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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Wheels and Tires Forum Sponsored by The Tire Rack > From RUNflat to NON runflat? who's done this and is it worth the trouble?



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      07-16-2010, 10:07 AM   #23
bimmernoob
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Going to non-rft sounds very tempting... especially with the Fix-A-Flat solution as the temporary solution, but I googled around and found the following article:

http://accuratecars.com/blog/2008/08...of-fix-a-flat/

Seems that there could be some potential negative side affects after using Fix-A-Flat... Any one have experience, or can comment?
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      07-16-2010, 10:36 AM   #24
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I did this a few years back and went with RE-10's now onto RE-11's.

I would say it's the best upgrade you can do to the car as it touches every aspect from the feel, ride quality, road noise, turn-in, cornering, braking, grip, and acceleration. Everything is improved.
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      07-16-2010, 10:39 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hookah66 View Post
You can fix a punctured regular tire with a plug kit provided it ain't a shear tear on the sidewall for 25 bucks or so at any tire shop; it does not require any dismounting either. So why wouldn't bmwAssist respond to your call for a repairable rft puncture? Even a regular AAA road assistance plan would cover for this type of events. On contrary, they will not respond to a call for rft cauz it is assumed that you can then drive to a repair shop beside a rft is non-repairable. That is essence of the crap of NHTSA in requiring OEM equipment to have rft's for vehicles that can't carry any spares as in the case of e93's ... is this a safety issue for the driver?
They SAY that rft are not repairable but that is assuming you have driven on an uniflated tire (sidewall) therefore compromising its integrity. Many shops will plug a hole and ther eis no reason they shouldnt if you havent travelled a long way on a flat.
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      07-16-2010, 10:52 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I335 View Post
Those who say "it's night & day" must have really sensitive butt-o-meters. The ride is noticeably better with the non-runflats, but it's not a night & day experience - at least not for me. Now that I think about it, it could be due to the tires that I chose which are the Goodyear F1 GS D3 19". I did notice that the ride is better with these, but as I said, not night and day. The Goodyears are great, but perhaps they're a bit on the hard side for non-runflats. Anyone know for sure? Would PS2's give a softer ride?
I switched from the Potenza RE 050 RFT's to Conti Extreme DW. It WAS night and day. I think you're right though that it will depend a lot on the tires you choose as replacements. Also..19's don't leave much room for sidewalls no matter what tire you have.
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      07-16-2010, 12:13 PM   #27
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I got my car with 14K miles on it -- the original B'stones had already bubbled and failed on two wheels, and been replaced, so the tires were mismatched. By 20K, the two original ones were worn out. That's worse performance than I used to get with Michelin MXXX3 or PS2 summer tires on my old M3!

I now have about 6500 miles on Michelin PS2 A/S+ with 18" sport package. They ride much better than the B'stone bricks did, handle every bit as well (better in bumpy corners, since the tires don't skip over the bumps) the tires are 2/3 the price, and will last twice as long. Plus I get some limited snow capability. I got the compact spare kit from Bavarian Auto, and I also have carried a 12v compressor for years, for slow leaks.

Highly recommend ditching the OEM pieces of crap.
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      07-16-2010, 12:31 PM   #28
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i switched to non runflat and saved 15% on tire prices
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      07-16-2010, 12:48 PM   #29
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I'm curious to feel how much better my 19s can feel with non RFT. One time I felt the rear tramline on the freeway. Otherwise, I am not burdened by them except that I cringe when I hit bumps because I don't want bubbles nor do I want the shock to transfer directly to my rim which is notorious for cracking (225m).

Being that I don't mind my Pirelli P-zero run flats, I'll probably replace them with the same tires when they are toast because I get my tires at Americas tire co. With a runflat, I can probably get to one within 20 miles of anywhere I might be and either get it patched if the sidewall is uncompromised, or have them straight up give me a new replacement after paying the $30 to renew the lifetime warranty. If I do replace with non rft, I'll go back to Michelin PS2s. I had a set of regular directional Pilot sports and they got so loud and tramlined when they got worn in...PS2s don't look as aggressive but they were such great tires.
I just don't want to be stranded or have BMW assistance tell me that they won't tow me because I put better tires on my car.
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      07-16-2010, 01:09 PM   #30
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My car will be making the switch later this afternoon from Bridgestone Potenza RFT to Michelin PS2's
225/35/19 front
265/30/19 back

I'll let you know how much better the ride is if at all.

Cheers!
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      07-16-2010, 01:30 PM   #31
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NOOOOOOO.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaker View Post
They SAY that rft are not repairable but that is assuming you have driven on an uniflated tire (sidewall) therefore compromising its integrity. Many shops will plug a hole and ther eis no reason they shouldnt if you havent travelled a long way on a flat.
Have you driven a FLAT rft??? I have...and you don't know it is flat..that is why they are called run flat tires....why do you think you got TPS on the wheels??? By the time you realize you got a flat you have already driven god knows how many miles. Unlike regular tire, on RFT's you don't have any feelings...it is the same lousy noise harsh ride whether it is inflated or deflated. Most of the tire shops will not touch a rft right now, much less repair with a plug they are worried about liability..they all hate it.
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Last edited by hookah66; 07-16-2010 at 01:40 PM.
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      07-16-2010, 01:32 PM   #32
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Just some things to consider:

Our car's suspension system was designed for runflat tires. Accordingly, switching to non-runflats may cause warranty issues.

If your car is leased, you will need to have runflats on your car at lease turn in.
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      07-16-2010, 01:36 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hookah66 View Post
Have you driven a flat RFT??? I have...and you don't know it is flat..why do you think you got TPS??? By the time you realize you got a flat you have already driven god knows how many miles. Unlike regular tire, on RFT's you don't have any feelings...it is the same lousy noise harsh ride whether it is inflated or deflated. Most of the tire shops will touch a rft right now..they all hate it.
Why are all your responses so hostile?

Quite simply, the majority of leaks are slow leaks. Either you come out in the AM and your TPMS is on or you're driving along and the TPMS lights up. In the first case the tire is certainly repairable. In the second instance, if your pressure is above 20lbs or so when you take it to the repairshop then your tire can be repaired.

Oh, and we're still waiting on the NHTSA cite from you that references the RFT requirement.
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      07-16-2010, 01:53 PM   #34
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sorry...

Quote:
Originally Posted by cb1111 View Post
Why are all your responses so hostile?

Quite simply, the majority of leaks are slow leaks. Either you come out in the AM and your TPMS is on or you're driving along and the TPMS lights up. In the first case the tire is certainly repairable. In the second instance, if your pressure is above 20lbs or so when you take it to the repairshop then your tire can be repaired.

Oh, and we're still waiting on the NHTSA cite from you that references the RFT requirement.
I did not mean to be insulting, I am just very emotional on this issue. I don't have a quote from NHTSA, but the manufacturer would not give me a set of non RFT's for the e93, but rather they agreed to swap with a different brand, i.e. from Potenza to Conties. Rather than perpetuate my agony, I just accepted the swap and ran away with it. However, they were emphatic that since e93 did not have room for any spares they are obligated to give me the RFT's but what I do afterward was my business. They also assured me that switching to a non RFT tires was a common practice and will not void warranty as to other aspects of car performance.
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      07-16-2010, 01:54 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmernoob View Post
Going to non-rft sounds very tempting... especially with the Fix-A-Flat solution as the temporary solution, but I googled around and found the following article:

http://accuratecars.com/blog/2008/08...of-fix-a-flat/

Seems that there could be some potential negative side affects after using Fix-A-Flat... Any one have experience, or can comment?
Fix-A-Flat can make quite a mess and damage the TPMS and the tire.
A much better solution is the Conti Comfort Kit. It is available from Tire Rack. It is a 12V compressor that can inject a sealant into the tire. The sealant will not damage the TPMS or the tire. BMW makes a similar product but in the sealant is not nearly as well integrated as it is with the Conti.



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      07-16-2010, 02:15 PM   #36
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I'm a bit confused...On the Tire Rack web site, here's what they say regarding use of the ContiComfortKit:
"This product's sealant may interfere with the tire pressure monitoring sensors on vehicles with direct TPMS, possibly leading to error prompts and incorrect pressure readings. Use of this product on direct TPMS vehicles could also result in damage to the tire pressure sensor inside the wheel. Please contact your sales specialist at Tire Rack for more information."

So my question is does BMW use a "Direct TPMS" system?
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      07-16-2010, 02:26 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nbkkvv5 View Post
I'm a bit confused...On the Tire Rack web site, here's what they say regarding use of the ContiComfortKit:
"This product's sealant may interfere with the tire pressure monitoring sensors on vehicles with direct TPMS, possibly leading to error prompts and incorrect pressure readings. Use of this product on direct TPMS vehicles could also result in damage to the tire pressure sensor inside the wheel. Please contact your sales specialist at Tire Rack for more information."

So my question is does BMW use a "Direct TPMS" system?
Yes, it does. I think that's a bit of CYA on Tire Rack's part, the key word here is "may"...although any fix-a-flat, slime, etc. kit requires that the tire be cleaned afterwards, and it's possible that's when the TPMS sensor might get damaged.

The Slime company, btw, says their product will not cause damage to TPMS sensors.

My take is there is at least a slight chance with any of these, but probably only slight.
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      07-16-2010, 02:27 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nbkkvv5 View Post
I'm a bit confused...On the Tire Rack web site, here's what they say regarding use of the ContiComfortKit:
"This product's sealant may interfere with the tire pressure monitoring sensors on vehicles with direct TPMS, possibly leading to error prompts and incorrect pressure readings. Use of this product on direct TPMS vehicles could also result in damage to the tire pressure sensor inside the wheel. Please contact your sales specialist at Tire Rack for more information."

So my question is does BMW use a "Direct TPMS" system?
This was my recent experience. I had a flat (I have non-rft). I inflated the tire with the Conti Kit and it did not hold air. I tried it again using the sealant. Still did not hold air. Called BMW assist and they sent a tow truck. They were supposed to tow me to the nearest dealer (BMW Manhattan) but instead I had him tow me to the tow companies garage which was about 4 blocks from BMW Manhattan. I purchased a new tire from them and had them install it. There was no issue with the TPMS. If you do go the non-RFT route I would recommend getting AAA or some other roadside assistance in addition to BMW assist. BMW assist will only tow you to the nearest dealer if you do not have a spare tire and you may not always be very close to a BMW dealer.

CA
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      07-16-2010, 02:29 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hookah66 View Post
I did not mean to be insulting, I am just very emotional on this issue. I don't have a quote from NHTSA, but the manufacturer would not give me a set of non RFT's for the e93, but rather they agreed to swap with a different brand, i.e. from Potenza to Conties. Rather than perpetuate my agony, I just accepted the swap and ran away with it. However, they were emphatic that since e93 did not have room for any spares they are obligated to give me the RFT's but what I do afterward was my business. They also assured me that switching to a non RFT tires was a common practice and will not void warranty as to other aspects of car performance.
Yet another bit of dealer mis-information.

BMW are the ones that are adamant about the use of RFTs. AFAIK, no NHTSA reg requires the use of RFTs.
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      07-16-2010, 02:32 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cb1111 View Post
Yet another bit of dealer mis-information.

BMW are the ones that are adamant about the use of RFTs. AFAIK, no NHTSA reg requires the use of RFTs.
There are a number of cars that do not have RFTs or a spare. The M3 being an example.

CA
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      07-16-2010, 02:36 PM   #41
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non-RFT's ride much better. I wouldn't make the switch without the spare kit from Tischer.
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      07-16-2010, 02:40 PM   #42
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even at 19inches, a regular tire > RFTS

it's a big difference.. people may even say the same in comparison to 20's. give it a shot
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      07-16-2010, 04:13 PM   #43
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When I first got this car with rft for my wife, I was totally upset that BMW didn't put a spare in and went the rft route.

I picked up a nail in rear-left tire about 2000 miles into the ownership of the car, on our way to a party some saturday night. I pulled out of the freeway into a gas station and noticed a huge screw inside the tire. oh well. I didn't have to wait for anyone or anything, or get my hands/clothes dirty trying to fix a tire. Being a motorcycle owner as well, trust me, fixing the puncture on a tire on the side of the road is no easy taks, and tire sealant, etc., are not all that they are cracked up to be... chances are, 9 out of 10 times they won't hold pressure and you will need to get towed. Never mind the mess they leave behind inside your tire/rims.

Anyhow, discussing this with my wife later, she said that she actually liked the idea that if she ever got a flat when driving the car, that she didn't have to pull over and wait for help/AAA/etc. This made me think about this whole approach for a while, and I now agree with her: I prefer her being able to drive with run-flat tires so she can just continue driving if/when a tire problem comes up; especially with my 4 year old daughter in the car, I wouldn't want them to be standing somewhere waiting for AAA or other towing/help services.

Just food for thought for those who have similar family concerns as I do.
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      07-16-2010, 06:10 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainaudio View Post
This was my recent experience. I had a flat (I have non-rft). I inflated the tire with the Conti Kit and it did not hold air. I tried it again using the sealant. Still did not hold air. Called BMW assist and they sent a tow truck. They were supposed to tow me to the nearest dealer (BMW Manhattan) but instead I had him tow me to the tow companies garage which was about 4 blocks from BMW Manhattan. I purchased a new tire from them and had them install it. There was no issue with the TPMS. If you do go the non-RFT route I would recommend getting AAA or some other roadside assistance in addition to BMW assist. BMW assist will only tow you to the nearest dealer if you do not have a spare tire and you may not always be very close to a BMW dealer.

CA
I've heard other stories about sealant not doing what they claim to do. I'm thinking the best way for me is to buy a regular alloy wheel (on special) from tire rack and be done with it. The loss of trunk space does not bother me (wife has suv) but I think the extra 50+ lbs in the trunk will slow me down a bit.
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