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      06-26-2012, 02:11 PM   #573
Year's_End
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That'll be a good thing imo. Strong community will result because of it.
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      06-26-2012, 07:20 PM   #574
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You won't see a lot of them for at least another full year or more. Suburu and Toyota were extremely conservative on the production so we're only talking several thousand for the US. That also means you certainly aren't seeing discounts. Suburu doesn't have the vast manufacturing capability of Toyota so I'm not sure they can easily ramp up production.
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      06-26-2012, 07:49 PM   #575
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Subaru is shipping 5,000-7,000 BRZs for the 2013 model year. They'll adjust production according to demand, and seeing as demand has been outweighing production at the current moment—the turnover rate on dealer lots is 4 or 5 days for the BRZ and FR-S, respectively—we can expect a larger allocation for the 2014 model year.

I think the Miata crowd will jump on this initially, causing a short term sales boom, but as far as long term sustainable sales are concerned, I'm not quite sure.
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      06-26-2012, 08:44 PM   #576
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Originally Posted by Year's_End View Post
I think the Miata crowd will jump on this initially, causing a short term sales boom, but as far as long term sustainable sales are concerned, I'm not quite sure.
I think they'll do just fine - the Subaru modding community is going to take hold of this already well-balanced car and make it something really special.

One of the best things about Subaru modding is the incredible bang-for-your-buck; there seems to be no "S-tax" added onto parts for those cars, which is great.
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      06-27-2012, 05:51 AM   #577
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I'm beginning to see some of these on the roads already.

I think one thing I would worry about is that this car is so affordable for most people, that it could end up being as common on the street as your normal 3-Series or Civic. Supply is supposed to be limited this year, but since they are selling so briskly, I can see Toyota/Subaru increasing their production about 2x to 3x what it is for 2013.

Not that having the same car as everyone else should be a defining factor for purchase, but then again, it is a factor for a lot of people.

They all are different in some way...











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      06-27-2012, 06:01 AM   #578
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Tim Schrick asked for an oil temp gauge for the Toyobaru's high-revving engine... someone heard him:








Also, a VERY nice looking racing Toyobaru:




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      06-27-2012, 10:15 AM   #579
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Damnit... the more I see these cars the more I want to trade mine in for one.
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      06-27-2012, 12:08 PM   #580
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Damnit... the more I see these cars the more I want to trade mine in for one.
Why would you trade a 'family' car for the Toyobaru?!

Why don't have both?
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      06-27-2012, 12:25 PM   #581
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I came across this article from Insideline and realized how Mazda wasted the opportunity big time to have a Miata based Coupe with a compact, lightweight, low centre of gravity rotary engine.

In fact, even Toyobaru's chief engineer Tetsuya Tada said that various powertrains were investigated including a rotary engine and the main thing that was sought was low weight and compactness that would allow the centre of gravity to be lower.

Mazda had the perfect formula then with their rotary engine but they lost the window of opportunity now:

Quote:
In agonizingly short supply are compact, lightweight sporting tin-top cars that drive the wheels at the correct end of the car and place a premium on tactility and reward. It's no wonder everyone's champing at the bit for the 2013 Subaru BRZ — it's a car that for 22 years Mazda had the building blocks in place to create, but didn't.

I couldn't agree more!
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      06-27-2012, 07:20 PM   #582
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What is Mazda up to? Is Mazda trying to catch up with the lost time?!


Mazda MX-5 GT Concept

Quote:
Unlike the supercharged MX-5 Super20, the GT Concept makes do with a revised version of the normally aspirated 2.0-litre four-cylinder engine linked to the car's standard manual gearbox. Mazda tells us that output has been boosted by 47hp, from 158hp (161PS) to 205hp (208PS).


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      06-27-2012, 08:40 PM   #583
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Since 1994 that Mazda is fooling around... and now Toyota and Subaru have gone ahead and perfected the formula in EVERY way and made it available for the general public all over the world (not only inside Japan):













How can a company be so wrong after being so right about the Miata?!
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      06-27-2012, 09:45 PM   #584
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beautiful dramaish commercial

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      06-27-2012, 10:09 PM   #585
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sugoi !

lol subaru - bringing families back since post world war two
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      06-28-2012, 01:22 AM   #586
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If MX-5 was a Coupé I'd chose it over the GT86/BRZ, despite prefering H4 over I4. The reason is that the MX-5 is a 2 seater only whereas the GT86/BRZ 2+2 seater.
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      06-28-2012, 02:03 AM   #587
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beautiful commercial
Nice.

yay for being able to understand what little dialogue they had lol
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      06-28-2012, 05:55 AM   #588
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Quote:
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If MX-5 was a Coupé I'd chose it over the GT86/BRZ, despite prefering H4 over I4. The reason is that the MX-5 is a 2 seater only whereas the GT86/BRZ 2+2 seater.
Levi,

Think again... you don't want to make the girl sad, do you?!




Think of all the added practicality... you can't be driving all the time...


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      06-28-2012, 06:25 AM   #589
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On a more serious note I think that like in the Cayman (and Porsches in a general manner) the Toyobaru's boxer lower centre of gravity is definitely a BIG advantage.

Mazda had a chance to do it with the rotary engine when fuel efficiency wasn't such a concern as it is today.

Just imagine a Toyobaru like lightweight and affordable Coupe capable of 9000 rpm and 238 hp (RX-8 specification - mind you, the RX-8 curb weight was 3029 lbs or 1374 kg)... Mazda lost that BIG opportunity.

Honda did it with the S2000 but it didn't have the lower centre of gravity advantage (the F20C is a significantly tall engine) nor it was nearly as practical.

That's the reason why I'm hoping that Toyota and Subaru don't make the same Mazda mistake and can provide us with a D4-S 1.6 Turbo version of the boxer engine (an engine that both companies could use also in other models, like BMW and PSA did, to make it financially viable). That's the future... that's what would make the Toyobaru just perfect!

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      06-28-2012, 07:24 AM   #590
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Quote:
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Tim Schrick asked for an oil temp gauge for the Toyobaru's high-revving engine... someone heard him:




Wow that looks hot. Seriously considering this as a tracktoy. It just needs a 50-100 hp bump in power. The chassis can easily handle that.
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      06-28-2012, 09:18 AM   #591
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I think we all know that the GT86 is a good car but lacks straight line performance, becuase the car still does not weigh 600 kg but 1200 kg. The remedy is + 50-100 PS more power. How to get that ? Two solutions:
-forced induction, either supercharger or turbocharger, but we know the downsides of them which are to different extent added wieght and less responsive throttle
- larger capacity and higher revvs but with downside that it will be a worse daily driver


All in all, eventhough the GT86 is one of the best sportscar, from a drivers perspective, better is possible. But there is only one way to do better : only two seats (not 2+2) and NA H6. In other words Supra V.

I do not care much about 2+2 seat configuration of the GT86/BRZ because my aim was and still is to have this car as track car only. As a daily driver I'd prefere a Cayman S (the next generation), but its twice the price of one of the twins. I have to wait.
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      06-29-2012, 07:40 AM   #592
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MediaArtist View Post
I'm beginning to see some of these on the roads already.

I think one thing I would worry about is that this car is so affordable for most people, that it could end up being as common on the street as your normal 3-Series or Civic. Supply is supposed to be limited this year, but since they are selling so briskly, I can see Toyota/Subaru increasing their production about 2x to 3x what it is for 2013.

Not that having the same car as everyone else should be a defining factor for purchase, but then again, it is a factor for a lot of people.
A coworker of mine got his BRZ Limited a few weeks ago. He let me drive it briefly on monday and it felt great. The car just goes exactly where you point it, handling and shifting is so nice. I was surprised how small it was in person, but it's the perfect size for corner carving.

I've seen a few FR-S's around town as well. I doubt it'll get super popular though because they are a tad pricey. The BRZ at least gets to almost 30k.
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      06-29-2012, 07:47 AM   #593
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Quote:
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I think we all know that the GT86 is a good car but lacks straight line performance, becuase the car still does not weigh 600 kg but 1200 kg. The remedy is + 50-100 PS more power. How to get that ? Two solutions:
-forced induction, either supercharger or turbocharger, but we know the downsides of them which are to different extent added wieght and less responsive throttle
- larger capacity and higher revvs but with downside that it will be a worse daily driver
Totally agree with you.

Only one question remains unanswered.















WTH is that cute Japanese girl?!

Cheers
Robin
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      06-29-2012, 12:45 PM   #594
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If MX-5 was a Coupé I'd chose it over the GT86/BRZ, despite prefering H4 over I4. The reason is that the MX-5 is a 2 seater only whereas the GT86/BRZ 2+2 seater.
They've pretty much said that it was meant to be a 2+2 but the back seats are really meant to be folded and they designed it so you can carry 4 track wheels and tires. I think it was a smart move to make it foldable seats than just some empty space in the back.
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