wonder if BMW reads threads like these - if I were an engineer, I would be very very interested in long term wear on a single engine that has that many laps 'round the 'ring. It sounds like the motor is ok though and it's more an issue with the turbo's?

Thanks!

Nick

The engine itself on my car is in pristine condition, and the head is totally clean too. The main issue is the degradation of the turbos as you have already seen. And yes, BMW UK are well aware of the condition of my car
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      11-05-2009, 01:00 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpina_B3_Lux View Post

One question: Can you drive the car with the upgraded turbos without the remap? Or do you believe that will trigger a limp mode? I assume you will have to drive the car to DMS for the remap, don't you?

Alpina_B3_Lux
I have read a thread stating that ASR have driven their car using the standard map on their upgraded turbos completely limp mode free - this was prior to Vishnu's official involvement I believe.

They apparently made some gains over stock, but clearly no where near the potential of the upgrade.
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      11-05-2009, 01:07 PM   #65
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Looks very impressive Tony, car will fly with all that power ,my old 335i was very rapid and that was with 370bhp God knows what 470bhp will be like from the 335i ,absolute rocket ship I assume.
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      11-05-2009, 01:10 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjm8282 View Post
Great write up, sounds really good.

I have just had my software upgraded and wastegates aligned, but I have noticed a lot of smoke coming from the exhaust on a standstill. I start the car in the morning, leave it running for 10 mins and still when I go into my boot I have to walk through a cloud of smoke. I expect some smoke due to the cold, but is this the norm?? Mines a early 2006 335 model.
I had myturbos replaced a few months ago on my 2008 135i so they are pretty new......and with the colder weather, I too have recently noticed what i consider to be an above average amount of smoke when the car is at idle.

However, as already suggested....the smoke has absolutely no odour to it at all and subsides once you rev the engine.

Looks like condensation to me but there is so much of it.....I can only assume that the stock pre-catalytics are doing a really good job of converting the exhaust gases to H2O.

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