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      01-29-2013, 01:08 PM   #111
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It's a very different way to drive the car at it's limits. You have allot more exit speed/potential but with some care and taking notice of simple hints the car is telling you. I did sub-frame bushings and swaybar (not sure if you did). But the car's allot more oversteer happy, nothing uncontrollable just have to pay attention to it.

If you go into a corner too hot, and feels like the car's drifting out (understeering on you), it's a great sense of control, tapping the throttle and having the car rotate. With an open diff, I could never manage to do this, it'll just spin the inside wheel as you know.

When you're at the apex, or just before, you'll feel the difference in throttle input right away and power to the ground. Car actually glides through those apexes now, it really is something to experience from the Open diff side.
Here's what I did:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=758340

And then:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=784059

Pretty complete setup now. First track event (in the BMW, many track events in other cars) was without bushings/LSD/swaybars.
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      01-29-2013, 02:18 PM   #112
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Originally Posted by DallasBoosted View Post
Here's what I did:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=758340

And then:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=784059

Pretty complete setup now. First track event (in the BMW, many track events in other cars) was without bushings/LSD/swaybars.
BTW, off topic, I've read your comments on here, and other sections of the forums about driving with traction control off. For a vehicle like ours without a stock LSD, this is VERY VERY dangerous. Our car is too prone to snap oversteer. You can drive the car with dsc limited, but as others told you in those threads, it's a bad idea to turn the system off completely. I and even a very experienced instructor have done 360 degree spins in either direction with DSC off. A guy on here who I introduced to the track crashed with his 335I because he ignored this warning, that I gave him in person, at the track.

Just FYI.
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      01-29-2013, 02:23 PM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DallasBoosted View Post
Here's what I did:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=758340

And then:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=784059

Pretty complete setup now. First track event (in the BMW, many track events in other cars) was without bushings/LSD/swaybars.
You did go all out, control arms are in the near future for me, trying to get the hang of the car, feel the difference, then I'll do those.

You should have a pretty nice handling setup.
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      01-29-2013, 02:26 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by yandy View Post
It's a very different way to drive the car at it's limits. You have allot more exit speed/potential but with some care and taking notice of simple hints the car is telling you. I did sub-frame bushings and swaybar (not sure if you did). But the car's allot more oversteer happy, nothing uncontrollable just have to pay attention to it.
This is why I'm not doing the rear sway bars. The difference between our F/R sways, and the M3's is not that much at all. Like the rumors on here have it, the rear sways increase oversteer.


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If you go into a corner too hot, and feels like the car's drifting out (understeering on you), it's a great sense of control, tapping the throttle and having the car rotate. With an open diff, I could never manage to do this, it'll just spin the inside wheel as you know.

When you're at the apex, or just before, you'll feel the difference in throttle input right away and power to the ground. Car actually glides through those apexes now, it really is something to experience from the Open diff side.
I saw the differences, when I watched your before, and after vids on PBIR. Wavetrac truely is the best LSD for our cars. I can't wait to put mine in, and hit the track. Mine goes in on the 4th of march, and my first track day is on April 7th. I don't know if I can wait that long though!

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With those miles and if you have the parts, might as well. However, all I did was order the Diff and Axle seals. According to Fred at ER that's all I needed and he seems have been right
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      01-29-2013, 02:39 PM   #115
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BTW, off topic, I've read your comments on here, and other sections of the forums about driving with traction control off. For a vehicle like ours without a stock LSD, this is VERY VERY dangerous. Our car is too prone to snap oversteer. You can drive the car with dsc limited, but as others told you in those threads, it's a bad idea to turn the system off completely. I and even a very experienced instructor have done 360 degree spins in either direction with DSC off. A guy on here who I introduced to the track crashed with his 335I because he ignored this warning, that I gave him in person, at the track.

Just FYI.
I dunno, the car didn't seem that unstable to me before the LSD, and definitely not afterwards.

Of course spins can happen, especially driving it at the limit on the track. Watch a race lately? Those guys crash too.

You aren't going to learn to drive the car with the traction control on. Period.

And to be clear: Don't bring anything to the track you aren't willing to destroy. Use caution and prudence out on the street where conditions are unknown and other people are out there too.

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      01-29-2013, 03:20 PM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Killerfish2012 View Post
This is why I'm not doing the rear sway bars. The difference between our F/R sways, and the M3's is not that much at all. Like the rumors on here have it, the rear sways increase oversteer.




I saw the differences, when I watched your before, and after vids on PBIR. Wavetrac truely is the best LSD for our cars. I can't wait to put mine in, and hit the track. Mine goes in on the 4th of march, and my first track day is on April 7th. I don't know if I can wait that long though!



Thanks
The difference between our front sway and the M3 is not huge, though the M3 is stiffer. But, the difference between our rear sway and the M3 is tremendous. Have you looked at your rear sway? It looks like a spaghetti string, easily bendable with just your hands. It does increase oversteer, but it's not uncontrollable or unpredictable, just need to learn how to drive it that way. It has more potential this way to be faster, but to also spin easier.

It really is night and day with and without LSD. Such a good feeling, I had no idea it'll make this much difference. This is my first car that I track, so had never done events in other cars. I don't know if I can go back to a non-LSD car again.
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      01-29-2013, 04:22 PM   #117
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And to be clear: Don't bring anything to the track you aren't willing to destroy.
This isn't something that you'd realize without actually tracking your car. 90% of the folks in the advanced groups, are driving junkers that they don't give a dam about. They take the most risks and have the most fun. Prior to taking part in HPDE events, you'd think that what you need to have fun at the track is an expensive car like an M3, GTR, or even ferrari. When you start tracking you realize that everyone in the beginning and intermediate group came with their daily driver, which they bought new, thinking it would be a good track car. Meanwhile the guys in the advanced group have a 10-15 year old modded sports car they don't care about.

You don't know the skill level of folks on an internet forum. Most of them, yourself included are really rookies. Even an expert would have difficulty handling a stock 335I when it snap oversteers. Its just bad advice to tell folks to disable the nannies.
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      01-29-2013, 04:30 PM   #118
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The difference between our front sway and the M3 is not huge, though the M3 is stiffer. But, the difference between our rear sway and the M3 is tremendous. Have you looked at your rear sway? It looks like a spaghetti string, easily bendable with just your hands. It does increase oversteer, but it's not uncontrollable or unpredictable, just need to learn how to drive it that way. It has more potential this way to be faster, but to also spin easier.

It really is night and day with and without LSD. Such a good feeling, I had no idea it'll make this much difference. This is my first car that I track, so had never done events in other cars. I don't know if I can go back to a non-LSD car again.
http://machv335i.blogspot.com/2012/0...ts-part-1.html

yes, it looks like it is indeed bigger, however it is hollow, whereas the stock 335I's is solid. I was thinking of going with the hotchicks front and rear sways, but right now, I just want mods that will yield faster times, so I went with nittos, and now the LSD. I'm trying to beat my friends modded M3 dct times this year, which should be no problem since I came real close to his times last year with just the stage 2 tune, and nittos.
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      01-29-2013, 04:35 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Killerfish2012 View Post
http://machv335i.blogspot.com/2012/0...ts-part-1.html

yes, it looks like it is indeed bigger, however it is hollow, whereas the stock 335I's is solid. I was thinking of going with the hotchicks front and rear sways, but right now, I just want mods that will yield faster times, so I went with nittos, and now the LSD. I'm trying to beat my friends modded M3 dct times this year, which should be no problem since I came real close to his times last year with just the stage 2 tune, and nittos.
Guessing NT-01s? That and LSD will def yield better times. I'll stick with RS-3s for now till I shake off a couple bad habits from going R-compound too soon, and no LSD driving. The RS-3s are really an awesome tire, but are not R-compound.
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      01-29-2013, 04:37 PM   #120
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This isn't something that you'd realize without actually tracking your car. 90% of the folks in the advanced groups, are driving junkers that they don't give a dam about. They take the most risks and have the most fun. Prior to taking part in HPDE events, you'd think that what you need to have fun at the track is an expensive car like an M3, GTR, or even ferrari. When you start tracking you realize that everyone in the beginning and intermediate group came with their daily driver, which they bought new, thinking it would be a good track car. Meanwhile the guys in the advanced group have a 10-15 year old modded sports car they don't care about.
I get what you're saying. Thats why I bought an older out of warranty 335. I probably should have bought another C5 Z06 but I wanted something with a back seat this time.

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You don't know the skill level of folks on an internet forum. Most of them, yourself included are really rookies. Even an expert would have difficulty handling a stock 335I when it snap oversteers. Its just bad advice to tell folks to disable the nannies.
And they will continue to be rookies if they don't learn to drive.
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      01-29-2013, 04:45 PM   #121
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Guessing NT-01s? That and LSD will def yield better times. I'll stick with RS-3s for now till I shake off a couple bad habits from going R-compound too soon, and no LSD driving. The RS-3s are really an awesome tire, but are not R-compound.
NT-05s actually. They aren't pure R comps either, but handle the heat without chunking, lopped of 2-3 seconds, and they gave decent street mileage. NT-01s would have to be on dedicated track wheels for me, cus they won't last worth crap for street/track duty.
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      01-29-2013, 05:09 PM   #122
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NT-05s actually. They aren't pure R comps either, but handle the heat without chunking, lopped of 2-3 seconds, and they gave decent street mileage. NT-01s would have to be on dedicated track wheels for me, cus they won't last worth crap for street/track duty.
From everything I've read the RS-3 should be quicker than the NT-05. Have never used them, so can't say, but seems that allot prefer the RS-3 over them, and they're dirt cheap.
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      01-29-2013, 05:11 PM   #123
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From everything I've read the RS-3 should be quicker than the NT-05. Have never used them, so can't say, but seems that allot prefer the RS-3 over them, and they're dirt cheap.
My only knock on the RS3's is the soft sidewalls. I'm constantly playing with the pressures in between sessions trying to find the sweet spot. Next time around I'll probably go back to Star Specs (Z2) or check out the new BFG Rival's.
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      01-29-2013, 05:24 PM   #124
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My only knock on the RS3's is the soft sidewalls. I'm constantly playing with the pressures in between sessions trying to find the sweet spot. Next time around I'll probably go back to Star Specs (Z2) or check out the new BFG Rival's.
I only care about two things: chunking, and reduced lap times. So it's rice tires for me untill I see how anything else handles the heat.
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      01-29-2013, 05:27 PM   #125
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From everything I've read the RS-3 should be quicker than the NT-05. Have never used them, so can't say, but seems that allot prefer the RS-3 over them, and they're dirt cheap.
If somethings cheap, its cheap for a reason, and I started using the NT05's after hanging around the C6 Z06 forums. Those guys swear by em, and won't use anything else. I saw reduced lap times, and chunking resistance. I'm sticking with nittos. I might try toyo proxes R888, but right now that's about it.
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      01-29-2013, 05:40 PM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DSC_OFF View Post
My only knock on the RS3's is the soft sidewalls. I'm constantly playing with the pressures in between sessions trying to find the sweet spot. Next time around I'll probably go back to Star Specs (Z2) or check out the new BFG Rival's.
The new Rival's look very promising, still waiting for more information and or someone to try them out. I know they're not available yet, I think.. but should be good to see what they do. I did have to play with air pressure allot, but seems that 32psi cold around is either the sweet spot, or close to it.

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If somethings cheap, its cheap for a reason, and I started using the NT05's after hanging around the C6 Z06 forums. Those guys swear by em, and won't use anything else. I saw reduced lap times, and chunking resistance. I'm sticking with nittos. I might try toyo proxes R888, but right now that's about it.
Ok, cool, not trying to persuade one way or the other, it's your choice. Just commenting, RS-3 are "cheap" in comparison, but perform better than the expensive RE-11s I once had. Either way, good luck and let us know how it turns out, and hope you beat that time.
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      01-29-2013, 06:12 PM   #127
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I only care about two things: chunking, and reduced lap times. So it's rice tires for me untill I see how anything else handles the heat.
RS3's handle heat really well, extended sessions and no loss of grip. Star specs get greasy after 20 mins or so but the sidewall flex wasn't nearly as noticeable as compared to RS3.
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      02-21-2013, 02:48 PM   #128
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Since it was missed the first time, and I'm a big pain in the butt ...

_____REPOST_______

New contribution to the lap times, and a personal best from one listed before.

Username of car owner: yandyr (yandy)
Driver Name: Yandy
Track: PBIR (Palm Beach International Raceway) - Florida
Configuration: 2009 135i | Cobb | KW V2s | LSD | FBO no Meth |
Lap Time: 1:33.731 - Logged with AIM Solo-DL
Tires: Hankook RS-3 255/40/17

Video of Lap -- Overlay is set to two digit decimal, need to change for future to 3.



Picture of Log



Thanks
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      02-21-2013, 10:03 PM   #129
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Since it was missed the first time, and I'm a big pain in the butt ...

_____REPOST_______

New contribution to the lap times, and a personal best from one listed before.
Good Job Yandy! Nice driving Don't take this a criticism, but I think you left some time on the table there.

1. On 3 corner exits, you hesitate before hitting the throttle. You're probably still getting used your new LSD, and rear suspension

2. In the straights, the car didn't seem to pull as hard (for stage 2+?). Try buying some MS109, and trying out cobb's 100 octane race map.
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      02-22-2013, 08:02 AM   #130
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Good Job Yandy! Nice driving Don't take this a criticism, but I think you left some time on the table there.

1. On 3 corner exits, you hesitate before hitting the throttle. You're probably still getting used your new LSD, and rear suspension

2. In the straights, the car didn't seem to pull as hard (for stage 2+?). Try buying some MS109, and trying out cobb's 100 octane race map.
I def left some time on the table thats not a lie. Little by little getting used to just how much earlier I can hit the throttle.

Not sure if you're familiar with that track, but hitting 145mph on that back straight, I'd say the car's pulling ok. Just to compare, c6 z06 would do about 152 to 155 depending on driver. There were some occasions where heat was an issue, oil specifically.

I bought some Torco to try out, just because buying a bunch of MS109 for a full day of track is $$$$.. lol. Also had PTF do a e85 tune, which that day we were still fine tuning.

Thanks for the feedback and keep bringing it
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      03-07-2013, 03:05 PM   #131
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I def left some time on the table thats not a lie. Little by little getting used to just how much earlier I can hit the throttle.
Yandy, I had the wavetrac put in on monday, and Jesus Christ,! what a difference. I'm hitting the track in 3 weeks, and I was wondering if after wavetrac, you run with DTC ON, partially disabled, or OFF?
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      03-07-2013, 04:12 PM   #132
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Yandy, I had the wavetrac put in on monday, and Jesus Christ,! what a difference. I'm hitting the track in 3 weeks, and I was wondering if after wavetrac, you run with DTC ON, partially disabled, or OFF?
I run with everything OFF, did a couple laps one session to see the difference on just DTC and it's still very intrusive, so OFF is the way to go.
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