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      05-06-2010, 04:49 PM   #1
bosstones
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Kicked Off Campus for Wearing American Flag Tees

"Incendiary"?! WTF?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36981179?GT1=43001

By George Kiriyama
NBCBayArea.com

On any other day at Live Oak High School in Morgan Hill, Daniel Galli and his four friends would not even be noticed for wearing T-shirts with the American flag. But Cinco de Mayo is not any typical day especially on a campus with a large Mexican American student population.

Galli says he and his friends were sitting at a table during brunch break when the vice principal asked two of the boys to remove American flag bandannas that they wearing on their heads and for the others to turn their American flag T-shirts inside out. When they refused, the boys were ordered to go to the principal's office.

"They said we could wear it on any other day," Daniel Galli said, "but today is sensitive to Mexican-Americans because it's supposed to be their holiday so we were not allowed to wear it today."

The boys said the administrators called their T-shirts "incendiary" that would lead to fights on campus.

"They said if we tried to go back to class with our shirts not taken off, they said it was defiance and we would get suspended," Dominic Maciel, Galli's friend, said.

The boys really had no choice, and went home to avoid suspension. They say they're angry they were not allowed to express their American pride. Their parents are just as upset, calling what happened to their children, "total nonsense."

"I think it's absolutely ridiculous," Julie Fagerstrom, Maciel's mom, said. "All they were doing was displaying their patriotic nature. They're expressing their individuality."

But to many Mexican-American students at Live Oak, this was a big deal. They say they were offended by the five boys and others for wearing American colors on a Mexican holiday.

"I think they should apologize cause it is a Mexican Heritage Day," Annicia Nunez, a Live Oak High student, said. "We don't deserve to be get disrespected like that. We wouldn't do that on Fourth of July."

As for an apology, the boys and their families say, 'fat chance.'

"I'm not going to apologize. I did nothing wrong," Galli said. "I went along with my normal day. I might have worn an American flag, but I'm an American and I'm proud to be an American."

The five boys and their families met with a Morgan Hill Unified School District official Wednesday night. The district and the school do not see eye-to-eye on the incident and released the following statement:

The district does not concur with the Live Oak High School administration's interpretation of either board or district policy related to these actions.

The boys will not be suspended and were allowed to return to school Thursday. We spotted one of them when he got to campus -- and, yes, he was sporting an American flag T-shirt.
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      05-06-2010, 06:02 PM   #2
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There are two travesties here:


1. The students were threatened with suspension for wearing the t-shirts on Cinco de Mayo.
2. The students thought it was OK to wear such shirt.


Regarding #2, let me clarify.

http://www.ushistory.org/betsy/flagcode.htm


Quote:
United States Code Title 4 Chapter 1 — The Flag
Quote:
8. Respect for flag

a. No disrespect should be shown to the flag of the United States of America; the flag should not be dipped to any person or thing. Regimental colors, State flags, and organization or institutional flags are to be dipped as a mark of honor.
b. The flag should never be displayed with the union down, except as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property. The flag should never touch anything beneath it, such as the ground, the floor, water, or merchandise.
c. The flag should never be carried flat or horizontally, but always aloft and free.
d. The flag should never be used as wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery. It should never be festooned, drawn back, nor up, in folds, but always allowed to fall free. Bunting of blue, white, and red, always arranged with the blue above, the white in the middle, and the red below, should be used for covering a speaker's desk, draping the front of the platform, and for decoration in general.
Now, you might argue that a t-shirt is not a "flag".

Quote:
3. Use of flag for advertising purposes; mutilation of flag
Any person who, within the District of Columbia, in any manner, for exhibition or display, shall place or cause to be placed any word, figure, mark, picture, design, drawing, or any advertisement of any nature upon any flag, standard, colors, or ensign of the United States of America; or shall expose or cause to be exposed to public view any such flag, standard, colors, or ensign upon which shall have been printed, painted, or otherwise placed, or to which shall be attached, appended, affixed, or annexed any word, figure, mark, picture, design, or drawing, or any advertisement of any nature; or who, within the District of Columbia, shall manufacture, sell, expose for sale, or to public view, or give away or have in possession for sale, or to be given away or for use for any purpose, any article or substance being an article of merchandise, or a receptacle for merchandise or article or thing for carrying or transporting merchandise, upon which shall have been printed, painted, attached, or otherwise placed a representation of any such flag, standard, colors, or ensign, to advertise, call attention to, decorate, mark, or distinguish the article or substance on which so placed shall be deemed guilty of a misdemeanor and shall be punished by a fine not exceeding $100 or by imprisonment for not more than thirty days, or both, in the discretion of the court. The words "flag, standard, colors, or ensign", as used herein, shall include any flag, standard, colors, ensign, or any picture or representation of either, or of any part or parts of either, made of any substance or represented on any substance, of any size evidently purporting to be either of said flag, standard, colors, or ensign of the United States of America or a picture or a representation of either, upon which shall be shown the colors, the stars and the stripes, in any number of either thereof, or of any part or parts of either, by which the average person seeing the same without deliberation may believe the same to represent the flag, colors, standard, or ensign of the United States of America.
So what should they do with these t-shirts? Burn them.


Quote:
8. Respect for flag

[...]

k. The flag, when it is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning.
Emphasis on various sentences added by me.

Last edited by radix; 05-06-2010 at 06:17 PM.
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      05-06-2010, 06:08 PM   #3
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For what it's worth I personally called my local city to complain when prior to the forth of July my city hung flags off of the street lamps. The street lamps have sharp crowns on them and they were ripping the flags to shreds. Had I the equipment to do so, I'd have pulled each of those torn flags down myself and burned them. Unfortunately I'm not very good at climbing slick metal street lamp poles.
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      05-06-2010, 06:31 PM   #4
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I guess that I am an old crank. But IMO the flag belongs on flag poles, uniforms of those serving their fellow citizens and on the caskets of those of have died in the line of duty.

Not t-shirts. Not bandannas. And not on the lapels of politicians.

But as for the offended Mexican-Americans -- choose. One or the other, just as my great grandparents did.
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      05-07-2010, 01:15 AM   #5
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they were not kicked out for violating the flag code of conduct. they were kicked out for wearing the american flag on a mexican holiday. that is a travesty. even the school district leaders agreed it was wrong to kick them out. its PC at its worst.
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      05-07-2010, 08:22 AM   #6
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I think if you go to a July 4th BBQ wearing a mexican flag shirt, you will get treated poorly. It's a bad idea. So the same should be true as well.
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      05-07-2010, 08:33 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xbook View Post
I think if you go to a July 4th BBQ wearing a mexican flag shirt, you will get treated poorly. It's a bad idea. So the same should be true as well.
Is the BBQ in Mexico?
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      05-07-2010, 09:30 AM   #8
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Turns out the VP at this school is an American hater and racist. It is he whom should leave and go home.

HS
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      05-07-2010, 09:36 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ragingclue View Post
Is the BBQ in Mexico?
I literally spit water all over my desk when I read this... Could not have said it any better.
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      05-07-2010, 12:18 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYCGarbagePrince View Post
I literally spit water all over my desk when I read this... Could not have said it any better.
yup he hit the nail on the head.
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      05-08-2010, 12:32 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ragingclue View Post
Is the BBQ in Mexico?
Ding Ding Ding! we have a winner!

a quote from one of the kid in that school "We don't deserve to be get disrespected like that. We wouldn't do that on Fourth of July."

wat? he's not an American?
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      05-10-2010, 09:24 AM   #12
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Even in Mexico you don't see people wearing the Mexican flag because it's illegal, just like stated for the US Flag, above. The difference is that in Mexico, the federalies will do something about ENFORCING the law.
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      05-10-2010, 09:31 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UncleWede View Post
Even in Mexico you don't see people wearing the Mexican flag because it's illegal, just like stated for the US Flag, above. The difference is that in Mexico, the federalies will do something about ENFORCING the law.
I agree.

The kid should not have been wearing the shirt, as stated above by Radix.

However, the reasoning behind the school's decision is just as bad. You would think that, amongst that many "educated" adults, one of them would have stood up and said, "Hey it's illegal". Why don't Americans know about stuff like this?

Instead they kick the kid out because he's being insensitive by wearing the shirt in the US during a holiday celebrated by a completely different country? Unbelievable.
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      05-11-2010, 07:57 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ragingclue View Post
I agree.

The kid should not have been wearing the shirt, as stated above by Radix.

However, the reasoning behind the school's decision is just as bad. You would think that, amongst that many "educated" adults, one of them would have stood up and said, "Hey it's illegal". Why don't Americans know about stuff like this?

Instead they kick the kid out because he's being insensitive by wearing the shirt in the US during a holiday celebrated by a completely different country? Unbelievable.
It's not technically illegal as the supreme court has decided that flag desecration is provided for by free speech. However, it is highly ignorant and disrespectful to wear the flag as if it were some sort of fashion accessory imo. The only thing that pisses me off more is those flag doormats. Having people walk on an image of the flag is just wrong. Don't get me wrong, I think these people largely have good intentions, but are completely ignorant as to how the flag should be treated.
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      05-11-2010, 08:26 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radix View Post
It's not technically illegal as the supreme court has decided that flag desecration is provided for by free speech. However, it is highly ignorant and disrespectful to wear the flag as if it were some sort of fashion accessory imo. The only thing that pisses me off more is those flag doormats. Having people walk on an image of the flag is just wrong. Don't get me wrong, I think these people largely have good intentions, but are completely ignorant as to how the flag should be treated.
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      05-12-2010, 12:37 AM   #16
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All formalities aside, regarding the wearing of the flag shirts...What pisses me off about this whole ordeal is that these kids were just showing their pride in their country, the United States of America, but some piece of shit, most likely uber liberal lefty school official saw it as offensive towards mexicans. You know what I say? They are in the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, so if they take offense to people showing their American pride in America, they can kindly gtfo.

Since people discussed the whole flag issue, it is also something that bothers me...if it is not cased or folded properly and stored, then it is either A) On a flagpole B) On a guidon C) On a casket D) On a regulation uniform...not on your back, on your doorstep, on the ground (ooohhh I HATE when it touches the ground), or anywhere else not listed above in A thru D.
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      05-12-2010, 12:44 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radix View Post
It's not technically illegal as the supreme court has decided that flag desecration is provided for by free speech. However, it is highly ignorant and disrespectful to wear the flag as if it were some sort of fashion accessory imo. The only thing that pisses me off more is those flag doormats. Having people walk on an image of the flag is just wrong. Don't get me wrong, I think these people largely have good intentions, but are completely ignorant as to how the flag should be treated.
Who gives a **** about the flag. Not even the President succumbs to the BS of praising the flag. The flag is there for people like you. and you are one of those.
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      05-12-2010, 12:45 AM   #18
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I've been following this story on the news and I don't get what the big deal is. If those kids were actually thinking of wear those shirts specifically to piss off Mexican-Americans then yes it was wrong. Other than that I don't see why others are mad. Hell you don't see Asians getting pissed off when they see others wear shirts with flags on them during Chinese New Year.
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      05-12-2010, 08:58 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ARMAN View Post
Who gives a **** about the flag. Not even the President succumbs to the BS of praising the flag. The flag is there for people like you. and you are one of those.
You mean people who see it as a symbol of the history and sacrifices of those who worked or gave their lives so you could have the right to be a complete douche without fear of retribution? Yeah I'm one of those people.
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      05-12-2010, 05:01 PM   #20
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To recap...

Quote:
Originally Posted by radix View Post
It's not technically illegal as the supreme court has decided that flag desecration is provided for by free speech. However, it is highly ignorant and disrespectful to wear the flag as if it were some sort of fashion accessory imo. The only thing that pisses me off more is those flag doormats. Having people walk on an image of the flag is just wrong. Don't get me wrong, I think these people largely have good intentions, but are completely ignorant as to how the flag should be treated.
Marine

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayKay335i View Post
image elided


Quote:
Originally Posted by lambtron View Post

[...]

Since people discussed the whole flag issue, it is also something that bothers me...if it is not cased or folded properly and stored, then it is either A) On a flagpole B) On a guidon C) On a casket D) On a regulation uniform...not on your back, on your doorstep, on the ground (ooohhh I HATE when it touches the ground), or anywhere else not listed above in A thru D.
Marine

Quote:
Originally Posted by ARMAN View Post
Who gives a **** about the flag. Not even the President succumbs to the BS of praising the flag. The flag is there for people like you. and you are one of those.
Your ID-10/T form is in the mail. The government requires that you fill it out as part of the census.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ragingclue View Post
You mean people who see it as a symbol of the history and sacrifices of those who worked or gave their lives so you could have the right to be a complete douche without fear of retribution? Yeah I'm one of those people.
Marine

There seems to be a pattern here.
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      05-12-2010, 09:19 PM   #21
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Though not the same, this reminded me of what happened at a high school in California back in 2006:

http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=35506


Quote:
A high school in Southern California punished a student for involvement in a protest in which a Mexican flag was flown above an upside-down U.S. flag.

The incident took place Monday at Montebello High School in Montebello, Calif., when students walked out of classes at area schools in protest of a proposed federal immigration bill, the Whittier Daily News reported.

The House has passed a bill to tighten border security, but President Bush broadly supports rival legislation being debated in the Senate that contains a guest-worker proposal.

The unnamed student was from El Rancho High School, about four miles east of Montebello.

El Rancho Unified School District officials gave no details because of legal and privacy issues, except to say the punishment was consistent with the California Education Code.

Montebello Unified School District Assistant Superintendent Robert G. Henke said officials "appreciate the diligence that the district has taken in identifying the student who allegedly committed the infraction with the flagpole incident."

The image of a flipped American flag beneath the banner of Mexico prompted outrage nationwide.

The protest began when about 1,000 students from the El Rancho and Whittier Union High school districts marched through the town of Pico Rivera to Montebello High.

At the Montebello school, students had boycotted classes in the previous week in protest of the legislation. The campus was on lockdown by the time the protest marchers arrived, the Daily News said.

Henke said that's when protesters raised the Mexican flag, turned the U.S. flag upside down and stole the California flag.

While police warn of $165 fines for any protesters, El Rancho officials have scheduled an after-school forum today where students will be "encouraged to air their concerns and opinions in a safe, structured, well-supervised environment."

The district officials said, "For the next several weeks, as the pending legislation works its way through Congress, the situation will be closely monitored by district personnel."

Faculty in the Montebello Unified and Whittier Union High school districts are being encouraged by officials to teach students positive ways of expressing their opinions.
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      05-12-2010, 09:52 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radix View Post
To recap...



Marine







Marine



Your ID-10/T form is in the mail. The government requires that you fill it out as part of the census.



Marine

There seems to be a pattern here.
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