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      04-23-2012, 12:50 AM   #67
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It's way too loud for the calibration. I'm gonna try -25db with the sub hooked up and the gain set low tomorrow.
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      04-23-2012, 05:39 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmw325i
It's way too loud for the calibration. I'm gonna try -25db with the sub hooked up and the gain set low tomorrow.
Ok. Fwiw -20 is the recommendation from jbl for cslibration on ms-8 power so try snd level match the sub to that using the gains. You can always boost sub gain after if you need
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      04-23-2012, 03:18 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
IMO:

L7 speakers + center tweeter + MS-8 = 7/10

L7 speakers + center tweeter + MS-8 + 2ch amp for underseats = 8/10

10 = the best sound you can have in an e90

1 = BMW base audio system
So L7 speakers + center tweeter + MS-8 + 2ch amp for SWS 8" = ?/10

If I'm going to get a 2 channel amp, I'd want it to be able to power some SWS 8s so what is the ideal output? 300w at 2 ohm?
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      04-23-2012, 04:49 PM   #70
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Are you after bass?
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      04-24-2012, 08:08 AM   #71
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Originally Posted by taibanl View Post
Are you after bass?
Let's say I'm after full, rich sound with a preference on the low end. My other car has 1400w and a 10" sub in the trunk. I am not going for that here, my ears are asking for a break, but I do want sound quality with a bit more bass than I'm getting with the oe subs/mids.
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      04-24-2012, 12:02 PM   #72
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I would guess an 8.5 then.
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      04-26-2012, 10:04 PM   #73
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kaigoss69, great thread. I recently added an OEM Logic7 tweeter to my center (system is E92 LCI w/ Logic7) and it has done wonders for the front ... filled a gap in sound I didn't know existed and made vocals sound more lifelike.

I guess every mount for the tweeter is going to be ghetto. I made a "bridge" out of some plastic packaging; it spans the air vent opening (I slid it under the foam surround on either side of the opening), superglued it there, and superglued the tweeter on top of the bridge (w/ some electrical tape in between). Works great.

I'm content for the moment. I say that after every mod.

Really appreciate the thread!!!
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      04-27-2012, 07:01 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
I think I used -25 with good results.
Sorry, I checked my records and back then I got best results at -35dB. -20 is definitely way too loud with MS-8 power and OEM speakers.
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      04-27-2012, 07:26 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ421 View Post
kaigoss69, great thread. I recently added an OEM Logic7 tweeter to my center (system is E92 LCI w/ Logic7) and it has done wonders for the front ... filled a gap in sound I didn't know existed and made vocals sound more lifelike.

I guess every mount for the tweeter is going to be ghetto. I made a "bridge" out of some plastic packaging; it spans the air vent opening (I slid it under the foam surround on either side of the opening), superglued it there, and superglued the tweeter on top of the bridge (w/ some electrical tape in between). Works great.

I'm content for the moment. I say that after every mod.

Really appreciate the thread!!!
I'm glad you like it. It really is an easy fix. The problem with the OEM processing is that they chose a setting that is a compromise for all passengers in the car. So the sweet spot, so to speak, is in the center of the car where no one sits and when you listen from the driver seat, then the imaging is skewed towards the left side, near where the tweeter is located, whereas it should be more towards the center of the windshield.

It is funny how most people don't even know what imaging is until you point it out to them. So next time you are in the car, put in a good vocal track and find the spot where the voice is coming from. Like I said, it should be towards the center of the windshield, about half way between straight in front of you and the clown nose at the bottom of the mirror, about head high. The "spot" should be as small as possible and you should be able to look at it and "see" the singer's head as if it was there for real.

The OEM processing puts the image near the left tweeter pod, in the name of "fairness" to all passengers. Of course, we are alone in the car most of the time so what is the point? - My wife's Audi, which doesn't have the top of the line system, has a setting for "driver" and "front", and the driver setting does a really nice job at putting the image near the center of the windshield. But BMW did not feel this was necessary, I guess.

Since the center channel does not have a tweeter, and most of the "cues" for imaging come from frequencies produced by the tweeter, if you add one to the center the sound will be "pulled" towards the middle and the reflections off the glass will also help pull the image up a bit close to head high. So after you add the tweeter, the singer will be just about right in front of you, a few inches off the dash. That is a huge improvement and if you still want to move it over towards the middle a bit, you can use the balance and set it to +2 or +3. But that will also move ALL sounds towards the right side, compressing the stage, so don't overdo it.
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      04-27-2012, 07:48 AM   #76
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From what everyone keeps saying about this tweeter upgrade I think I am just about sold on doing it. I just gotta take the time to research the parts needed.
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      04-27-2012, 07:59 AM   #77
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Thanks for the detailed explanation. The vocals sound like they're coming from the dash now and it really is the missing link in an otherwise good-sounding system. I used to be into the custom headphone scene (head-fi, but I wasn't crazy I swear); imaging is a totally different game with speakers. I am still amazed such a little speaker makes the difference. I sense I am on a slippery slope ....

These are my settings Logic7 eq settings:
-3
-7
-8
-7
-3
+3
-3
Treb: +1
Bass: 0
Fade: +2 to rear

The logic being reduce frequencies instead of boosting them and reduce the amount of noise introduced, and just turn up the volume. The LCI "harman kardon" system doesn't have "music" or "concert hall" type settings and the eq starts at 80Hz. Sounds pretty good in my opinion.

In the future I'm considering adding bass. I don't want to shake the neighborhood, but do what the tweeter did - fill in a gap. System could use a bit of a punch down there.
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      04-27-2012, 07:10 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ421 View Post
Thanks for the detailed explanation. The vocals sound like they're coming from the dash now and it really is the missing link in an otherwise good-sounding system. I used to be into the custom headphone scene (head-fi, but I wasn't crazy I swear); imaging is a totally different game with speakers. I am still amazed such a little speaker makes the difference. I sense I am on a slippery slope ....

These are my settings Logic7 eq settings:
-3
-7
-8
-7
-3
+3
-3
Treb: +1
Bass: 0
Fade: +2 to rear

The logic being reduce frequencies instead of boosting them and reduce the amount of noise introduced, and just turn up the volume. The LCI "harman kardon" system doesn't have "music" or "concert hall" type settings and the eq starts at 80Hz. Sounds pretty good in my opinion.

In the future I'm considering adding bass. I don't want to shake the neighborhood, but do what the tweeter did - fill in a gap. System could use a bit of a punch down there.
Thanks for posting this. I replicated these settings with good results.
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      04-28-2012, 09:10 AM   #79
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Thanks for posting this. I replicated these settings with good results.
You are welcome - that's great to hear (literally ), I posted it a while ago in the sticky and didn't get any feedback. You might want to experiment with the settings a bit as you have an E90 and that's a slightly different environment. But the idea is the same.
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      04-28-2012, 01:32 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ421 View Post
You are welcome - that's great to hear (literally ), I posted it a while ago in the sticky and didn't get any feedback. You might want to experiment with the settings a bit as you have an E90 and that's a slightly different environment. But the idea is the same.
I won't pretend like I know anything about calibrating or tuning so I have a few questions. I like your settings better than the ones posted in the thread that I had been using because it's a fuller sound with more noticeable bass.

1) I have the sedan, what EQ adjustments would be from your coupe settings?

2)I do not have the center tweeter installed yet, do I need to then compensate on these adjustments to make up for the lack of additional tweeter?

Thanks.
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      04-28-2012, 02:22 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ421 View Post
You are welcome - that's great to hear (literally ), I posted it a while ago in the sticky and didn't get any feedback. You might want to experiment with the settings a bit as you have an E90 and that's a slightly different environment. But the idea is the same.
Wow thanks for posting that up. I can actually FEEL the underseat subs in my e90 now. I think these settings have convinced me to put off doing the sws8 upgrade. Can't wait to get a tweeter hooked up to my center channel.
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      04-28-2012, 02:51 PM   #82
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You're welcome. After listening to them for a few weeks, I unknowingly used my spare key fob (which I never used so it was stock stereo settings 100%) and I thought there was something majorly wrong with my sound system. These Logic7 systems need a lot of help out of the box.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kid Red View Post
I won't pretend like I know anything about calibrating or tuning so I have a few questions. I like your settings better than the ones posted in the thread that I had been using because it's a fuller sound with more noticeable bass.

1) I have the sedan, what EQ adjustments would be from your coupe settings?

2)I do not have the center tweeter installed yet, do I need to then compensate on these adjustments to make up for the lack of additional tweeter?

Thanks.
Glad you tried the settings.
1) I sourced this thread on bimmerfest; the OP has a sedan and the coupe settings aren't all that different (post #11 for coupe settings):
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=492794
I do like what the poster in #11 did with the top end. Experiment a bit with some music. I suggest keeping Logic 7 turned on. Start with the fade set to 0.
2) I didn't make any changes after installing the tweeter. The sound seems just right now.

Please post up your final results!
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      04-29-2012, 06:49 AM   #83
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So what's the consensus on the best way to mount the center tweeter in a non iDrive e90?
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      04-29-2012, 10:09 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fromkrypton View Post
Does part #65139217912 include the inline crossover, wires, and plug?
can someone confirm the part#? when looking it up on RealOEM...i see 3 different part numbers for HiFi tweeters.
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      04-29-2012, 10:35 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaigoss69 View Post
I think I used -25 with good results.
Sorry, I checked my records and back then I got best results at -35dB. -20 is definitely way too loud with MS-8 power and OEM speakers.
Uh... -20 is the setting andy used on ms-8 power...just sayin
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      04-29-2012, 10:36 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by import36
Quote:
Originally Posted by fromkrypton View Post
Does part #65139217912 include the inline crossover, wires, and plug?
can someone confirm the part#? when looking it up on RealOEM...i see 3 different part numbers for HiFi tweeters.
1) its a top hifi tweeter (hk/l7)
2) yes
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      04-29-2012, 05:59 PM   #87
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So what's the consensus on the best way to mount the center tweeter in a non iDrive e90?
So I used a bracket from my PC and some hot glue to attach it to the speaker mount. It worked almost great - the grill isn't quite flush with the dash anymore so I may need to redo the job. And of course, I managed to snap a clip thing when I was pulling out the tweeter from the rear deck but it seems no worse for the wear. I'll have to do some driving to see if I notice the difference.
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      04-29-2012, 10:24 PM   #88
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I finally got a good solution to installing the tweeter. I cut the top of a cat food can and shaped it like so:
Code:
 __          __
   |________|
This went front to back over the vent and got nice and wedged down on either end by the speaker harness. I put the tweeter in there with a little hot glue to hold it in place. Two questions:

1) Will I really not miss the tweeters in the back?
2) How badly with this affect my airflow/defrost?
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