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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > General E90 Sedan / E91 Wagon / E92 Coupe / E93 Cabrio > THE MOST RECKLESS BMW DEALERSHIP IN THE USA... and their lawyers..



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      01-04-2012, 01:04 PM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phil_ View Post
Like others have said, if no one is taking this seriously, lighting this fire should:

https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/
OP, you should most certainly bring this to NHTSA's attention. Not because they will do anything about the Penske situation, but because this failure mode of the active steering is something that really needs to be investigated.

I am assuming that everything you've told us is very close to the truth. That is, you haven't done any modification to the car that have even a remote chance of causing this steering failure. As long as this is the case, make a formal complaint to NHTSA.
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      01-04-2012, 01:25 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by arguru View Post
Just posted to reddit, here's the short link below:

http://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comment...in_the_united/

http://redd.it/o26bs

Hopefully this picks up some mainstream traction

upvoted. also you might want to cross-post to /r/autos
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      01-04-2012, 01:32 PM   #135
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Can't believe what you're having to go through here. No dealer in the BMW network should deal with people like this. You clearly are a perfectly reasonable person just trying to get their car fixed so that it's not a potential death trap. The way they've treated you is a joke and you and your lawyer must aggressively go after that dealership.

You could have been killed or potentially killed other innocent people had the system failed at the wrong time.

This story parallels many stories I've heard from Mercedes owners. The reputation of Mercedes was sewered because they pissed off so many people by not taking responsibility and correcting a problem that they were obligated to fix. By denying responsibility they got exactly what they deserved. They used to be the #1 luxury automotive brand. Now they're barely clinging to 3rd with Audi on pace to surpass them in the next 5 years.
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      01-04-2012, 02:48 PM   #136
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I wonder how the Penske BMW dealership would like to contend with 119,000 e-mails from E-90 Post members? Thats just one from each member, not counting guests who might like to jump in on the project.
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      01-04-2012, 02:52 PM   #137
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Propagator,

Everything said has been 100% truth and I can back it up if Penske wants to actually come forward and challenge ANY of this instead of just repeatedly ducking my calls and emails.

There have been zero mods done to the car other than minor exterior (ie. upgraded wheels/tires, blackout grill, aero lip, LED halos). Nothing that could cross with anything to cause this type of scenario.

I filed the complaint, although it won't do anything for my personal situation is irrelevant. My main reason for fighting this battle is principle. I find it beyond comprehension that a publicly traded company such as Penske would look past such a critical issue and even worse that BMWNA would rather play the blame game with Penske as opposed to really taking a decent look into what happened here. I got out of the situation safely but the next driver may not have the same luck.

And as always, thank you for the support. I will continue to fight this battle until proper recourse is taken... less likely in a court of law but more in the court of public opinion, where I feel it matters most.
arguru, I applaud your decision to continue this fight, which must come at non-negligible personal cost to you. But I agree 100% that this matter needs attention at many different levels.

I don't know if you've done this already, but since you are investing your time on this, you might as well write up a nice and concise summary of the situation that we can easily lift and post in other forums that we frequent. Posting a link to a long thread is rarely the best way to get attention. It would be very nice to have a few professional sounding paragraphs that explains the situation in a chronological manner, which can then be an introduction to this thread. Something to think about.
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      01-04-2012, 02:53 PM   #138
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I read a lot of the thread, in your OP, it doesn't say if you had active steering or not. Was it an Active Steering system and was that what caused the failure?

Uh oh. If so.
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      01-04-2012, 03:13 PM   #139
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Did anyone else read some of arguru's other posts?

Is it ok to put my car on blocks? http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=626795

AutoLogic FAIL... http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=604319

Seems like he has been messing with the coding, and using blocks to change his tires after an "accident" where he bent both front wheels.
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      01-04-2012, 03:21 PM   #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjg View Post
Did anyone else read some of arguru's other posts?

Is it ok to put my car on blocks? http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=626795

AutoLogic FAIL... http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=604319

Seems like he has been messing with the coding, and using blocks to change his tires after an "accident" where he bent both front wheels.
Seems like your digging for something. He asked a few question, nothing indicates that anything was done. Are you affiliated with a dealership. Sure sounds like it. And coding is not related to his issue. Besides, any of the investigative work that has been done would have identified any of the points you are trying to make and would have been delt with at that time.
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      01-04-2012, 03:27 PM   #141
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Seems like your digging for something. He asked a few question, nothing indicates that anything was done. Are you affiliated with a dealership. Sure sounds like it. And coding is not related to his issue. Besides, any of the investigative work that has been done would have identified any of the points you are trying to make and would have been delt with at that time.
Wait, but I would be curious to know what the nature of this "accident" was. After all, we are talking about a catastrophic failure of the steering system.
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      01-04-2012, 03:29 PM   #142
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Quote:
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Wait, but I would be curious to know what the nature of this "accident" was. After all, we are talking about a catastrophic failure of the steering system.
I agree, but that would be part of the vehicle history and they would have ruled that out right away and this situation would not have gotten this far.
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      01-04-2012, 03:46 PM   #143
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Quote:
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The rim bend was from various LARGE pot holes/crevices on the shoulder of the freeway that I had no choice but to run over at a high rate of speed at an odd angle due to the steering loss issue.
Well now we get some more information, which was never divulged from my readings. You didn't hit any of these pot holes/crevices, which were large enough to damages both wheels (and possibly some active steering components) before you experienced the steering loss issue did you?

This would also explain why the car had to be towed. As arguru stated before that there was no damage for the "incident".

Just musing...
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      01-04-2012, 03:53 PM   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjg View Post
Well now we get some more information, which was never divulged from my readings. You didn't hit any of these pot holes/crevices, which were large enough to damages both wheels (and possibly some active steering components) before you experienced the steering loss issue did you?

This would also explain why the car had to be towed. As arguru stated before that there was no damage for the "incident".

Just musing...
I would think the complete lack of steering would sooner explain why the car had to be towed.
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      01-04-2012, 03:57 PM   #145
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I would think the complete lack of steering would sooner explain why the car had to be towed.
Well arguru stated that he drove, however briefly, the car after the "incident" and before the cars what fixed. I would think steering would be needed for that.
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      01-04-2012, 03:59 PM   #146
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjg View Post
Did anyone else read some of arguru's other posts?

Is it ok to put my car on blocks? http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=626795

AutoLogic FAIL... http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=604319

Seems like he has been messing with the coding, and using blocks to change his tires after an "accident" where he bent both front wheels.
Even if this was the cause it doesnt explain why the dealership would clear the codes and state it was an emissions thing and let him go without checking what might be the actual cause. What the dealership did was just plain wrong IMO.
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      01-04-2012, 04:02 PM   #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjg View Post
Well arguru stated that he drove, however briefly, the car after the "incident" and before the cars what fixed. I would think steering would be needed for that.
No he didn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by arguru
Luckily, I made it through 3 lanes of traffic and came to a safe stop on the right shoulder of the freeway. Called BMW SOS and got a nice little malfunction error (FML). Called my insurance company and had it towed on a flat bed.
I know you're playing devil's advocate, but ya' gotta try harder
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      01-04-2012, 04:14 PM   #148
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Quote:
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No he didn't.


I know you're playing devil's advocate, but ya' gotta try harder
Well he actually did, after he threw a fit about not getting a BMW loaner...

Quote:
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At that point I'm done being nice, I take the write up slip, walk into the GM's office and tell him to shove it up his ass. He calls for security, I tell him not to bother, I'm leaving anyways.

I get my car from the lot where it was dropped off. drive it a short distance at about 2mi an hour to a connected parking lot and call USAA to tow it back home. There was no way I was leaving my car with them.
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      01-04-2012, 04:16 PM   #149
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Propagator,

The "accident" I was referring to was the actual incident on the freeway. Read my response above. Cross check the dates of the posts, they will match up accordingly.

Also the reason I put the word accident in quotes was because even at that time, my steering failure issue was a well known topic on the forum, so I assumed when I wrote "accident", that most people reading the post would know what I was referring to.
Thanks for the clarification arguru. In hindsight, that should've been obvious. Please understand that while many of us support your cause, some of us probably maintain a small dose of skepticism as well, only because this is, after all, internet.
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      01-04-2012, 04:21 PM   #150
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I"m still stunned that nobody from BMW of Scottsdale or from BMWNA hasn't just done the logical thing, which is to step forward and fix the problem. Very odd that they would let it snowball like this.
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      01-04-2012, 04:23 PM   #151
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Well he actually did, after he threw a fit about not getting a BMW loaner...
Alright fine, arguru must have caused this issue by putting his car on blocks after the incident, that or he caused a failure in the steering system by being unable to have his aftermarket headlights coded.

That makes way more sense than a failure of his car occurred after the dealer just cleared an error code instead of investigating the cause of the error code and then after arguru didn't die when his active steering failed the Penske dealer is trying to cover their asses and BMW NA is taking their side instead of his.
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      01-04-2012, 04:27 PM   #152
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Alright fine, arguru must have caused this issue by putting his car on blocks after the incident, that or he caused a failure in the steering system by being unable to have his aftermarket headlights coded.

That makes way more sense than a failure of his car occurred after the dealer just cleared an error code instead of investigating the cause of the error code and then after arguru didn't die when his active steering failed the Penske dealer is trying to cover their asses and BMW NA is taking their side instead of his.
I'm not sure why you are taking this so personally. You seem to believe, without any doubt, arguru's story. That is great for you. I have brought up some points of concern in arguru's story, some of which have now been answered.
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      01-04-2012, 04:31 PM   #153
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I'm not sure why you are taking this so personally. You seem to believe, without any doubt, arguru's story. That is great for you. I have brought up some points of concern in arguru's story, some of which have now been answered.
I'm not taking it personally, I'm just saying there is being skeptical and there is being a contrarian. He keeps answering your skepticism and yet you continue to take the dealer's side in this.
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      01-04-2012, 04:56 PM   #154
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Can this be escalated to BMW AG?
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