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      04-19-2007, 06:53 AM   #1
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Two stage brake lights

This morning I had to apply the anchors quite quickly in order to stop at a traffic light changing to red. It made me wonder whether the two stage brake lighting might have come on. Does anyone know how hard you need to brake for this to happen, or is there a video somewhere that shows it?
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      04-19-2007, 07:01 AM   #2
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I never did get the two stage thing - surely the person behind you needs to know about BMWs to decode ?
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      04-19-2007, 08:58 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z4 Beemer View Post
This morning I had to apply the anchors quite quickly in order to stop at a traffic light changing to red. It made me wonder whether the two stage brake lighting might have come on. Does anyone know how hard you need to brake for this to happen, or is there a video somewhere that shows it?
This picture shows the 2 stage lights under hard braking:



Under normal braking only the outer half of the area illuminates.

I think this relies on the intuitive reaction all drivers have to a red light - i.e. stop.

The larger and brighter the red light the quicker the reaction to it.
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      04-19-2007, 01:49 PM   #4
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I think on the e92 its the fog lights that comes on as the secondary lights??
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      04-19-2007, 02:08 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by needforspeed View Post
This picture shows the 2 stage lights under hard braking:



Under normal braking only the outer half of the area illuminates.

I think this relies on the intuitive reaction all drivers have to a red light - i.e. stop.

The larger and brighter the red light the quicker the reaction to it.
Like this.

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      04-19-2007, 02:53 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z4 Beemer View Post
This morning I had to apply the anchors quite quickly in order to stop at a traffic light changing to red. It made me wonder whether the two stage brake lighting might have come on. Does anyone know how hard you need to brake for this to happen, or is there a video somewhere that shows it?
The 2nd stage brake light will come on when ABS intervenes.
I can't remember if it comes on under any other circumstance, but E90Fleet had some info about it somewhere.

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      04-20-2007, 12:44 PM   #7
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ABS shoudl rarely ever come on even when you brake ultra hard after someone pulls out in front of you

i was led to beleive they come on under 'hard braking' not absolute emergency shit-the-bed ABS braking?!

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      04-20-2007, 12:51 PM   #8
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Just to clarify, I did brake quite hard, but I thought if the ABS activated the light on the dash would flicker like it does with the traction control (so I am told )

The ABS dash light never flickered but I thought because I really did apply the anchors quite firmly and stopped quite quickly, the second set of lights might have come on.

Come to think of it, I wonder if the feature that when you lift off the accelerator really quickly and the brakes get prepared activated The car did stop in a very short distance which I was pleased with
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      04-20-2007, 12:52 PM   #9
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Quite clearly we need a volunteer to try this out with a video camera. Anyone?

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      04-20-2007, 01:23 PM   #10
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Those attending the Pod meet could test this out....
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      04-20-2007, 02:06 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z4 Beemer View Post
Just to clarify, I did brake quite hard, but I thought if the ABS activated the light on the dash would flicker like it does with the traction control (so I am told )

The ABS dash light never flickered but I thought because I really did apply the anchors quite firmly and stopped quite quickly, the second set of lights might have come on.

Come to think of it, I wonder if the feature that when you lift off the accelerator really quickly and the brakes get prepared activated The car did stop in a very short distance which I was pleased with
I don't think the dashboard light comes on when ABS operates.

You only know it's on because of the pulsing feeling through the pedal.

Incidentally, next time it rains concentrate when you are braking and you should feel the brake drying pulsing the pedal in time with the wipers.

So cool
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      04-22-2007, 07:36 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by needforspeed View Post
I don't think the dashboard light comes on when ABS operates.

You only know it's on because of the pulsing feeling through the pedal.

Incidentally, next time it rains concentrate when you are braking and you should feel the brake drying pulsing the pedal in time with the wipers.

So cool
You're right NFS- the pedal only pulses- there isn't any light on the dash which tells you that ABS has intervened- It's only happened to me once so far.

As I've said, the 2nd stage light does then come on, but as for other situations, I'm not sure.

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      04-22-2007, 11:09 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vivekk View Post
As I've said, the 2nd stage light does then come on, but as for other situations, I'm not sure.

Viv
We really need to get to the bottom of this!

Quote:
Originally Posted by needforspeed View Post
Incidentally, next time it rains concentrate when you are braking and you should feel the brake drying pulsing the pedal in time with the wipers.

So cool
I have never noticed that before - but will look out for it.
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      04-22-2007, 05:04 PM   #14
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The second light will come on with just heavy breaking, its not tied to ABS. A friend of mine and I were racing home a couple of weeks back and since I was winning, he commented about how the brake lights came on in two stages when I was grinding to a halt.

I'd still like to see it for myself tho.
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      04-23-2007, 02:51 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E92-Mark View Post
The second light will come on with just heavy breaking, its not tied to ABS. A friend of mine and I were racing home a couple of weeks back and since I was winning, he commented about how the brake lights came on in two stages when I was grinding to a halt.

I'd still like to see it for myself tho.
Hi Mark- hope you are keeping well.

I expect that 'heavy' braking will turn on the 2nd brake light, however, from the mouth of the 'master':

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hornet
Do US versions have 2-stage brake lights? Judging by the video they apparently don't.

E90Fleet: 2nd stage only activates if ABS kicks in


All the best.

Viv
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      04-23-2007, 03:12 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vivekk View Post
2nd stage only activates if ABS kicks in[/b]


All the best.

Viv
That does seem a bit daft as you can slow down quicker when the ABS isn't activated.

Regards

Chris
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      04-23-2007, 03:17 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z4 Beemer View Post
This morning I had to apply the anchors quite quickly in order to stop at a traffic light changing to red. It made me wonder whether the two stage brake lighting might have come on. Does anyone know how hard you need to brake for this to happen, or is there a video somewhere that shows it?
Well, it definitely goes on...an E36 M3 guy on track reminded me that the secondary lights would go on under hard braking...I guess I braked pretty hard going into a few corners.
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      04-24-2007, 11:56 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vivekk View Post
Hi Mark- hope you are keeping well.

I expect that 'heavy' braking will turn on the 2nd brake light, however, from the mouth of the 'master':

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hornet
Do US versions have 2-stage brake lights? Judging by the video they apparently don't.

E90Fleet: 2nd stage only activates if ABS kicks in
All the best.

Viv
Hi Viv. Hmmm, dont like to differ from E90Fleet, but I'm pretty sure the ABS didnt cut in that night, and I do know how it feels on the E92 By heavy breaking I mean that oooooh crap.... feeling when you're trying to put your foot through the floor and onto the tarmac, and stuff on the parcel shelf ends up on the dashboard.
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      04-24-2007, 12:29 PM   #19
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I'm afraid I had another one of those " I need to stop right now" moments this morning. The lights were just changing amber and I thought I might squeeze through, but then spotted 3 police cars sitting at the junction waiting to come out! It was hard braking, but don't think ABS kicked in, tho I would have expected the 2nd set of brake lights to come on.

We really need to get to the bottom of this
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      04-24-2007, 12:40 PM   #20
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I had an "OH SHIT THATS*O*B*ISGONNAPLOWSTRAIGHTINTOTHESIDEOFMYFRICKI NCAR!!!!!!" moment last week when someone decided that ALL the lanes on the island were for their exclusive use no matter who else was on it.

Trust me, my feet were almost in Flintstones mode and the DSC light did NOT light. ABS definately kicked in though

Learnt one thing... these cars stop CHUFFIN FAST!!!
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      04-24-2007, 03:16 PM   #21
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I had an "OH SHIT THATS*O*B*ISGONNAPLOWSTRAIGHTINTOTHESIDEOFMYFRICKI NCAR!!!!!!" moment last week when someone decided that ALL the lanes on the island were for their exclusive use no matter who else was on it.

Trust me, my feet were almost in Flintstones mode and the DSC light did NOT light. ABS definately kicked in though

Learnt one thing... these cars stop CHUFFIN FAST!!!
Perhaps jonmad can tell me if my 2nd stage brake lights came on during my 'tractor avoidance' maneuvre at the last UK meet?

(although I suspect he may have been to busy concentrating on slamming on the anchors to notice)
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      04-24-2007, 04:26 PM   #22
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Before this turns into another DTC / DSC thread

is your friend....

The article here suggests that a decceleration of 5m/s2 or more triggers the system. This would seem fairly sensible as you can brake quickly without using ABS. But I would have added the ABS activation as an additional trigger if I were designing the system as there is the possiblilty that you are unable to achieve 5m/s2, such as when braking on a slick surface.

The glossary here also states that a decelleration of more than 5m/s2 is required to trigger the BFD.
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