E90Post
 


TireRack
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Suspension | Brakes | Chassis > E9x rear end feels 'floaty'



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      08-31-2010, 09:26 PM   #45
Gen_E92
Brigadier General
 
Drives: slow
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Vancouver

Posts: 3,386
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2007 335i  [3.90]
Quote:
Originally Posted by badass335 View Post
This was one of them.

Dear badass335,

Gen_E92 has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to entitled - E9x rear end feels 'floaty' - in the Suspension | Brakes | Chassis forum of BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum.

This thread is located at:
http://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...8&goto=newpost

Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************
let me know how long Nixon takes to install these!
***************


There may also be other replies, but you will not receive any more notifications until you visit the forum again.

All the best,
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum
I think i just deleted that post myself

anyways, how did it go?

I might just rent the tool from Harold in the future and get my friend to do it for me though.
Gen_E92 is offline   Japan
0
Reply With Quote
      08-31-2010, 09:27 PM   #46
badass335
Lieutenant Colonel
 
badass335's Avatar
 
Drives: 2007 335i E90 AT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Surrey, BC

Posts: 1,809
iTrader: (10)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gen_E92 View Post
I think i just deleted that post myself
DAMN YOU!!!

i'm thinking, why the hell would that vanish....
badass335 is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      08-31-2010, 09:32 PM   #47
Gen_E92
Brigadier General
 
Drives: slow
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Vancouver

Posts: 3,386
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2007 335i  [3.90]
Quote:
Originally Posted by badass335 View Post
DAMN YOU!!!

i'm thinking, why the hell would that vanish....
you made my day bro jk jk
Gen_E92 is offline   Japan
0
Reply With Quote
      08-31-2010, 10:53 PM   #48
dzenno
Banned
 
Drives:
Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 5,883
iTrader: (1)

badass, did you get those installed? how does the car feel now? I'm about to put an order for these from tischer
dzenno is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      08-31-2010, 11:14 PM   #49
badass335
Lieutenant Colonel
 
badass335's Avatar
 
Drives: 2007 335i E90 AT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Surrey, BC

Posts: 1,809
iTrader: (10)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dzenno View Post
badass, did you get those installed? how does the car feel now? I'm about to put an order for these from tischer
Actually car is in shop right now. They couldn't finish it today so I'll pick it up tomorrow. I didn't want them to rush it so told them to keep the car an extra day. I'll let you guys know tomorrow. I'll probably create a new topic with my build as I did most things in stages even though it overlapped and cost me more in the long run! I wanted the know what everything did and felt like as individual components.
badass335 is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      09-01-2010, 05:24 AM   #50
GaryS
Colonel
 
Drives: 2009 135i 6MT
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Maryland

Posts: 2,089
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 135i  [3.25]
^^ Your first reaction will be OMG is this too extreme? Then, wow all that slop and bouncing around was just the subframe bushings. Then, this is really perfect.
GaryS is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-01-2010, 05:26 AM   #51
badass335
Lieutenant Colonel
 
badass335's Avatar
 
Drives: 2007 335i E90 AT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Surrey, BC

Posts: 1,809
iTrader: (10)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryS View Post
^^ Your first reaction will be OMG is this too extreme? Then, wow all that slop and bouncing around was just the subframe bushings. Then, this is really perfect.
Thanks bro! At this point, nothing is too extreme for me! I just want the bloody thing planted. My brother just bought a 911 RUF Turbo and now that machine is extreme!
badass335 is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      09-01-2010, 07:42 PM   #52
badass335
Lieutenant Colonel
 
badass335's Avatar
 
Drives: 2007 335i E90 AT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Surrey, BC

Posts: 1,809
iTrader: (10)

So got the car back today and first impressions. Overall, very nice and tight. The 'cushy' feel is definitely gone. I haven't had the Velocity Toe Arm installed yet either. So far, its the LSD, then M3 Bushings/ M3 Lower Control Arm. I do feel the road a bit more. It's more pronounced for sure but nothing that's going to kill me. I'm running 400/800 Swift springs and Ohlins so even with this, it's not harsh at all. I'll have more feedback later tonight when i get to really play with it as it's hard to really gauge things in stop and go bumper to bumper traffic.
badass335 is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      09-01-2010, 08:44 PM   #53
Flyer
Captain
 
Drives: 2011 e92xi
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Richmond, VA

Posts: 747
iTrader: (8)

Great thread! Keep us posted!!!
Flyer is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-01-2010, 11:24 PM   #54
dzenno
Banned
 
Drives:
Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 5,883
iTrader: (1)

what do toe and lower control arms do exactly on this car? in what situations would you feel them helping control the car's handling?
dzenno is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      09-01-2010, 11:50 PM   #55
badass335
Lieutenant Colonel
 
badass335's Avatar
 
Drives: 2007 335i E90 AT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Surrey, BC

Posts: 1,809
iTrader: (10)

I'll just add this quote from Alpina_B3. He's got a pretty good description of the all the parts and what they pretty much do!
Let me know if this makes sense to you. The lower control arm is No. 6 below. The Velocity Toe adjustability i may not need as i got 3/16 total with the lower control arm already but i just wanted it so got it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpina_B3_Lux View Post
17. M3 suspension parts & Quaife limited slip differential

This is part of my extended review thread that you can find in its entirety here: 335i E90 LCI - Experiences and review of various modifications (long!) but that I reposted here in order to make this part easier to find. I have posted it in both the drivetrain and suspension sections as the two modifications reviewed fall into both categories but were done at the same time, therefore difficult to dissociate.


Why?
If you want your car to drive faster than it can do in stock form, increasing the power output of the engine is only one part of the equation. If driving faster in a straight line on motorways is your only goal, then this might be enough; however, if your objective is also to be faster around corners, bends or even on a racetrack, then an improved suspension and better traction is a no-brainer.

Let me start by saying that the stock suspension of my car (it's a 335i without M sport suspension) is actually quite good, once you ditch the awful runflat tires and upgrade to Michelin Pilot Sport 2 as I've done (see previous posts). But still, it's a suspension the main objective of which is to make the 335i a fast luxury sedan, and not necessarily to be on the sporty side - pursuant to BMW, that's what the M3 is for. For me, the stock suspension of the 335i has a bit too much body roll in corners, it does not react as fast and precise to steering input as an M3 and does not provide a very good feedback from the road to the driver. You can still drive it quite fast, but you have to sort of guess where its limits are or what you have to do in order to go where you want; I wanted to improve this.

Also, once you increase the engine power and, in particular, the torque, you are faced with another problem: traction! I experienced that, after having flashed my car with the Evotech flash, it got increasingly difficult to transfer the power on the road, the tires spun too easily and much of the desired forward momentum went up in black smoke, decreasing the life span of the tires. This was even more true in corners or in the wet - unless the road is dry, there's wheelspin sometimes even in fourth gear, and even when dry, powering out of bends is near impossible in second or third gear.

Why is that, you may say, doesn't the 335i come with a differential? Well, BMW has labeled a function of its DSC "electronic differential", but that is quite a misnomer: All it does is brake the rear tire that has lost traction, thus decreasing the life span of your rear brake pads but not helping with forward momentum. The 335i unfortunately is not equipped with a limited slip differential as all M models are, for marketing reasons in order to differentiate it from the M3. As a consequence, it has an open differential which means that the power of the engine is always directed to the wheel with the least resistance. In corners, that means obviously the inner wheel as the weight of the car is transferred to the outside - and if you apply full throttle now, the inner wheel starts to lose traction and spin, the DSC cutting in to prevent this, and you get sort of a hickup-driving-style. That's not fun! You can't determine the curve radius with your throttle, you can't drift, and most of all you can't properly apply the power of the mighty N54 to the road. I experienced that on numerous occasions during my trip to the famous Nürburgring in August 2009 and by driving through mountain passes in the Italian Alps, and this led me to the conclusion that a limited slip differential (LSD) was definitely needed here.

What does it do? An LSD senses that a wheel loses traction and transfers the torque to the wheel with more traction. In the example above, if you corner with an LSD, it will automatically transfer the engine power to the outer wheel which is under load and therefore has more traction, enabling the car to apply more power to the road. Such differentials are also called "torsen" (torque sensing) or "automatic torque biasing" (ATB) differentials. They can lock up the normally open differential until 80% (a complete lock would be too dangerous) to enable the torque transfer from one wheel to the other. The effect is typically progressive, making it easy to drive.

How?
A) Limited slip differential:
There are several limited slip differentials available for the 335i - e.g. from Drexler Motorsport, Quaife Engineering or Wavetrac. Drexler is a "plate type" LSD that uses clutch plates to do the torque vectoring, whereas Quaife relies on gears for their operation. The advantage of the latter technology is that, as there are no clutches that are used, such LSD are almost maintenance free, "fit-and-forget" solutions. For me that was the decisive factor, as I did not really see fundamental advantages of a clutch type LSD (except in motorsport which was irrelevant for me). So then, Quaife or Wavetrac? There's a lot of discussion going on on this forum about the advantages of one over the other. Wavetrac is supposed to work even if one wheel is completely off the ground - but that seemed a rather irrealistic scenario for my driving style, so that argument was of no concern for me. On the other hand, Quaife had a long-standing track record (decades, really) and first rate reputation, in particular for BMWs, and I knew several forum members personally who had it installed in their cars. Furthermore, Wavetrac didn't have an option for a welded differential like mine (I later learned that there may be a workaround, but I wasn't interested in a solution that wasn't perfectly established), so the choice was easy in the end - Quaife.

Now, where to obtain it? If I was living in the US, I would have gone through HP Autowerks as I had already dealed with Harold in the past and was quite satisfied with his services. Being in Europe, however, I was recommended Birds in the UK as they are the European distributor of all Quaife differentials and have unmatched experience in this sector. As I wanted to have other modifications done at the same occasion and wanted to benefit from their experience with BMWs, I combined the installation of the differential with a nice trip to London where I hadn't been for a long time - killing two birds with one stone! You can look up their prices here on their website - due to my welded differential I needed a final drive unit which cost me (installation included) around 1800 EUR. I also thought about obtaining an LSD with a shorter gear ratio which is available as an option (for quicker acceleration), but in the end I thought that it was unnecessary as I'm not into 1/4-mile-racing and wanted to retain a high top speed (unlimited Autobahn! ).

So, last February I took the ferry over the Channel and drove on to Birds whose shop is located in London, not far from the Heathrow airport. They're really nice guys, and I got shown around their shop where several cars were in surgery, the most impressive being a conversion of a Z8 from left- to right-hand drive (wow! ). I was also shown what the LSD looked like and where under the car it would be installed (as I don't really have on-hand mechanical knowledge). - The installation itself was routine for them, and the new LSD went in without any problem.

B) Suspension:
The decision on how to upgrade the suspension was on several levels more complex. Springs? Dampers? Sway bars? Coilovers? Which type of each? I had test driven the Bilstein B16 Ride Control coilover on a similar car to my own last summer in South Africa (thanks to my friend Charles! here's his review) and experienced it as a passenger on Tony's car (see his review under this link), and had been very favorably impressed with this coilover. However, it also was rather expensive (2000 EUR without install), and together with the LSD that was slightly out of my budget at that time.

In the meantime, however, I had discovered that it is possible to transfer a certain number of components of the M3 suspension onto our cars, thus integrating parts of the superior handling characteristics of the M3 onto the 335i. In particular, this link about various M3 components as well as this review had been quite helpful and instructive in this matter. These parts were somewhat less expensive overall and could also be combined with different springs, dampers or the Bilstein B16 coilover at a later date. Also, none of these upgrades (except the sway bars) exist as aftermarket items, making them even more desirable and indispensable if one is really serious about increasing the handling capacity of the 335i. Another plus is that as they are OEM items, so almost no one will be able to tell that they're not stock - something which is rather important to me as my car needs to go through the TÜV inspection at some point in time.

It was mentioned by those who already had these pieces installed that while mounting the LSD, it makes sense to install other parts for the rear axle at the same time, in order to avoid duplicate work later on. It seemed therefore obvious to me that I should have at least all rear axle items installed (rear subframe bushings, rear sway bar, rear guide rods, rear upper links); but (yeah, the mod bug got to me…) in the end I just thought "why not do all the rest too if the car is on the jack anyway?" and added the front axle items as well (sway bar, tension rod, lower wishbone). However, I left out those that needed different dampers (rear lower camber links), as I wanted to change them at a later stage (see above).

I somewhat hesitated as far as the sway bars were concerned, as Birds recommended the Hartge sway bars instead of the M3 ones, the reason being that the M3 ones still induce some understeer while the Hartge ones are stiffer and provide a tendency for mild oversteer. However, I had driven an M3 and found it very well balanced, and a more or less neutral steering appealed to me as I do not want to pretend to have sufficient driving skill to counter any sudden movements from the rear end. Also, the Hartge sway bars seemed excessively expensive to me (around 730 EUR = almost 1000 USD), and I really had to set a limit somewhere.

I obtained all items except the sway bars from HP Autowerks, as I could then be sure not to miss any vital part. However, I have in the meantime tried to put together a list of all parts and part numbers that were used, as a means of reference. Here it is, along with some explanations for each part (some borrowed from the HP website) - no guarantee is given, of course, and these are the parts for an E90/E92 (most words in brackets are the German words for each part):

1. Front anti-roll bar / sway bar (Stabilisator vorne)
Diagram see here)
31352283515 (Stabilisator vorne)
31352283516 (Gummilager Stabilisator Unterteil, 2x)
31352283517 (Gummilager Stabilisator Oberteil, 2x)
31352283037 (Haltebügel Stabilisator, 2x)
31352283441 (Pendelstütze vorne links)
31352283442 (Pendelstütze vorne rechts)
07119904295 (Bundmutter selbstsichernd, 4x)
33326768884 (Sechskantbundmutter, 4x)
That's what it looks like:


2. Rear anti-roll bar / sway bar (Stabilisator hinten)
As delivered the E9x 3 series has excessive under steer and limited roll control. The M3 rear sway bar increases rear roll stiffness by reducing mass transfer forces in corners. That should give the car crisp, quick turn-in response and reduce understeer, making the car feel more planted. M3 anti bars give the driver the ability to rotate the car on corner entry and steer with the throttle when necessary. It also makes the suspension (front or rear) stiffer, which will reduce the grip.
Diagram see here)
33552283655 (Stabilisator hinten)
33552283709 (Gummilager Stabilisator Unterteil)
33552283710 (Gummilager Stabilisator Oberteil)
33552283714 (Haltebügel Stabilisator, 2x)
33556764428 (Pendelstütze, 2x)
07119906077 (Zylinderschraube, 4x)
07119903931 (Sechskantschraube mit Scheibe, 2x)
33326768884 (Sechskantbundmutter, 2x)
That's what it looks like:


3. Tension strut / rod (front) left+right (Zugstrebe Vorderachsträger)
31102283575 (left)
31102283576 (right)
That's what they look like:


4. Lower wishbone / control arms (Querlenker Vorderachsträger)
These add 0.75 degrees of camber, an alignment of the suspension after the install is therefore mandatory. A different xenon light regulation rod is needed (provided in the HP kit).
31102283577 (left)
31102283578 (right)
37142283867 (xenon regulation rod)
That's what they look like:


5. Rear subframe bushings (Gummilager Hinterachsträger)
The soft stock rear subframe bushings are replaced with stiffer, high performance bushings for a more predictable handling and more control.
33312283382 (front, 2x)
33312283383 (rear, 2x)
That's what they look like:


6. Rear guide rods (Führungslenker Hinterachsträger)
Original guide rods were made to deflect under load, a bad thing for good handling and traction. The M3 guide rods are made of all aluminum, a lightweight component thereby reducing wear and tear on other, more critical parts (rear subframe, control arm bushings etc). Each guide rod weighs just over 1.5 lbs making for a total of ~3 lbs for both parts (stock guide rods weigh 2.1 lbs each). Bushing deflection with a rubber material at one end is replaced by a sealed joint for deflection and noise free operation. Bushing deflection is unwanted because it leads to excess suspension movement. This is bad for handling and traction due to constant camber and toe changes. Plus, any power from the engine can take longer to get to the ground because it has to windup the bushing first.
Diagram see here)
33322283547 (left)
33322283548 (right)
That's what they look like:


7. Rear upper links / wishbones (Querlenker Hinterachsträger)
Original upper links were made to deflect under load, a bad thing for good handling and traction. The M3 links are made of all aluminum, a lightweight component thereby reducing wear and tear on other, more critical parts (rear subframe, control arm bushings, etc). Each link weighs just over 1.7 lbs making for a total of ~3.4 lbs for both parts (stock guide link weigh 2.5 lbs each or 5 lbs for both). A weight savings of over 1.5 lbs from the rear suspension.
33322283545 (left)
33322283546 (right)
That's what they look like:


Here's also a photo of all parts before the install:

The installation procedure of most items was (pursuant to Birds) very straightforward, in particular the tension rods, control arms, rear guide rods and rear upper links were really easy to do - take out the stock part, put in the M3 part, basically plug&play. The rear subframe bushings are a bit harder to do, apparently some force is needed to squeeze them in. Due to the LSD that was being installed, the exhaust had to be lowered anyway, so that access to the bushings was provided for. An alignment was done afterwards (this is a must due to the different camber induced by the lower wishbones in the front!), but no complete KDS (there was not sufficient time).

Here are some photos of the installation so you see where at least part of the pieces ended up:







Comparison of stock and M3 subframe bushings:


Unfortunately, it proved somewhat difficult to install the sway bars: Pursuant to Birds, the M3 sway bars did not fit into the OEM endlinks, and the bushings for the sway bars that I provided supposedly did not fit either. For the rear sway bar, Birds therefore fabricated custom bushings by re-machining the OEM bushings; but they gave up on the front sway bar. Now, as several here on this forum have confirmed, everything does fit, even though it's a tight affair and you may have to apply some force to get everything in place. Fortunately for me, my local shop in Germany where I have had all my other modifications done, Daum Motorsport, managed to get the front sway bar installed. I must admit that I was somewhat disappointed with Birds over this (also because they charged me extra for the re-machining which I assume would not have been necessary), but am nevertheless glad it worked out in the end.

Improvements?
A) Suspension:
Now, let's come to the part that certainly is of most interest to you - how does it drive now? I held off with my review for some time as the weather was really bad and I wanted to spend some time on a race track - the famous Nürburgring - with the modifications to evaluate the changes properly. Here are two photos from the two days during the Easter week-end that I spent there:





Even though the weather was not ideal, I was able to get almost 15 laps done (around 300 km), and have also driven an additional 3000km on normal roads. Immediately upon taking delivery of my car from Birds, the change was very noticeable. The car felt much more planted, body roll in corners was substantially decreased, and it was much more responsive to any steering input. Although even in stock form I didn't have any serious complaint with the steering response (in particular compared to some other cars I've driven in the meantime…), the car felt much sharper, more awake when going round corners, and any slight change in radius was immediately transferred to the road. Combined with the active steering I have, it is really much more fun to drive now! Going around the 'Ring, the decrease in body roll was also noticeable, the car also felt much more stable at high speed cornering (there are some bends on the 'Ring where you are faster than 150 km/h). In general, you have the feeling that you are more connected to the car and, through it, to the road than before. There is less of a "filter" that delays your input and the car's feedback. It now feels more like a sportscar than it did before.

B) Limited slip differential:
The LSD was the most cost-intensive modification I had done so far on my car, and I was therefore quite curious to see whether it was worth the expense. First of all, it's completely noiseless, I could never hear any sound whatsoever coming from the differential, under any circumstance and load condition. I attribute this to the excellent install done by Birds.

As to driving - while driving normally, you don't feel anything different. But as soon as you push the throttle harder, there's no blinking christmas tree in the dashboard, no power cut off through the electronics, just acceleration pushing you into the seats. Under dry conditions, with good tires and off the race track, it's much more difficult than before to get the tires to spin - in a straight line, that's basically only possible in first gear or in second but at very high revs. The biggest difference can be felt in corners: Whereas before traction control cut power and the car hobbled around, now it just zooms along and you can feel how the torque is transferred to the outer wheel. It practically grips the road and pulls the car along, and long bends or motorway ramps are much, much more fun now. That's as it should have been as a factory car, in my opinion. I also believe it's safer to drive, as the situations where suddenly and unpredictably the DSC cuts your power and you're left with a car that doesn't accelerate as it should will be much less frequent.

Of course, the LSD can't defeat physics - when it's wet and the road slippery, wheelspin can still be induced easily, but that's to be expected with a 400+hp rear wheel drive car. However, wheelspin and traction control intrusions happen to a considerably lesser extent. I was able to experience that on the Nürburgring as it was mostly wet there last time - without an LSD, it would have been close to undriveable, with it I could still go quite fast around the corners, as long as I avoided second gear and full throttle in third.

Problems / disadvantages?
For the LSD, the price tag is probably the first deterrent for most people, at least if they lease their car. If it's your own car, however, it's definitely worth it and I would not consider the price performance ratio to be bad. For installation I would recommend a shop with experience, and that can sometimes be slightly difficult to find; in Germany, for instance, Evotech distributes and also installs Quaife differentials.

As far as the M3 suspension components are concerned, ride comfort will be slightly (and I mean slightly) decreased. This is due to less cushioning in the front, so that you'll get more feedback from the road through the steering wheel; also, the stiffer rear subframe bushings (and upper links + wishbones) lead to a firmer rear suspension, road imperfections will be felt a bit more than before. It's not much, though, comparable to switching from 18 inch tires to 19 inch tires. - Lastly, I also noticed that (probably a consequence of the stiffer sway bars and the LSD) if the rear end slides out, it does so less gradually than before and you have to react quickly, even with DSC turned on - but that usually only happens if you drive like you should only drive on the track, and then you're supposed to know what you're doing.

As a summary, I can say I'm very, very pleased with these modifications and they have transformed the car in a lot of ways. They contribute to my driving pleasure each time I drive a bit faster on curvy roads, and I can sincerely recommend both to anyone who's remotely interested in making his car quicker and more nimble. Thanks also to Tone and Charles for their invaluable advice and help. - Now I'm looking forward to seeing how the Bilstein B16 Ride Control coilover which is just being installed will further change the driving characteristics of my car!

Alpina_B3_Lux
badass335 is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      09-02-2010, 01:04 PM   #56
bgboost
Private
 
bgboost's Avatar
 
Drives: bmw 335i convertible
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: bay area

Posts: 53
iTrader: (3)

badass335,

So are you pleased with the results of the bushings? Did it meet your expectations/hopes?

pros/cons?
__________________
E93 335i 6MT. 19" Miro 111, Eibach Pro-Kit/Koni FSD, Dinan Rear shock mount/bumpstops, BMS DCI, Procede V4.
bgboost is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-02-2010, 09:57 PM   #57
gt3fever
Major
 
Drives: F30
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Socal

Posts: 1,206
iTrader: (15)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgboost View Post
badass335,

So are you pleased with the results of the bushings? Did it meet your expectations/hopes?

pros/cons?
+1

waiting for the review
gt3fever is offline   No_Country
0
Reply With Quote
      09-03-2010, 03:27 AM   #58
badass335
Lieutenant Colonel
 
badass335's Avatar
 
Drives: 2007 335i E90 AT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Surrey, BC

Posts: 1,809
iTrader: (10)

Ok, so finally got to really play with the car! And...... 1 word sums it up, amazing! I let my bro drive it right after he got home from driving his 911 RUF Porsche Turbo and he actually was shocked at how well the car felt through twisties and rough roads!

So the actual feedback.

The left/right wallow is gone. I do feel the road a tad more but not stiff as people said it would though that may be due to the ohlins. Throttle response seems better and the grip is plain amazing now! Keep in mind, I had wavetrac LSD before the bushings and it didnt make a major difference to me. The wallowing wasn't letting the car hook up it seemed.

So this all started with me wanting a stable ride as the quality was going down fast with my kw v2 after my 2nd year. I figured if I changed the coilovers, it would fix it. Got ohlins and swift springs and the ride quality was there but stability wasn't! Higher speeds, the car felt unsafe! I'm thinking I just dropped $3000 plus install and I'm no better off! Changed tires from Eagle f1's to pirellis neros and then Michelin PS2's and still unsteady! I thought maybe an LSD would help as well. Threw in an LSD and no difference in stability at all!
After doing some research, figured I'd try the bushings as I'm a stage 3 setup with meth and after repeated hard launches, maybe I just wore them out! Got the m3 bushings and rear lower control arms. I still have my adjustable toe links that hasn't been installed! The car feels very planted now. Hard cornering at high speeds, hard braking through corners and throttling out and she sticks like glue!

It's not often you get compliments from porsche owners that they think this might be a more complient car for cornering!

Overall, very happy. Since I do have the toe links, will install them as well and might get the fronts retro fit with the m3 bits. It's not really a requirement as I'm not a track nut but it's more a novelity!

If you guys have specific questions, pm or post up and I'll try to answer as best I can!
badass335 is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      09-03-2010, 05:43 AM   #59
marcel b
Lieutenant Colonel
 
marcel b's Avatar
 
Drives: 1M Coupe
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Europe

Posts: 1,864
iTrader: (0)

sounds great! I have a similar experience with the bushings, they really make a difference! Thinking about adding the M3 parts as well to improve it even more.
marcel b is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-03-2010, 08:17 AM   #60
dzenno
Banned
 
Drives:
Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 5,883
iTrader: (1)

So you got m3 rear subframe bushings and rear control arms?
dzenno is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      09-03-2010, 10:20 AM   #61
techlogik
Major
 
Drives: 07 335i Coupe
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: FL

Posts: 1,339
iTrader: (1)

__________________
SOLD: 2007 E92 335i Space Gray. Loaded. 6AT | GIAC Stage 1 w/map switcher 330rwhp/332tq | CX Racing IC | Drop-in Filter | Eibach Pro/Koni Yellows | M6 Reps | Toyo Proxes IV Tires, 235/35/19F-265/30/19R
techlogik is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-03-2010, 12:19 PM   #62
badass335
Lieutenant Colonel
 
badass335's Avatar
 
Drives: 2007 335i E90 AT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Surrey, BC

Posts: 1,809
iTrader: (10)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dzenno View Post
So you got m3 rear subframe bushings and rear control arms?
Thats what i have new installed.

Installed in the rear end:
Wavetrak LSD
Swift Springs 800
Ohlin Road & Track
M3 bushings
M3 lower Control arm
Running on 275/30/19 Michelin PS2 (Tires make a difference too)

To be installed.
Velocity Adjustable Toe Links
M3 Upper control arm.
badass335 is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      09-20-2010, 10:18 PM   #63
swifty
Major
 
Drives: FO M3
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: canada

Posts: 1,260
iTrader: (5)

Hey,
I'm a newbie when it comes to suspension etc. I've been reading up on all the diff shocks/coilovers etc available for the e92 335i but haven't pulled the trigger yet as I love how the new 2011 suspension is comfortable etc (comin fm 2008 e92 335i). However, I wan't the car to handle better, esp on curves where I hit bumps cuz the 2001 shocks/dampers still feel skittish when you are goin a lil fast. Nway, I'm consider Ohlin Road & Track but i'm a lil confused as far as the bushings are concerned. Do I have to change them or is it only if you get the stiffer springs like swifts etc. What springs do the ohlins come with stock?

Thanks in advance.
swifty is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      09-20-2010, 10:51 PM   #64
badass335
Lieutenant Colonel
 
badass335's Avatar
 
Drives: 2007 335i E90 AT
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Surrey, BC

Posts: 1,809
iTrader: (10)

Quote:
Originally Posted by swifty View Post
Hey,
I'm a newbie when it comes to suspension etc. I've been reading up on all the diff shocks/coilovers etc available for the e92 335i but haven't pulled the trigger yet as I love how the new 2011 suspension is comfortable etc (comin fm 2008 e92 335i). However, I wan't the car to handle better, esp on curves where I hit bumps cuz the 2001 shocks/dampers still feel skittish when you are goin a lil fast. Nway, I'm consider Ohlin Road & Track but i'm a lil confused as far as the bushings are concerned. Do I have to change them or is it only if you get the stiffer springs like swifts etc. What springs do the ohlins come with stock?

Thanks in advance.
Ohlins Road and Track are complete coilovers so you do not have to get springs. They come with a set of springs already. I would say, get the coilovers first as you DO NOT need the bushings right away. If the car feels good, then mission accomplished. If it still feels skittish, then i'd look at the bushings.
badass335 is offline   Canada
0
Reply With Quote
      09-21-2010, 02:49 AM   #65
gt3fever
Major
 
Drives: F30
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Socal

Posts: 1,206
iTrader: (15)

thx for keeping us posted OP ! i was kinda skeptical on doing rear bushings, but after saw the review i decide to get them install. great thread !
gt3fever is offline   No_Country
0
Reply With Quote
      09-24-2010, 12:39 AM   #66
tibra1
Banned
 
Drives: 2011 ZCP M3 - 2007 335i crashd
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: NYC

Posts: 6,777
iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by badass335 View Post
Ok, so finally got to really play with the car! And...... 1 word sums it up, amazing! I let my bro drive it right after he got home from driving his 911 RUF Porsche Turbo and he actually was shocked at how well the car felt through twisties and rough roads!

So the actual feedback.

The left/right wallow is gone. I do feel the road a tad more but not stiff as people said it would though that may be due to the ohlins. Throttle response seems better and the grip is plain amazing now! Keep in mind, I had wavetrac LSD before the bushings and it didnt make a major difference to me. The wallowing wasn't letting the car hook up it seemed.

So this all started with me wanting a stable ride as the quality was going down fast with my kw v2 after my 2nd year. I figured if I changed the coilovers, it would fix it. Got ohlins and swift springs and the ride quality was there but stability wasn't! Higher speeds, the car felt unsafe! I'm thinking I just dropped $3000 plus install and I'm no better off! Changed tires from Eagle f1's to pirellis neros and then Michelin PS2's and still unsteady! I thought maybe an LSD would help as well. Threw in an LSD and no difference in stability at all!
After doing some research, figured I'd try the bushings as I'm a stage 3 setup with meth and after repeated hard launches, maybe I just wore them out! Got the m3 bushings and rear lower control arms. I still have my adjustable toe links that hasn't been installed! The car feels very planted now. Hard cornering at high speeds, hard braking through corners and throttling out and she sticks like glue!

It's not often you get compliments from porsche owners that they think this might be a more complient car for cornering!

Overall, very happy. Since I do have the toe links, will install them as well and might get the fronts retro fit with the m3 bits. It's not really a requirement as I'm not a track nut but it's more a novelity!

If you guys have specific questions, pm or post up and I'll try to answer as best I can!
So your not running the M3 suspension parts upfront?..I think that would make a huge difference..especially with all the other mods in the rear?

I have a 335i and am working with Harold..planning to do all the M3 suspension bits front and rear, M3 sways front and rear, rear subframe bushings, OS Giken LSD, and Swift/AST coilovers..Harold recommends the spring rates you are running 400/800, but i was thinking taking a step down to 350/700 only b/c I live in NY with crappy roads and the cars is gonna be primarly street driven.

Do you feel 400/800 to be a decent ride comfort wise..I dont mind a little stiffness but worried about how its gonna feel when hitting bumps/potholes?

Any feedback would be great..THX
tibra1 is offline   No_Country
0
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:16 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST