E90Post
 


VIBE Motorsports
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > AUDIO/VIDEO + BLUETOOTH + Electronics/Alarm/Software > Notes on a 2007 E90 328i with HiFi (10-speakers/OEM amp) install



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      05-18-2011, 04:52 AM   #1
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 320i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 11,109
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Notes on a 2007 E90 328i with HiFi (10-speakers/OEM amp) install

Customer wanted a relatively budget system with full OEM integration, more focused front soundstage and a significant bass output increase.

Thus:

- JBL MS-8
- XD400/4
- DLS R4 component set (front)
- Vibe Slick 4" (center)
- VP Electricity trunk sub enclosure with ID10





Very quick notes:

- Custom MS-8 to HiFi OEM connector harness was created for full integration. Rear OEM speakers were retained. DLS R4 were installed in the front doors using the Dynamat method explained in this thread: http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=518402. Vibe Slick 4 was used as the center speaker: http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=477443

Result:

-Again, a relatively simple upgrade on the money that delivers a more satisfying, clearer, higher volume, bassy sound than any of the optional OEM systems. From radio stations to iPod the SQ increase is instantly noticiable. You know that the MS-8 is doing its job of focusing the front stage to the driver when customers start simply smiling and nodding their heads to the beat of the music, just after calibration.

VP Electricity sub enclosure impresses just by installing it above the battery even before connecting it to the amp. The integration is simply OEM... and then it is connected to the system. The ID10 sub bass is clean, heard and felt in the cabin without any rattles -or that nasty flappiness of some subs that take some work and tuning to make it right-, seemlessly blending with the underseat woofers midbass.

By dedicating the OEM woofers to just midbass above 60Hz and providing 5 times their OEM power their bass impact is to the level of a much, much nicer aftermarket shallow woofer. Definitely their 2ohms reting and their sensitivity (they also sound great with just the MS-8 power) make these woofers very power efficient and great midbass drivers.

The combination of the R4 and the Slick 4 in the front provides a much improved front stage over the OEM speakers. The OEM speakers actually sound much better when powered by the MS-8 -this is the best part of the upgrade, as customers are shown how the OEM speakers sound with the MS-8 first and then with the R4 replacing them. The improvement is a much nicer, cleaner and clearer sounding front stage with the R4, both in midbass and high response (the silk tweeters are nicer by much over the OEM). The Slick 4 does not disappoint as a center speaker for its price, however it sounds better when the front stage have the same load (4ohms center and front speakers) than with the OEM speakers (2ohms). The MS-8 power is double for the 2ohm loads and it can be felt thru the center speaker (lower volume, but can be adjusted).

And as always... a 100% reversible install.
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: Gone
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone

Last edited by Technic; 10-08-2011 at 07:21 AM.
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-18-2011, 11:40 AM   #2
emoon3
Private
 
emoon3's Avatar
 
Drives: 2013 328i
Join Date: May 2010
Location: NYC

Posts: 71
iTrader: (0)

T,

Is there enough room in the spot to the right of the JL amp to put a second amp you think?

It's a small one - a Vibe Audio Litebox.
emoon3 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-18-2011, 12:30 PM   #3
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 320i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 11,109
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by emoon3 View Post
T,

Is there enough room in the spot to the right of the JL amp to put a second amp you think?

It's a small one - a Vibe Audio Litebox.
I think that there is around 7" x 10" of usable space there.
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: Gone
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      05-18-2011, 11:00 PM   #4
emoon3
Private
 
emoon3's Avatar
 
Drives: 2013 328i
Join Date: May 2010
Location: NYC

Posts: 71
iTrader: (0)

Thanks. And nice work on the clean install (as usual.)
emoon3 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-02-2011, 02:40 AM   #5
JagoBmw10
Bavarian Enthusiast
 
JagoBmw10's Avatar
 
Drives: TiAg E90
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: San Diego

Posts: 126
iTrader: (0)

how much is that setup?
JagoBmw10 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-02-2011, 08:53 AM   #6
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 320i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 11,109
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by JagoBmw10 View Post
how much is that setup?
Around $1800 installed...
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: Gone
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-02-2011, 11:11 AM   #7
cdgatti
Major
 
cdgatti's Avatar
 
Drives: e90 328i
Join Date: May 2011
Location: KY

Posts: 1,457
iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Technic View Post
Around $1800 installed...
When you do one of these ms-8 plus external amp installs do you use the ms-8 volume control or the head units? Also anything special have to be done to set the amp gains with the ms-8 between it and the HU? Thanks.
cdgatti is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-02-2011, 01:18 PM   #8
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 320i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 11,109
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by cdgatti View Post
When you do one of these ms-8 plus external amp installs do you use the ms-8 volume control or the head units? Also anything special have to be done to set the amp gains with the ms-8 between it and the HU? Thanks.
I always use the OEM HU volume with the MS-8; I don't even keep the MS-8 display plugged in after finishing the setup.

Set the amp gains to about 2V and then do the MS-8 calibration -as suggested by JBL itself.
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: Gone
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-02-2011, 03:53 PM   #9
Steveo
Lieutenant
 
Steveo's Avatar
 
Drives: M4
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Scotland

Posts: 435
iTrader: (0)

Hmmm, would this setup work on an E60 M5 with hifi setup? (one below logic 7)
Steveo is offline   Scotland
0
Reply With Quote
      08-02-2011, 04:53 PM   #10
cdgatti
Major
 
cdgatti's Avatar
 
Drives: e90 328i
Join Date: May 2011
Location: KY

Posts: 1,457
iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Technic View Post
I always use the OEM HU volume with the MS-8; I don't even keep the MS-8 display plugged in after finishing the setup.

Set the amp gains to about 2V and then do the MS-8 calibration -as suggested by JBL itself.
That's good to hear, I don't want that ms-8 ugly controller visible. What do you mean by "Set the amp gains to about 2V" where would I measure that 2V and what would be adjusted to hit it?
cdgatti is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-02-2011, 05:23 PM   #11
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 320i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 11,109
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by cdgatti View Post
That's good to hear, I don't want that ms-8 ugly controller visible. What do you mean by "Set the amp gains to about 2V" where would I measure that 2V and what would be adjusted to hit it?
Look at your particular amp gain knob and you should see a voltage number printed on it. Turn the knob until you are at 2V. If there are no numbers in your amp then you will need to follow JL Audio method -www.jlaudio.com- to measure the 2V setting.
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: Gone
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-02-2011, 06:04 PM   #12
cdgatti
Major
 
cdgatti's Avatar
 
Drives: e90 328i
Join Date: May 2011
Location: KY

Posts: 1,457
iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Technic View Post
Look at your particular amp gain knob and you should see a voltage number printed on it. Turn the knob until you are at 2V. If there are no numbers in your amp then you will need to follow JL Audio method -www.jlaudio.com- to measure the 2V setting.
Not trying to be a pita... but the ms-8 instructions on calibrating with external amps is very poor. Is this correct?

1. set HU to 3/4 volume
2. set ms-8 volume to -6
3. play full frequency sine wave and in measure the output voltage of the speaker outs (with speakers disconnected)
4. My amp (jlxd600) says this should register 17.4V - according to JL method.

Are you saying that when this is achieved - the input sensitivity on the amp will be set at a setting where 2V input gives max power??
cdgatti is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-02-2011, 07:01 PM   #13
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 320i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 11,109
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by cdgatti View Post
Not trying to be a pita... but the ms-8 instructions on calibrating with external amps is very poor. Is this correct?

1. set HU to 3/4 volume
2. set ms-8 volume to -6
3. play full frequency sine wave and in measure the output voltage of the speaker outs (with speakers disconnected)
4. My amp (jlxd600) says this should register 17.4V - according to JL method.

Are you saying that when this is achieved - the input sensitivity on the amp will be set at a setting where 2V input gives max power??
The Jl Audio gain setting can be used either at the MS-8 calibration or after the calibration. The 2V input gain is what JBL suggest at calibration for the aftermarket amp connected to the MS-8.

You could leave the gains at minimum (4V for your XD600/6) or set the gain at the middle setting and calibrate that way. This is not an exact science or a must requirement. Just calibrate with whatever gain level you think will sound fine to you. You could set the gains after calibration as well.
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: Gone
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-02-2011, 07:03 PM   #14
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 320i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 11,109
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
Hmmm, would this setup work on an E60 M5 with hifi setup? (one below logic 7)
Yes, it will but the MS-8 will use the high level inputs of both your iDrive front and OEM amp woofer outputs instead of the low level inputs used in this particular 3-Series install.
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: Gone
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-03-2011, 02:37 AM   #15
Steveo
Lieutenant
 
Steveo's Avatar
 
Drives: M4
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Scotland

Posts: 435
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Technic View Post
Yes, it will but the MS-8 will use the high level inputs of both your iDrive front and OEM amp woofer outputs instead of the low level inputs used in this particular 3-Series install.
Could the CIC be coded to have low level outputs for all the speakers?
Steveo is offline   Scotland
0
Reply With Quote
      08-03-2011, 06:17 AM   #16
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 320i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 11,109
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
Could the CIC be coded to have low level outputs for all the speakers?
Yes, sure...
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: Gone
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-04-2011, 04:54 PM   #17
Steveo
Lieutenant
 
Steveo's Avatar
 
Drives: M4
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Scotland

Posts: 435
iTrader: (0)

Technic, would this sale lot fit in my E60?

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=563112
Steveo is offline   Scotland
0
Reply With Quote
      08-04-2011, 04:58 PM   #18
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2015 320i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 11,109
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steveo View Post
Technic, would this sale lot fit in my E60?

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=563112
Yes... great combo as well.
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: Gone
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-04-2011, 06:12 PM   #19
Steveo
Lieutenant
 
Steveo's Avatar
 
Drives: M4
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Scotland

Posts: 435
iTrader: (0)

Thanks
Steveo is offline   Scotland
0
Reply With Quote
      08-12-2011, 03:59 PM   #20
DavidZ
Second Lieutenant
 
DavidZ's Avatar
 
Drives: '11.5 E90 M3
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Maryland USA

Posts: 228
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Technic View Post
By dedicating the OEM woofers to just midbass above 60Hz and providing 5 times their OEM power their bass impact is to the level of a much, much nicer aftermarket shallow woofer. Definitely their 2ohms reting and their sensitivity (they also sound great with just the MS-8 power) make these woofers very power efficient and great midbass drivers.
Excellent work. I want the same bass setup (band-passed underseat woofers and low pass on a trunk sub) but am trying to figure out what kind of equipment to get to band-pass the underseat woofers. How did you configure this? I don't have an MS-8 but have read through the MS-8 online manual and the only ways I could think of configuring this is:

1) Treat the front door speakers plus underseat subs as the front channel and set them as 2-way speakers on the MS-8. Should then be able to set hi and low pass crossovers on the woofers and high pass on the fronts.

2) Or set the underseat subs and trunk sub as subs on the MS-8... since it only has 2 sub outs, use a "Y-cable" to hook up the underseat woofer amp channels and trunk sub amp channel, set the low pass crossover on the MS-8, then use the woofer amp's hi pass crossover to essentially band-pass the woofers, and set a low pass on the trunk sub amp.

Make sense?

Thanks
__________________
'11.5 M3 sedan | Jerez Black Metallic | 6MT | M Performance Exhaust | no DCT no EDC no NAV no nonsense
DavidZ is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      08-12-2011, 04:17 PM   #21
VP Electricity
Brigadier General
 
VP Electricity's Avatar
 
Drives: E91 XDrive
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: portland oregon

Posts: 3,177
iTrader: (3)

Approach 1 is correct (there's an MS-8 thread with this info).

The only time I'd use the amp xover with an MS-8 would be with tweeters. With underseat woofers and trunk woofers with different path lengths, you would confuse the heck out of the MS-8. The tweeters are not as sensitive to path lengths, and the MS-8 may not adjust them in time anyway - but in the E9x, the path lengths for the mid and tweeter are identical anyway.
VP Electricity is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      08-12-2011, 04:52 PM   #22
e90Luis
Private First Class
 
Drives: e92 335i
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Atlanta, GA

Posts: 181
iTrader: (1)

I can't believe I never posted in this thread.

Technic helped me out tremendously on picking out components for the system and he did an awesome job on the installation (as you can tell by the pictures). He also showed me how he does the installation and how to calibrate the system. Everything was completely reversible back to stock.

The system was great and was way more than I expected to get. The music was rich and had very good bass without over doing it. I also loved that everything looked OEM and you couldn't even tell i had aftermarket components. Overall I loved the system.

Unfortunately I traded my car in and had to take the system out. If anyone's interested in the components I'm going to be selling everything as a package soon along with the technic harness. This will be a great buy for someone who is looking to upgrade their HiFi system. Just send me a PM

Last edited by e90Luis; 08-12-2011 at 07:05 PM.
e90Luis is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:59 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST