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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > General E90 Sedan / E91 Wagon / E92 Coupe / E93 Cabrio > Rough idle



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      09-15-2016, 12:38 AM   #1
Mattwe90
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Rough idle

I recently bought a 2006 325i e90. 180,xxx Km.

Sometimes at a red light or when I simply turn the car on thr car rpm needle jumps up a hair and in doing so it shakes the car. Ive put the car in park and got out and you can hear the exhaust like its revving very very slightly while.
It will do it in reverse, park, drive and steptronic mode.

It doesnt do it all the time.

I brought it back and had a dealer mechanic take it for a drive and it did it slightly for him. He said 3 series are common for this and its just because of the higher km's on the car making the engine run rough. I dont really believe its just "suppose to be like that".. any ideas?

Absolutely no engine codes but recently got service light for oil change.

Also it seems to do it more once the car is warmed up or more so on a hot day.
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      09-15-2016, 03:16 AM   #2
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Go to Chevron and fill up with The best Gas the offer.
Also...
Do you have any maintenance history, like when were the coils and plugs changed last?
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      09-15-2016, 04:46 AM   #3
Mattwe90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkNemesis View Post
Go to Chevron and fill up with The best Gas the offer.
Also...
Do you have any maintenance history, like when were the coils and plugs changed last?
I live in canada and always use 91 octane, and even better 94 octane and made no difference. I dont have that information but it has a clean record including no accidents
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      09-15-2016, 10:52 AM   #4
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Most likely the ignition coils or spark plugs but your probably have a bad ignition coil or two
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      09-15-2016, 10:58 AM   #5
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Mine has done it in the past also. I replaced the coils and plugs a few months ago as well..........all Bosch, any other ideas? (sorry don't wanna hijack your thread but I've got the same thing happening.)
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      09-15-2016, 12:03 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cumberland_328xi
Mine has done it in the past also. I replaced the coils and plugs a few months ago as well..........all Bosch, any other ideas? (sorry don't wanna hijack your thread but I've got the same thing happening.)
If you replaced the coils and plugs with no result, them run two tanks in a row of 93 octane with 20 gallon formula of techtron.

If no go, then start with the Mass Air Flow sensor.

If that doesn't fix the rough idol, look for vacuum leaks via smoke test.

If no go, then your injectors are bad. That's a $1000-1200.00 ouch
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      09-16-2016, 01:53 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mweisdorfer View Post
If you replaced the coils and plugs with no result, them run two tanks in a row of 93 octane with 20 gallon formula of techtron.

If no go, then start with the Mass Air Flow sensor.

If that doesn't fix the rough idol, look for vacuum leaks via smoke test.

If no go, then your injectors are bad. That's a $1000-1200.00 ouch
Shouldnt i have codes or warning lights if its maf sensor or coil/plugs?

I dont think its my injectors. Im gonna test the coils tomorrow.

Last edited by Mattwe90; 09-16-2016 at 01:59 AM.
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      09-16-2016, 05:23 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mweisdorfer View Post
If you replaced the coils and plugs with no result, them run two tanks in a row of 93 octane with 20 gallon formula of techtron.

If no go, then start with the Mass Air Flow sensor.

If that doesn't fix the rough idol, look for vacuum leaks via smoke test.

If no go, then your injectors are bad. That's a $1000-1200.00 ouch
1+ 1+ 1+.....dead on.
Also.....chevron's best will clean your injectors.....it already has Techron.
That is the same stuff BMW dealers use.

I put 92 shell all the time, but twice a year I go through a tank of chevron with Techron highest octane.

Invest in a USB to OBDII cable.
Download program called BMWLOGGER.
Visit coding section to get it going on your laptop.
I would recommend a full adaptation reset once you chance your coils and plugs.
It is standard procedure at dealers.

Best of luck
PS Canadian here also.
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      09-22-2016, 06:36 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkNemesis View Post
1+ 1+ 1+.....dead on.
Also.....chevron's best will clean your injectors.....it already has Techron.
That is the same stuff BMW dealers use.

I put 92 shell all the time, but twice a year I go through a tank of chevron with Techron highest octane.

Invest in a USB to OBDII cable.
Download program called BMWLOGGER.
Visit coding section to get it going on your laptop.
I would recommend a full adaptation reset once you chance your coils and plugs.
It is standard procedure at dealers.

Best of luck
PS Canadian here also.

Im going for a replacement on the maf sensor to start cheap. Then move on to coils/plugs. Will update once I replace maf sensor.

My car idles slighty over 500. Around 550. The rpm needle does not move violently like in some videos ive seen on youtube. It just slightly moves but it doesnt do it all the time. Just sometimes when the car has warmed up and im sitting at a red light
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      09-22-2016, 07:07 AM   #10
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Subscribed!
I'm having slightly the same issue and will be doing on spark plugs + coils on Saturday morning, will update here and let you know what happens.

Mine is a EURO 2005/04 (2006 model) E90 330i N52 and has not had spark plugs done for 105.000KM. I have no receipts of coils ever being done.

When a mechanic tells you "That's what they all do, it's the mileage" get another mechanic is my experience :P

If I were you I'd first get a USB cable / OBDII reader to check any codes.
Otherwise start with plugs, then coils, then MAF?
Last resort is injectors indeed

Question... when you start the car in the morning cold, does it shake after a few seconds, because mine does

Last edited by Jai; 09-22-2016 at 07:20 AM.
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      09-22-2016, 08:24 AM   #11
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My 2007 does almost the same thing, except the idle will dip to about 500 rpm, rather than jump up. It's very quick and it shakes the car. Only does it when warmed up, and only in R, D or M/S. At first I thought it was low-grade gas the dealer put in the car (car is new to me) so I put in some Royal Purple fuel conditioner and filled up with Shell premium. I also cleaned the MAF for good measure. The car ran great for that tank, but now after a fill up, it's doing it again, though perhaps not as badly or frequently as before. Unknown service history, so I'm planning to do the plugs first. I also need to get an OBD2 tool.
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      09-22-2016, 09:02 AM   #12
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vautrain If it only does this on warmup I'd say it's probably MAF / O2? At least, it only uses MAF after the engine has warmed up, right? At least that's what happens on my 1994 MB E280 W124, not sure if that applies on the E90 too?
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      09-22-2016, 02:29 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jai View Post
vautrain If it only does this on warmup I'd say it's probably MAF / O2? At least, it only uses MAF after the engine has warmed up, right? At least that's what happens on my 1994 MB E280 W124, not sure if that applies on the E90 too?
I don't really know much about how the car uses the MAF sensor, I just know it measures air flow, and the car runs rich when it's not working. The car does seem to be sucking gas (about 12 MPG), but most of my driving is very local, stop and go, so I'm not sure that's unusual. There is no SES/CEL, and the car seems to have plenty of power, but obviously I haven't gone into the computer to see if there's a code.

If it is the MAF sensor, is that something fuel additive would normally (temporarily) clean up? Seems to me it would still cause an idle issue, but the car was idling perfectly with the Royal Purple in the tank. For that reason, I was leaning toward an ignition (plug or coil) or fuel delivery issue.
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      09-24-2016, 09:00 AM   #14
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Well I ordered a MAF sensor from Amazon. It's a cheapie aftermarket, so I'll probably return it either way, but if it fixes the issue, I'll get a good one from FCP.
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      09-24-2016, 09:20 AM   #15
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There are a lot of components that affect this condition. I replaced all injectors and still have a rough idle a couple times a week. If the O2 sensors have not been replaced, you are on borrowed time after 100k miles. I will be replacing the O2 sensors when I execute the oil pan gasket replacement. Cheers!
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      09-24-2016, 10:29 AM   #16
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I just don't understand how the car can be behaving this way without a SES light. Wouldn't a faulty MAF, O2, etc be throwing a visible SES?
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      09-24-2016, 04:01 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vautrain View Post
My 2007 does almost the same thing, except the idle will dip to about 500 rpm, rather than jump up.
....
I also cleaned the MAF for good measure. The car ran great for that tank, but now after a fill up, it's doing it again....
I suggest clean up the MAF and the MAF cable connector connections with a good contact cleaner spray, not just electrical cleaner.

That may be your issue, especially with bad mpg you mentioned in another post of yours.. What made it work good for that tank may not because you cleaned the MAF, but because you disconnected it and connected back and so reseated its electrical connections.

As to why no codes, if it is what I suspect it is, the connector is not making solid connection and intermittently connects and disconnects, this causes the engine to run rich. But computer compensates with "trimming" the fuel it is adding, up to a percentage. When the compensation required reaches a limit (it could be 20% negative trim, don't remember exact number) then it throws the code. And in my experience it the cause was bad connection, car throws this code only after a duration of high way speed driving. This may be another reason why you haven't gotten a code.

See my at below link on this in more detail: I had rich and then MAF value unexpected code though, but has been going on for months and getting worse and worse by time.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1304563

Your may not be this, but it is easy trial. For diagnostic trial, you don't have to replace the connector at first. Just get a contact cleaner spray and clean the connector connections through the holes of the connector and the MAF side. See if it helps.
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      09-24-2016, 08:22 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vautrain
I just don't understand how the car can be behaving this way without a SES light. Wouldn't a faulty MAF, O2, etc be throwing a visible SES?
It could. IMHO, It could be beginning to be faulty but still within the parameters of the DME.
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      09-26-2016, 03:37 AM   #19
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Tried to make a visual illistration of the issue
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Wg-Q22oFXk

Last edited by Mattwe90; 09-26-2016 at 03:47 AM.
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      09-26-2016, 12:11 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattwe90 View Post
Tried to make a visual illistration of the issue
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Wg-Q22oFXk
Yeah, that's pretty much what mine does, although it seems like the RPMs (needle) dip in a more pronounced manner on mine. I tried installing the new MAF this morning, but I think the car may have done it a couple of times on my way in to work.

I will say, this symptom happens MUCH less frequently now after I ran a bottle of the Royal Purple fuel system cleaner through it. I may run another bottle through and see what happens. But I also wonder if ambient temperature has something to do with it, it happened a lot when it was really hot out, then I ran the RP tank and it didn't do it at all, but now the weather is quite a bit cooler.
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      09-26-2016, 12:20 PM   #21
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So the cheapie MAF sensor I got from Amazon is interesting. What I ordered was a "Spectra Premium" brand, and that was the brand on the outside of the box, but what came in the box (and apparently new, unused) was a MAF sensor that had the Continental brand on it. I wondered if maybe Spectra Premium sells remanufactured products, but looking at their website, I don't think so. Plus, the thing looked totally unused, as in, never installed on a car.

I installed it and will see if the car behaves any differently, though as I noted in my previous reply, I think the idle dipped a couple of times this morning on my way to work. But not sure yet about MPG, I just reset the MPG/trip when I got to work.
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      09-26-2016, 04:42 PM   #22
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My car is doing the same thing and wasn't fixed with new spark plugs or injectors.
When I replace the engine oil pan gasket this upcoming weekend, I will replace the O2 sensors and the ignition coils. Once complete, I will notify everyone the results.
I really believe the problem resides with the O2 sensors due to my car being built exactly 10 years ago and at 110k miles.
Vautrain let us know the results of the MAF sensor.
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