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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > Regional Forums > UK > UK Technical Forum > Ridiculous on winters



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      12-12-2011, 10:55 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighlandPete View Post
Or at least read the section in something like the the official driving manual, on all-weather driving.

If we can't get folks to put their lights on in poor visibility, even when it is virtually dark, there isn't much hope for common sense.

HighlandPete
Is it just me or is everyone else noticing more and more people forgetting to put their lights on nowadays?
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      12-12-2011, 11:10 AM   #46
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Mow, its cuz its darkers earlier.. these fuckwits just think lights should go on at specified time, like lamp posts.. FRICKIN' CRAZY CANTS.
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      12-12-2011, 01:10 PM   #47
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And then you get the others that put their rear fog lights on when it's raining. I hate that with a passion!! I have been known to use my full beam to kindly notify them of their mistake.
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      12-12-2011, 01:24 PM   #48
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I'm slightly confused here, are you saying winter tyres are worth it or summers are ok just dont drive like a rookie!

(I know thats ironic coming from a 23 year old!)
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      12-12-2011, 01:52 PM   #49
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The winters on my M3 can't take full throttle, but that's kinda not the point. They are absolutely fine for running in inclement weather and the car is going to feel awesome in the spring when the summers go back on. It'll be like driving a new car again.
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      12-12-2011, 02:15 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave3 View Post
I'm slightly confused here, are you saying winter tyres are worth it or summers are ok just dont drive like a rookie!

(I know thats ironic coming from a 23 year old!)
Once the snow comes you are stuffed. Rwd cars are useless in the snow on summer tyres.

Winter tyres serve a purpose in the correct conditions.

If you need your car when it snows, you need winter tyres or you will get stuck a lot.
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      12-12-2011, 02:36 PM   #51
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I've had my winters on for 6 weeks now. They were new when fitted so were a bit slippy but once bedded in, after 500 miles or so, they've been great. A lot more confidence in taking corners and only a slight loss of standing start grip but they're 225 instead of the 255's I had for summers.
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      12-12-2011, 02:50 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave3 View Post
I'm slightly confused here, are you saying winter tyres are worth it or summers are ok just dont drive like a rookie!

(I know thats ironic coming from a 23 year old!)
I look at it this way. Winter tyres are there to do a job, driven moderately they do most things well in winter, as they are supposed to do. On summer tyres, get those same winter conditions wrong, and you either don't go anywhere and/or come a cropper.

Last week I'd have been house bound, rather than mobile. Also went places I'd never even have attempted, let alone succeeded to go on summers.

If we think a winter tyre is supposed to perform "to the limits" like a summer tyre, when in the transition temperature range, and when the conditions are poor, I believe we are missing the point of why we move to cold weather tyres. It is so easy to be obsessed with performance, as if that is what driving is about. I see that as a perk in the right conditions, not a right of all driving situations.

The car and tyre makers don't think so either, we typically run a lower speed rating in winter, that is telling us something, isn't it?

What has happened of recent years in the UK, we have become almost obsessed that nothing changes in our driving style even in winter. That is not the reality in many countries, and winter means adapting to change, not trying to still be driving around as if in a sports/performance car, as in summer.

Look at the way many motorway drivers continue at speed in heavy rain, or fog, no idea that they are totally irresponsible and ought to driving to the conditions.

HighlandPete

Last edited by HighlandPete; 12-12-2011 at 02:57 PM.
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      12-12-2011, 03:28 PM   #53
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Maybe peeps should jump off the bandwagon here! Where has anyone mentioned driving like a loon who say they have a issue with traction control coming on?

Mine comes on at 70mph in 5th gear like others have said, hardly driving like a loon!
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      12-12-2011, 03:49 PM   #54
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I only notice softer ride but more bounce compared to the runflat but i do have more driving feel with these non RFT. overall i think these are great , we have to remember we are running winter tyres not summer tyres but i never experience any traction light coming on , whether i step on full throttle during a 7-80 mph cruise but mine is a auto so it kicks down to fifth gear. but overall i think these tyres are quite good.

i run 19inch 235/35 fronts and 255/35 in the rear. i kept the tyre pressure the same as runflat recommendation 2.7 F , 2.9 R. so some people with 18 's and higher profile might experience bouncy ride?

hope this helps, it would be helpful if people post size and air pressure of there tyres so we can see anything wrong.

p.s last couple of days we had 2.5 to 3 degree weather where i drive and i couldn't tell because i was driving very normal ly fast and i had grips like normal until the frost sign came on... i knew that i was in cold waether
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Last edited by Yoro35i; 12-12-2011 at 03:55 PM.
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      12-12-2011, 04:10 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Scib View Post
Maybe peeps should jump off the bandwagon here! Where has anyone mentioned driving like a loon who say they have a issue with traction control coming on?

Mine comes on at 70mph in 5th gear like others have said, hardly driving like a loon!
I've been around long enough to know there are several reasons for traction control coming on at such speeds, not just 'looning' about. BTW, winter tyre threads are full of comparing UHP summer tyres and the performance of winter tyres, on acceleration and traction limits.

Key reasons are:

1. Tyres are not scrubbed in and bedded, and/or tyres/road is greasy.

2. There is some mechanical/electronic fault in the cars setup.

3. Driving is too hard/aggressive for the conditions.

Take you pick.

I can assure you my 330d on winter tyres, driving using kickdown and using the full power doesn't 'just' activate the TC, or 'light up' on acceleration or in driving the twisty stuff with some pace on. There is just too much grip to break away. But as conditions deteriorate that tyre performance level is clearly going to be reduced.

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      12-12-2011, 04:59 PM   #56
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The 4 causes of a skid (loss of traction) are:
Harsh braking
Harsh steering
Harsh acceleration
Excess speed
All of which are under the control of the driver.
If you get in a skid you remove the cause, it works.
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      12-12-2011, 06:07 PM   #57
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My issue is not driver error it's tyres

Same conditions on summers not issue with traction from a standing start and certainly no traction control issues at 70mph

Later that day with winter wheels and tyres, tc intervening pulling out on roundabouts and accelerating uphill at 70mph on a dual carriageway.

That's rubbish and well within normal driving conditions. Just a few hours early, no problem.

I put it down to the softer compound, tread design and thinner 225 instead of 255 track.

It's just mental that they slip at 70mph going straight and accelerating.
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      12-12-2011, 06:14 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmt335d View Post
And then you get the others that put their rear fog lights on when it's raining. I hate that with a passion!! I have been known to use my full beam to kindly notify them of their mistake.
Er... PM.... Er.... Reply?!
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      12-12-2011, 07:26 PM   #59
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Quote:
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Er... PM.... Er.... Reply?!
In very heavy rain, rear fogs are acceptable, so long as switched off when visibility improves. Far worse I find, are the number of idiots driving everywhere with their front fog lights on, no matter what the conditions.
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      12-13-2011, 12:27 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spirocheter View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by dxb335d View Post
Er... PM.... Er.... Reply?!
In very heavy rain, rear fogs are acceptable, so long as switched off when visibility improves. Far worse I find, are the number of idiots driving everywhere with their front fog lights on, no matter what the conditions.
I can't stand it when people will put on their sidelights and then fog lights!

Was driving over the Severn bridge ages ago and a car came flying up behind me with his lights like this whilst still in the morning darkness driving an E91, suffice to say he had a torrent of abuse from me as I pulled in. Christ knows how he saw anything on the road ash couldn't see and light pattern in front of him.

Not sure if he thought he was some chav wannabe in Saxo.

Re the winters I did consider them but am yet to see two consecutive days that would have warranted buying them yet. My non rft kumhos have been spot on so far in the cold and wet. Far better than Bridgestone rft in the same conditions.

Totally agree with comments regarding people's driving styles in differing weather conditions and what to expect from winter tyre performance
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      12-13-2011, 03:13 AM   #61
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Why have you guys Quoted me?? I was trying to get DMT to reply to my reply via PM.
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      12-13-2011, 03:14 AM   #62
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Why have you guys Quoted me?? I was trying to get DMT to reply to my reply via PM.
Why are you sending him PMs?
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      12-13-2011, 03:15 AM   #63
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Tyre pressures

How did you check your tyre pressures? Pressures should be checked with the tyres cold. Even a couple of miles will warm the air in tyres causing it to expand and produce falsely high pressure.

Buy a two barrel pump and a guage from Halfords and adjust the pressures once the car's been standing for a few hours. A couple of PSI either way will affect the way the tread sits on the road and affect traction.

Also damp, rather than very wet weather following a largely dry November have made road surfaces unusually slippy.

Add 300bhp, turbo torque, no LSD and winter tread patterns and it will feel slippery

Last edited by SteveC; 12-13-2011 at 03:22 AM.
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      12-13-2011, 03:17 AM   #64
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Why are you sending him PMs?
He sent me one, I replied and he neve got back to me, I've been stood up!
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      12-13-2011, 04:26 AM   #65
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I agree winter can feel less grippy in warmer weather, but they are so progressive in the way they slide gradually and gently, still clawing away.

Most importantly they regain their grip quickly but controllably when you back off or correct.

This is what summers DO NOT do in cold weather as they are so jeckyl & hyde grip / no grip, once they've sliding you're shagged.
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      12-13-2011, 06:53 AM   #66
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Whats a decent set of winter tyres then?
baring in mind is christmas and i dont control the money during this period!
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