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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Wheels and Tires Forum Sponsored by The Tire Rack > Looser steering after replacement with Pilot Super Sports?



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      10-21-2011, 09:52 AM   #1
badassfajita
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Looser steering after replacement with Pilot Super Sports?

Any one have similar issues and can recommend a solution?

'08 335i SP 225/40/18 & 255/35/18 with about 400 miles driven on the tires.

Current pressures: 35 / 38 (had 32/35 previously)

1) Steering is definitely looser than before, almost like I can drive with one hand. The "heft" of the wheel is gone.

2) Lack of connection / confidence with road - Just don't feel it. Tires feel squishy. A quick left followed by a right (almost like a slalom) results in zero confidence of where the car is going.

3) Dead spot +/- 7-8 degrees on the wheel. Quickly turning the wheel back and forth while driving results in the car plowing straight without responding. Now if I turn slowly, the car does respond.

4) Lack of feel - I just don't "feel" the tires underneath me during a turn.


The ride is definitely smoother at stock 32/25 pressures than the old RFTs.

Any ideas? Am I nuts to want my RFTs back?

Last edited by badassfajita; 10-21-2011 at 10:04 AM.
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      10-21-2011, 09:53 AM   #2
NiVeDh
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Crank up the pressure in the fronts to 38 psi as well and see if that helps. Also, let the tires break in.
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      10-21-2011, 10:20 AM   #3
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Your new tires do need to run in for ~500 miles.
Switching to non-rft tires, you do lose steering feedback and turn in response. BMW engineered the suspension for rft's. Thus begins the slippery slope when you ditch the rft's. And here's an idea: instead of spending lot's of money changing susp components (like I did), switch back to Michelin rft's. Don't know if the PSS is avail in rft but the PS2 is.
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Last edited by cvc 22349a; 10-21-2011 at 10:23 AM. Reason: edit
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      10-21-2011, 11:07 AM   #4
ceb
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And slowly the sanity sets in.

BTW, increasing the pressure in the front will make for less steering feel.
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      10-21-2011, 05:02 PM   #5
nbkkvv5
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I'm going to need new tires in about 2000 miles and was considering the Pilot Super Sports after reading the reviews on tirerack. The car they used was a 2011 BMW E92 328i Coupe and nothing was mentioned about the lack of steering feel.
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...y.jsp?ttid=148

Has anyone else tried these tires and have issues with steering feel?

Last edited by nbkkvv5; 10-21-2011 at 05:02 PM. Reason: typo
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      10-21-2011, 09:43 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cvc 22349a View Post
Your new tires do need to run in for ~500 miles.
Switching to non-rft tires, you do lose steering feedback and turn in response. BMW engineered the suspension for rft's. Thus begins the slippery slope when you ditch the rft's. And here's an idea: instead of spending lot's of money changing susp components (like I did), switch back to Michelin rft's. Don't know if the PSS is avail in rft but the PS2 is.
Yep!!

I can't wait for winter to end so I can Switch back toSummer setup.

I heard that the Non-RFT's are "Squichy"--That rules out the Super Sports.

I'll go with PS2's ZP or another set of Bridgestone RFT's--Made car feel like it was on a Rail--No Sqeal/Slip, etc. Loved it!!!

Despize handling with A/S Plus !!!
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      10-21-2011, 09:45 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nbkkvv5 View Post
I'm going to need new tires in about 2000 miles and was considering the Pilot Super Sports after reading the reviews on tirerack. The car they used was a 2011 BMW E92 328i Coupe and nothing was mentioned about the lack of steering feel.
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...y.jsp?ttid=148

Has anyone else tried these tires and have issues with steering feel?
I've heard reports that they're "Squishy" as well.
Think we need to stay with RFT for Stiff sidewalls.
I just put on the A/S plus--Hate the Fuckers!!!
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      10-21-2011, 10:29 PM   #8
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Enjoy the much better comfort and less tramlining in the new tyres vs. RFT. You will probably never go back after a while. RFT has a quicker turn-in due to the hard sides but conventional tyres behaves better overall. The car is designed for RFT's so the optimal solution is to stiffen the chassi when moving to non-RFT.
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      10-22-2011, 05:29 PM   #9
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what if you change to something stiffer, like dunlop direzza star spec or hankook ventus rs-3?

Those are extreme performance tires and should have stiffer side walls.
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      10-22-2011, 06:24 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R1000K3 View Post
Enjoy the much better comfort and less tramlining in the new tyres vs. RFT. You will probably never go back after a while. RFT has a quicker turn-in due to the hard sides but conventional tyres behaves better overall. The car is designed for RFT's so the optimal solution is to stiffen the chassi when moving to non-RFT.
That's what I did but not everyone wants to spend alot of money to change out the control arms and bushings..
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      10-22-2011, 06:26 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MazdaFan View Post
what if you change to something stiffer, like dunlop direzza star spec or hankook ventus rs-3?

Those are extreme performance tires and should have stiffer side walls.
PSS has a stiff sidewall for a non-rft
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      10-22-2011, 07:09 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ceb View Post
And slowly the sanity sets in.

BTW, increasing the pressure in the front will make for less steering feel.
This is true but he seems like he wants quicker turn-in.
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      10-23-2011, 05:41 AM   #13
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I was doing a test run with some rims a few days ago, have the same feeling, thought something was wrong with my car. I have the fronts at 37 and rears at 39. I only had about 100 miles on them before I took them off, something didn't feel right. The tires do stick around turns.

I took the car on the highway and felt a ton of resistance when I let off the gas. The car instantly loses a lot of speed. Do you feel the same thing OP (badassfajita)?
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      10-23-2011, 05:48 AM   #14
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I was planning to get these tires when my current ones wear out but if what you guys are saying is true I might have to reconsider..
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      10-23-2011, 08:23 AM   #15
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Play with the pressures - try anything from 2.2 bar/2.6 bar (front/rear) to 3 bar/3 bar and see how it goes

A friend of mine was running Pirelli P Zero Corsas on a Golf GTI and he ran them at 1.8 bar (OEM is somewhere like 2.3 bar) to get better steering
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      10-23-2011, 11:15 AM   #16
badassfajita
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllydNYC View Post
I was doing a test run with some rims a few days ago, have the same feeling, thought something was wrong with my car. I have the fronts at 37 and rears at 39. I only had about 100 miles on them before I took them off, something didn't feel right. The tires do stick around turns.

I took the car on the highway and felt a ton of resistance when I let off the gas. The car instantly loses a lot of speed. Do you feel the same thing OP (badassfajita)?
I don't feel resistance that you are describing, but I'll keep an eye out this week while driving.

On that note, I dropped the fronts to 34 and the heft seemed to be a bit better. Maybe I'm just getting used to the tires though.

Not going to to take them off yet --probably will let em run another two gas tanks or so and experiment with several tire pressure combinations.
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      10-23-2011, 11:17 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D_o_S View Post
Play with the pressures - try anything from 2.2 bar/2.6 bar (front/rear) to 3 bar/3 bar and see how it goes

A friend of mine was running Pirelli P Zero Corsas on a Golf GTI and he ran them at 1.8 bar (OEM is somewhere like 2.3 bar) to get better steering
Help me out here--can you clarify what you mean by "bar?"
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      10-23-2011, 11:48 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badassfajita View Post
Help me out here--can you clarify what you mean by "bar?"
It's a unit for pressure. 1 bar is 14.5 psi.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bar_(unit)
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      10-23-2011, 12:35 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by henry418 View Post
I was planning to get these tires when my current ones wear out but if what you guys are saying is true I might have to reconsider..
Don't reconsider. These guys driving them saying they are "Squishy" and RFT's ride better have no clue what they are saying. They are used to the terribly hard side walls of the RFTs, but I guarentee the PSS will outperform in every situation. PSS are one of the best summer tires made, period dot. I have several thousand miles on mine, including several track days and drag events. Their ability on the track or the road meet or exceed all of my expectations. I have gone though several sets of tires with my 335i, Falkens, V12's, RFT's, and they don't even come close to PSS. It's like wearing a cheap pair of running shoes vs. some Brooks or Asics. Do your research, read and watch the reviews on Tire Rack, I promise you won't be disappointed.

That being said, DO NOT use these for cold weather (below 32) conditions. They may also be overkill for 328's and 325's as a daily driver. If your car is a DD and you drive spiritedly or sometimes track it, then the PSS are a perfect fit.
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      10-23-2011, 12:47 PM   #20
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      10-23-2011, 06:17 PM   #21
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All other things being equal, the non RFT's softer sidewalls will feel "mushier" on initial turn in. This doesn't mean less grip, simply a different feel. It is what it is.

The upside is a better ride and lower price.

Tom
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      10-23-2011, 08:30 PM   #22
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idk what you guys are talking about. my pss feel fine. comming from stock rft and falken fk452 these blow them out of the water in handling etc
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