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      08-09-2011, 10:16 AM   #89
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So how is the tea party at fault? It's Obama who should be at fault. He's the one that's unwilling to budge on his stance on taxes and his hatred for the successful overwhelms everything that goes on. The tea party hates this debt deal because it didn't cut the deficit enough. Obama and democrats hate it because it didn't raise taxes. I bet if the democrats just lay off the whole premise of wanting to raise taxes we would have gotten a much better deal.
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      08-09-2011, 10:21 AM   #90
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The Quote of the Decade

“The fact that we are here today to debate raising America's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the US Government can not pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government's reckless fiscal policies. Increasing America's debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that, "the buck stops here.' Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better.”
-- Senator Barack H. Obama, March 2006
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      08-09-2011, 10:22 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by mact3333 View Post
Your thoughts are deteriorating quickly...listen to yourself...wow, the substance(little you had) leaving the train quickly....
Oh please. You bicker like a little girl. You squeeze out this piece of mindless ban-bait bullsh!t post below, and then whine like a child that MY response lacked substance???!?!?!

Take some Medimucil before you take another dump like this, because that is the only way your crap like this will ever have any substance:


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Originally Posted by mact3333 View Post
You have nerve!...he is an asshole?...mirror buddy...

You and 11 are the most obnoxious ones on here trying to diminish everyones views and denigrating everyone...hence I often challenge you cause not only do I feel you two are regurgitating what you are fed like sheeple, but you seem incapable of critical thinking where you must stand on your own without the liberal crutch...btw, you two are the most rude on here hence people are rude back to you...

I've said it plenty of times before. I'd love to sit and swap insults with you all day, but your ban-bait postings like this won't ever result in anything else.

Now if you want to post what iks YOU about the Tea Party, please post what you hate about the Tea Party. Because that is what this thread is about. Please go ahead, give me your top 3 things that irk you about TeaTards. Or your top 10.
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      08-09-2011, 11:01 AM   #92
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There are alot of people who follow my financial advise...the ones who say I am nuts are people on this MB, not a great judge of financial acumen...time will tell who knows what the fark they are talking about....

No excuses here...I have been consistent in my views.

Now this is really funny. Now we're supposed to bow down to the bankers and finance people and praise how great their "financial acumen" worked out for us.

Forgive me if I tell the bankers and financiers who leveraged CDO's at 20:1 to f*** themselves when they try to lecture people about living within their means. Your industry BORROWED 20 times as much money as you had, and used money that wasn't yours to gamble in the CDO market. You all got burned badly when you lost your bets, and all your borrowed money came due and you couldn't pay your debts without the Gov't bailing out the entire banking and finance industry -- then you have the gaul to come crying HERE about the rest of us Americans not living within our means, and brag about how good a job you've done?

Get real.

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      08-09-2011, 11:17 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by AngelinIsRich08 View Post
So how is the tea party at fault? It's Obama who should be at fault.
Are you sure about that? Because S&P seems to disagree with you. (Last paragraph on the 4th page)

Quote:
Compared with previous projections, our revised base case scenario now
assumes that the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts, due to expire by the end of 2012,
remain in place. We have changed our assumption on this because the majority of Republicans in Congress continue to resist any measure that would raise revenues, a position we believe Congress reinforced by passing the act. Key macroeconomic assumptions in the base case scenario include trend real GDP growth of 3% and consumer price inflation near 2% annually over the decade.
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      08-09-2011, 11:37 AM   #94
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It appears that for now, new revenues have
dropped down on the menu of policy options. In addition, the plan envisions
only minor policy changes on Medicare and little change in other entitlements,
the containment of which we and most other independent observers regard as key to long-term fiscal sustainability.
So... now that we have each posted something from the same article that points blame in both directions...



Can we agree that both sides are being pig headed ass holes?

(Sorry to de-rail. I know this was supposed to be a rant thread about the Tea Party... but since it has become a much larger conversation about politics. Might as well keep it going.)
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      08-09-2011, 11:39 AM   #95
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Can we agree that both sides are being pig headed ass holes?
i never disagreed with you about that. look at my first post earlier in this thread. i said that we are fucked regardless of what political party is in charge.
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      08-09-2011, 11:55 AM   #96
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i never disagreed with you about that. look at my first post earlier in this thread. i said that we are fucked regardless of what political party is in charge.
It really sucks.

Someone made a comment to me the other day that the majority of the country would hate to hear, but it has some truth to it. We have politicians running towns, cities, counties, states and our country. They are left to make (for all intents and purposes) business decisions concerning their area of responsibility. They all recognize the fact that they can't make it up the ladder without help. So instead of making the wise and fiscally responsible decision. They are forced to make a "career move" to better their opportunities in the future. Without taking fault away from them, it is hard not to agree it is a terrible system.

Most are completely unqualified to make the decisions they are confronted with. Which is why they have advisers, etc. If you really think about it a city, state or country is like a conglomerate. Any one of us could be a politician if we really wanted to and knew the right people. Does that also make us qualified enough to run GE or 3M?

So why is it that we choose to employ people who inspire us with well written speeches and empty promises to make decisions for us?

It really sucks.
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      08-09-2011, 12:20 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by NYCGP View Post
It really sucks.

Someone made a comment to me the other day that the majority of the country would hate to hear, but it has some truth to it. We have politicians running towns, cities, counties, states and our country. They are left to make (for all intents and purposes) business decisions concerning their area of responsibility. They all recognize the fact that they can't make it up the ladder without help. So instead of making the wise and fiscally responsible decision. They are forced to make a "career move" to better their opportunities in the future. Without taking fault away from them, it is hard not to agree it is a terrible system.

Most are completely unqualified to make the decisions they are confronted with. Which is why they have advisers, etc. If you really think about it a city, state or country is like a conglomerate. Any one of us could be a politician if we really wanted to and knew the right people. Does that also make us qualified enough to run GE or 3M?

So why is it that we choose to employ people who inspire us with well written speeches and empty promises to make decisions for us?

It really sucks.

One step in the right direction would be to somehow get more people voting in Primaries. Right now the Primary system always selects the candidates that appeal to the smallest minority of the base in both parties.

In most places, the Primary process completely silences the entire center. The result is that it is harder and harder for someone truly qualified to get elected. The Primary system actually worked BETTER back when most folks were either registered with the Democratic Party or the Republican Party, because more people could vote in the Primaries. Now with people being registered as Independent in so many states not being able to vote in ANY primaries, those voices are effectively gone from the initial selection process.

Somehow getting them back involved with the selections at the Primary level would improve the quality of candidates. Unfortunately, most systems I've seen that attempt to do this end up having the opposite effect, because the parties manipulate the system to weaken the other party's candidates.


Those are the cold hard facts. Feel free to agree with them or not.


Now to tie that back into what irks folks like me about the Tea Party. The Tea Party has managed to manipulate the Primary process to insert the weakest inbred lousy candidates into the elections, leaving Moderate Republicans and Moderate Right-Leaning Independents being forced to vote for the worst candidates ever. The Tea Party has magnified all the problems the Primary system already has. Take the current field of Republicans running for the Republican nomination who are pandering like crazy to the Tea Pary. They are so bad that even Republicans are desperate to find someone else. The biggest buzz from the Republican Primaries is talk about who else might run besides these losers.
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      08-09-2011, 12:43 PM   #98
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They are so bad that even Republicans are desperate to find someone else. The biggest buzz from the Republican Primaries is talk about who else might run besides these losers.
This is a fact. It's become increasingly difficult to find someone that can appeal to both religious nuts and the average conservative. Like I said before, I lean right. But the moment I hear religion in my politics I stop listening.
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      08-09-2011, 12:58 PM   #99
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the moment I hear religion in my politics I stop listening.
thats the thing. tea party and majority of the republican party are all about jesus, so it makes it really hard for me to listen to anything they have to say.
yes, some ideas are great, but they are completely overshadowed by the religious nonsense they put above everything else.

i come from a non-religious society, so even after 17 years in US, it is still very hard for me to wrap my mind around this country's obsession with jesus.

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      08-09-2011, 01:10 PM   #100
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That Bachman pic looks shopped.
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      08-09-2011, 01:16 PM   #101
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That Bachman pic looks shopped.
No sir. It's a 100% real picture from the Newsweek cover.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek.html

she really does look crazy.
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      08-09-2011, 01:22 PM   #102
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she really IS crazy.
Fixed...
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      08-09-2011, 01:55 PM   #103
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Yeah. That bitch is crazy.

Another sad truth, women see a woman candidate and without totally listening to them or understanding their position, they feel like they can relate to them because they share anatomy.

I am sorry to say there was a similar effect with Obama and persons of color.

I would never say one person's vote is more valuable than the other. But it is hard to argue there isn't a game being played and it has nothing to do with the "best candidate" but rather the most attractive. I am not saying this is in anyway different than how it has been done forever.

But, these parties don't care about people like us who care to inform ourselves. They care about those who don't. What will get the Hispanic vote? What will get the Evangelical vote? What will get the single mother vote?

It's all bullshit. This is why I hated studying politics and found myself choosing to focus more on philosophy.
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      08-09-2011, 02:13 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by NYCGP View Post
Yeah. That bitch is crazy.

Another sad truth, women see a woman candidate and without totally listening to them or understanding their position, they feel like they can relate to them because they share anatomy.

I am sorry to say there was a similar effect with Obama and persons of color.

I would never say one person's vote is more valuable than the other. But it is hard to argue there isn't a game being played and it has nothing to do with the "best candidate" but rather the most attractive. I am not saying this is in anyway different than how it has been done forever.

But, these parties don't care about people like us who care to inform ourselves. They care about those who don't. What will get the Hispanic vote? What will get the Evangelical vote? What will get the single mother vote?

It's all bullshit. This is why I hated studying politics and found myself choosing to focus more on philosophy.
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      08-09-2011, 02:42 PM   #105
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Can't let go of the smarmy sarcasm thing, huh? And I was under the delusion that a BMW forum would have mature, thinking members.
You somehow equate owning a BMW with maturity? That would be a stretch. Defining oneself by virtue of car ownership would seem to be an affliction of youth, not maturity.
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      08-09-2011, 03:10 PM   #106
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ill bite with the what irks me about the tea party...

1) the religious aspect
2) not a huge fan of some of the politicians due to the above...than again, im not really a fan of any of these jokers
3) seeing as there is an eagle eye on every aspect of these politicians it would be good to have someone who could politic as well as the president was and is able to. but at the same time that is a double edge sword.


an aspect that needs to be addressed is that the tea party was created BECAUSE of dissatisfaction with the GOP (if you actually listened to both sides and not just one you would know that) the GOP does NOT like the tea party as they are pushing policy further to the right. That is the point of the tea party though, the GOP doesn't represent the sentiment of a growing number of people. In this economy there needs to be a very conservative fiscal policy WHILE still preserving some social programs. It would be childish to presume that a libertarian ideal could possibly exist and i think that it is not a core belief of the tea party (despite what certain media outlets report). Ive been to the tea party in San Antonio some years back that was at the time the biggest and trust me, what was reported from the mainstream media vs what actually happened are two totally separate things even the number of people reported as showing up was way off!

I would love to see a fiscally conservative and socially liberal president and government but the fact is that this wont happen any time soon. so for me, the fiscal issue is far more important than the social issues, and that is why i reserve my vote for the person or party i feel can best address that.

As far as the racism is concerned, there is an obvious anti white sentiment that seems to be stemming from a hate of the rich. (not that all white people are rich, i believe it is the tactic used). According to the voter data there were more black people that voted for Obama than any other democrat ever. That is racism, though i am happy to see a black president, i don't like to see what he is doing though i feel as though it will be a boost for minorities everywhere. Another example of racism was a funny/sad story. There is a college student (forgot the school) who went around asking students how they felt about affirmative action (all colors) and most if not all agreed it was good, he than stated that the schools basketball team was primarily black and that there should be more white, Asian, and Hispanic players. Those polled did not agree. I feel that race is being glorified and that it is made into an important issue when in reality it is not. Nobody is any better than anybody else and i feel as though we are being taught that white people should have to pay for the neglect of the fact through the years.
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      08-09-2011, 04:00 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by NYCGP View Post
Yeah. That bitch is crazy.

Another sad truth, women see a woman candidate and without totally listening to them or understanding their position, they feel like they can relate to them because they share anatomy.

I am sorry to say there was a similar effect with Obama and persons of color.

I would never say one person's vote is more valuable than the other. But it is hard to argue there isn't a game being played and it has nothing to do with the "best candidate" but rather the most attractive. I am not saying this is in anyway different than how it has been done forever.

But, these parties don't care about people like us who care to inform ourselves. They care about those who don't. What will get the Hispanic vote? What will get the Evangelical vote? What will get the single mother vote?

It's all bullshit. This is why I hated studying politics and found myself choosing to focus more on philosophy.

First off, I'll acknowledge our agreement on the crazy lady.

But then I have to take issue with the rest. What you need to recognize is that White Christian Males have been playing the same "game" and have elected 99% White Males to the Presidency and Congress over the course of US history dating back to 1776. There is a reason why the photo of Barack Obama sticks out in a sea of 43 White Male Presidents, and it ain't because of his ears....

So maybe you can give the brothers and sisters a break, and understand that there is going to be a bit of backlash when a system that used to BAN blacks and women from voting finally starts to return to balance.


PS -- Overall, woman CAN generally relate to other women better than men. That's just a fact. People DO generally relate better with others who share common experiences and background, etc. Many times these common experiences and backgrounds fall on racial, sexual, economic, religious, and etc lines. I know that is Sociology, and not philosophy, but your philosophy background should make this clear to you.
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      08-09-2011, 08:56 PM   #108
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I am sorry to say there was a similar effect with Obama and persons of color. I would never say one person's vote is more valuable than the other. But it is hard to argue there isn't a game being played and it has nothing to do with the "best candidate" but rather the most attractive.
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As far as the racism is concerned, there is an obvious anti white sentiment that seems to be stemming from a hate of the rich. (not that all white people are rich, i believe it is the tactic used).
According to the voter data there were more black people that voted for Obama than any other democrat ever. That is racism, though i am happy to see a black president, i don't like to see what he is doing though i feel as though it will be a boost for minorities everywhere.
If this was a tactical "game", it wasn't played very well. Aligning oneself with a much-maligned minority is not exactly a winning formula for garnering a majority of popular votes. I'm not sure what your reasoning is for thinking that this is an advantage.

If you look at the election of Bill Clinton or Carter, I'm sure the black vote was over 90%, so it should be no surprise that it was 95% for Obama. I guarantee that Alan Keyes would not get a large black vote.

The anti-white/ hate of the rich statement is just bizzare. So-called regular people love GW Bush, Romney, and Trump. These same working-class people (such as Union republicans) have no problem with not taxing the rich.

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      08-09-2011, 09:39 PM   #109
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If this was a tactical "game", it wasn't played very well. Aligning oneself with a much-maligned minority is not exactly a winning formula for garnering a majority of popular votes. I'm not sure what your reasoning is for thinking that this is an advantage.

If you look at the election of Bill Clinton or Carter, I'm sure the black vote was over 90%, so it should be no surprise that it was 95% for Obama. I guarantee that Alan Keyes would not get a large black vote.

The anti-white/ hate of the rich statement is just bizzare. So-called regular people love GW Bush, Romney, and Trump. These same working-class people (such as Union republicans) have no problem with not taxing the rich.
Good point about Alan Keyes. He ran in 2008 as the America's Independent Party's Presidential candidate and only got 47,694 votes.

Another example is Cynthia McKinney and Rosa Clemente who ran for President and Vice-President against Obama in 2008 under the Green party. Following these guy's theory, they should have won by a large margin. They had the anatomical parts to get the Female vote, and the skin color to get BOTH the Hispanic and African American vote. So they must have cleaned house with ten's of millions of votes, right? Nope, only 161,603. Skin color and vag's didn't do it.

Theory destroyed. Sounds like they will grasp for any excuse for losing besides Obama was the better candidate than McCain, regardless of skin color.

Add racial/gender excuse making to the list of things that irks people about the Tea Party.

Last edited by 11Series; 08-09-2011 at 09:46 PM.
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      08-09-2011, 09:48 PM   #110
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Quote:
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If this was a tactical "game", it wasn't played very well. Aligning oneself with a much-maligned minority is not exactly a winning formula for garnering a majority of popular votes. I'm not sure what your reasoning is for thinking that this is an advantage.

If you look at the election of Bill Clinton or Carter, I'm sure the black vote was over 90%, so it should be no surprise that it was 95% for Obama. I guarantee that Alan Keyes would not get a large black vote.

The anti-white/ hate of the rich statement is just bizzare. So-called regular people love GW Bush, Romney, and Trump. These same working-class people (such as Union republicans) have no problem with not taxing the rich.
im not arguing that it was a tactical move. it is an ideological move. Its about standing up for what these people believe is right. Its admirable if you ask me. As far as any other person of color or female running it isnt the same thing. President Obama was the best candidate to win at the time (damn good politician) Im not saying that President Obama got elected because of race, im arguing that more black people voted for him than would otherwise had he not have been black. It is a fact that it was the highest black vote for a Democrat. And the anti white/ anti rich sentiment shouldn't be bizarre to you at all.... just look at some of the videos coming out of England. the quote goes something like "we robbed these people because they own a business and are therefore rich, its their fault were in this mess"
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