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      06-20-2011, 10:18 AM   #441
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turkeybaster115 View Post
Those of us who are actively racing and contributing data to this thread have been more than able to control coolant, and thus trans temps by simply lowering the concentration of coolant, and adding a water wetter.
I'm thinking of taking your advice and flushing the radiator, based on your earlier thread on the topic. I have 3 weeks till the next event so I'll squeeze that somewhere in there. Started doing some research on the evans coolant too but I'll pass, for this year at least.

A couple of odd codes popped up too recently, HPFP-related, they may be an indication of what was causing that engine malfunction in my recent runs but I'm not sure yet as they popped up after the event. We'll see if they return.
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      06-21-2011, 03:07 AM   #442
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I've been researching and see what ways there are to retrofit something in place of the OEM oil cooler that isn't in the range of $1k.

I have been thinking about buying an extra pair of OEM oil cooler lines, hacking the oil cooler side fittings off, and attaching fittings and lines onto them that can attach to a Setrab core. One of the more difficult things with these retrofits is attaching them to the OEM system, so I figure why not start with the OEM lines, and figure out the easiest way to attach a bigger core to it. Thoughts?
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      06-22-2011, 02:00 PM   #443
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I just read the entire thread in about 6hrs and I'm overwhelmed with information...have a hpde on the 16th of July so I'll let u know how I do with jb4 and stock oc
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      06-22-2011, 02:06 PM   #444
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sejzilla View Post
I just read the entire thread in about 6hrs and I'm overwhelmed with information...have a hpde on the 16th of July so I'll let u know how I do with jb4 and stock oc
Awesome. That's why we post. You will do fine. Is it your first trip to the track? If so the car should hold up. Generally novice drivers fair ok. If I seem distracted, I am typing this on my phone from the beach and a badass chick just arrived. Pics soon. Anyway. Good luck. I hope you have a good job. I am 1 yr in and down 7k.
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      06-22-2011, 02:13 PM   #445
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Originally Posted by UltraRacer13 View Post
Awesome. That's why we post. You will do fine. Is it your first trip to the track? If so the car should hold up. Generally novice drivers fair ok. If I seem distracted, I am typing this on my phone from the beach and a badass chick just arrived. Pics soon. Anyway. Good luck. I hope you have a good job. I am 1 yr in and down 7k.
First time, and very excited... I've spent 5k so far on dp, injendci, coilovers, brake upgrade, and tires with jb4 so yes I feel u
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      06-22-2011, 02:16 PM   #446
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I drive a mt btw
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      06-22-2011, 02:22 PM   #447
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Originally Posted by Sejzilla View Post
I drive a mt btw
Only way to go IMHO. Have fun! Keep an eye on your temps and report back to the thread!
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      06-23-2011, 12:59 PM   #448
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sejzilla View Post
I just read the entire thread in about 6hrs and I'm overwhelmed with information...have a hpde on the 16th of July so I'll let u know how I do with jb4 and stock oc
Big thumbs up for taking the time to read through the entire thread. I was just thinking the other day that it may have grown too big, and people may miss out on all the valuable info by not reading through it.

Congrats to your first time! You'll have a blast. As a first timer, the stock car will be more than you can handle, so considering all your nice mods, you won't have to worry too much.

Relax, have fun, and be sure to share your experience with us!
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      06-23-2011, 02:09 PM   #449
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Originally Posted by orionredwing View Post
Big thumbs up for taking the time to read through the entire thread. I was just thinking the other day that it may have grown too big, and people may miss out on all the valuable info by not reading through it.
Yeah, I've been thinking about that lately and I know the answer but need to find time first...

I think we (I...) need to edit the first post with links to the various solutions throughout the thread, from how to read your water temps, to track results, to boost discussions, to coolant solutions, to ultraracer being distracted by a badass chick (still waiting for pics...ahem).
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      06-24-2011, 12:44 PM   #450
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I caved...it's done. 1st post updated with this info. Now start pointing out all the incorrect info I provided

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Welcome to the limp mode party thread.
This thread was created by track enthusiasts to help existing and new track enthusiasts enjoy their e90/e91/e92/e93s at the track.



We've come a long way in identifying the majority of N54 issues that cause limp modes at the track. We're logging (for the first time ever AFAIK) actual water/oil and other data points on the e9x platform for stock and several aftermarket solutions, some of which seem very promising.

This thread has grown tremendously over the last year due to the overwhelmingly POSITIVE ATTITUDE of all posters, let's keep it this way please. We're all here to help each other make the most out of our track sessions.


A few answers to get you started:

Q: I would like to take my e90/e91/e92/e93 to the track for the first time. Do I need to worry about my car overheating?
A: No, not at this point. Go out there and have fun.

Q. What is this track that you speak of? What kind of events can I participate in?
A: References to the track on this thread are related to HPDE events (High Performance Driving Education) or Time Trials.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HPDE

A typical day consists of 4-6 20-30min sessions. BMW CCA is a good starting point.

http://bmwcca.org

Or go to http://motorsportsreg.com to see all the clubs offering HPDE events in your area.


Q. What if my car is an AT?
A: Don't let that stop you from enjoying your car at the track. Most people in this thread have AT cars. Most of us are weekend track warriors without dedicated track cars.
Is the AT ideal at the track? Heck, no.
Will an AT car see overheating problems before a similarly equipped MT car? You bet.
There are several workarounds to help you maximize your track time, keep reading.


Q. I've attended a few HPDE events and I'm now noticing power loss or I see an "Engine malfunction" error on the dash, what's going on?
A: Welcome to the limp mode party. The engine is going into protective mode and reducing power (limp mode) as you've pushed it across, or near, some of its built-in thresholds. This is what it looks like:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=383


Q. Ok, which threshold?
A: We've identified 4 major items so far that can induce limp modes specifically at the track:

1. Oil Temps
2. Coolant Temps
3. VANOS issues
4. Traction control

Q. How do I measure oil/water temps?
A: Oil: Look at your oil gauge. Temps above 270F will start causing power loss until eventually you see an engine malfunction error at or right before 300F.
Coolant: Use this hack to display water temps on your dash:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=135
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=147

Coolant limits:


Interesting post about measured temps:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=273


Q: What about VANOS and Traction control limp modes?
A: VANOS: Error codes will be logged indicating which solenoid is defective, use a Bavarian Technic (or other similar) tool to read your error codes
Traction: There's no confirmation yet on how to identify traction-control induced limp modes but here's an explanation as to why the occur:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=406
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=403


Q: What can I do to reduce or eliminate oil-related limp modes?
A: A lot of us run aftermarket Oil Coolers. Have a look at the OC column at the chart at the bottom of this FAQ to see how they're behaving at the track

Q: Can I run 2 different OCs in parallel?
A: Yes, you can, however we have no data logs for this configuration

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=421


Q: Can I build my own OC?
A: Yes, you can, however we have no data logs for this configuration

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...250+oil+cooler


Q: Any way to improve airflow to the OC?
A: Yes, by removing the brake duct on the passenger side

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=245



Q: What can I do to reduce or eliminate coolant-based limp modes?
A: You can get an aftermarket radiator (PWR, AR). Or you can replace your coolant with distilled water plus water wetter or Mocool or at least reduce the coolant ratio. Have a look at the coolant column of the chart at the bottom of this FAQ post to see what some of us are using.

Good advice here too:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=399

You can also remove the engine cover and cowl although we have no comparison data to determine if this helps.

One of the tuners introduced an alpha feature to drive the water pump at 100% at will, this will be tested in July for the first time:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=428



Q: Is there a DIY to change/replace/flush coolant on the N54?
A: Not that we're aware of without dropping the FMIC. Your local Indy shop should be able to handle this for you. BYOC (Bring Your Own Coolant)

Q: I'm logging my water temps and they're volatile from turns to straights, why is that?
A: Here's a theory on that:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=251


Q: Is there an inherent cooling issue with the N54?
A: It appears so, here's a good explanation of the cylinder 5/6 cooling issue:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=417


Q: Can I datalog while driving at an HPDE event?
A: Tuner software/hardware will let you datalog but not without lugging a laptop or a Cobb device around, which is a major safety issue at HPDEs. If you find a way to secure such a device in the car and have it tech inspected successfully, please tell us how you did it!

Q: Any other fluids that I need to worry about at the track?
A: Some recomendations here:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=131


Q: Why are you tracking Spec Miata times on your chart?
A: It's a good indication of how hard we drive our cars at the track. We debated the best method to do so for a while and ended up tracking Spec Miata times, where available. Trackpedia is a good source for this info. Combine that data with our success (or not) of running limp-mode free and our OC/Coolant configurations and bingo, you have a list of working solutions for the track. We welcome new track results, post them here and we'll update the chart.



Have fun at the track

Last edited by mid-corner fun; 06-26-2011 at 12:07 PM.
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      06-24-2011, 01:07 PM   #451
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The admins should break out this last post and sticky it.

Brilliant work.
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      06-24-2011, 01:13 PM   #452
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterM1 View Post
I caved...it's done. 1st post updated with this info. Now start pointing out all the incorrect info I provided
Let's start with your grammar. Lol. Really nice of you to do this.
I'm sure others will point out more important info. The only thing I would recommend is displaying the chart once at the bottom of the post. Coolant/Oil/Track FAQ should reference the one and only chart.

PS, Great timing too. I'm prepping for my next track event and this is a nice little review.
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      06-24-2011, 03:48 PM   #453
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[quote=PeterM1;9887926]I caved...it's done. 1st post updated with this info. Now start pointing out all the incorrect info I provided

Brilliant. Simply brilliant. Great effort. Can't thank you enough.

This is a perfect example of the power of the forum.

PeterM1 ROCKS!!!
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      06-24-2011, 07:44 PM   #454
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterM1 View Post
This is a perfect example of the power of the forum.

PeterM1 ROCKS!!!
+100000

Users put this together with little, if any, help from the tuners and performance parts people. You can finally drive the @#$% out of your E9#, AT or MT, and have a great understanding of what to expect, watch for and what might be going on.

Big applause to PeterM1

An Adue

Now that I finally found great solutions for tracking my 335 AT it is now officially retired from track duty. Alas, marriage, driving too hard and wanting a comfortable DD all contributed to the decision. I am now on to an E36 M3 which will be a dedicated track car and eventually a race-prepped car.

My 335 allowed me to discover HPDEs and high performance driving and in turn meet so many great people. Even with all the trouble and frustration it provided I was able to cut some honorable lap times and frustrate some very fast cars.

I never put a tune on my car but I wish I had just for the last 3 track days I did where the cooling issues were finally resolved. I would have loved to have a go at sub 1:45 at Laguna and sub 1:55 at Infineon. It's fun to make people scratch their heads.

I think we're all in the same place with this car. It's the perfect balance of amazing performance, potential, luxury, frustration, durability, speed and fragility.

Drive the hell out of your 335 and I look forward to being passed by you guys when I'm in my M3.
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      06-24-2011, 11:06 PM   #455
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Great post Peter. Thanks!
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      06-24-2011, 11:47 PM   #456
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Awesome, thanks for putting that together.
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      06-25-2011, 09:14 PM   #457
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You guys are awesome. Sticky this for sure!

Going to the track next week fir the first time with my 335. I Will definitely post back my oil and coolant temps.
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      06-25-2011, 10:24 PM   #458
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I thought this thread was gone but it was stickied where it should be. Congrats on the good work.
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      06-26-2011, 12:08 PM   #459
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsbj View Post
Let's start with your grammar. Lol. Really nice of you to do this.
I'm sure others will point out more important info. The only thing I would recommend is displaying the chart once at the bottom of the post. Coolant/Oil/Track FAQ should reference the one and only chart.

PS, Great timing too. I'm prepping for my next track event and this is a nice little review.
done!

thanks everyone for the good words, I do accept tire and pad donations, they don't have to be new
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      06-26-2011, 12:12 PM   #460
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbass524 View Post

I am now on to an E36 M3 which will be a dedicated track car and eventually a race-prepped car.
Excellent choice, congrats!
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      06-26-2011, 12:15 PM   #461
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stangorang View Post
I thought this thread was gone but it was stickied where it should be. Congrats on the good work.
No kidding, I thought it was gone too.

Let's get some more data added people. I'm going back to the track with a CAI instead of a DCI in a few weeks to see if it'll make a difference. I wish I could datalog IATs at the track...If I run out of time I'll try the stock inbox w/a filter instead.

Related to an earlier post about trackmaster: Checkout Chasecam's Dashware, I just started using it and it makes trackmaster's data acquisition integration with your video a breeze!

Last edited by mid-corner fun; 06-26-2011 at 12:21 PM.
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      06-27-2011, 11:11 AM   #462
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterM1 View Post
Q: Can I run 2 different OCs in parallel?
A: Yes, you can, however we have no data logs for this configuration
Just a small note on this: Since a few weeks, I'm running (i) the AR Design oil cooler (sitting in front of the water radiator) and (ii) an upgraded VK Motorwerks oil cooler with a Setrab core as replacement of the stock oil cooler.

I have two track events scheduled in the next months, the first being on the 18th of July on the Nürburgring. As my car's having issues right now (probably injectors...), I hope it'll be fixed until then so that I can do some datalogging.

What I can already say is that when driving very fast - i.e. upwards of 250 km/h - the oil temperature barely goes beyond 120 degrees Celsius, where before (i.e. with only the AR Design oil cooler plus the stock oil cooler) it rose quickly to 130 degrees and beyond.

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