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      12-30-2011, 01:48 PM   #1
b21playa
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Thermostat change

Hi all

I have a 330d auto and it is running cool so want to change the main thermostat. I have Already done the egr one

Is there a guide about? I tried to take out the fan, but seems to be catching on something in the bottom right hand corner, looked like oil cooler

Any help appreciated

Thanks
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      12-30-2011, 02:02 PM   #2
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What temp is it running at?
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      12-30-2011, 02:29 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by b21playa View Post
Hi all

I have a 330d auto and it is running cool so want to change the main thermostat. I have Already done the egr one

Is there a guide about? I tried to take out the fan, but seems to be catching on something in the bottom right hand corner, looked like oil cooler

Any help appreciated

Thanks
Thats the same prob i had which is why i am letting a garage do it in the new year, the egr system has to come out because of one awkward nut/screw
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      12-30-2011, 05:32 PM   #4
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Runs at about 83deg and that was on a 120mile motorway run.

I'll check the fan from underneath tomorrow when I jack it up to change the brakes
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      12-31-2011, 10:27 AM   #5
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Runs at about 83deg and that was on a 120mile motorway run.

I'll check the fan from underneath tomorrow when I jack it up to change the brakes
Any luck with it mate?
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      12-31-2011, 03:12 PM   #6
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Quote:
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Runs at about 83deg and that was on a 120mile motorway run.

I'll check the fan from underneath tomorrow when I jack it up to change the brakes
Any luck with it mate?
Bazz

No chance today, although I managed to change brakes, I was called to the hospital so had to do a runna
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      12-31-2011, 03:25 PM   #7
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If I get a chance, I will do tomorrow. I have to bleed the brakes anyway
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      12-31-2011, 04:50 PM   #8
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If I get a chance, I will do tomorrow. I have to bleed the brakes anyway
Thanks - i appreciate it
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      01-01-2012, 09:39 AM   #9
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Runs at about 83deg and that was on a 120mile motorway run.

I'll check the fan from underneath tomorrow when I jack it up to change the brakes
This may be a daft questions, so how do we know what temp the 330d should run at?

Pretty sure mine has run at 84c for last couple of years, which means that was when it was only 2 years old.
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      01-01-2012, 10:04 AM   #10
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This may be a daft questions, so how do we know what temp the 330d should run at?

Pretty sure mine has run at 84c for last couple of years, which means that was when it was only 2 years old.
i know its a different engine but my e60 530d was running 70-80 degrees, after a thermostat change (both thermostats) i was getting a constant 92 degrees.

normal operating temp should be approx 90 degrees, as that is what cars with temp guages normally sit on (correct me if i am wrong)
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      01-02-2012, 05:16 AM   #11
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83 deg on the motorway in this weather is just fine imo......
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      01-02-2012, 05:48 AM   #12
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83 deg on the motorway in this weather is just fine imo......
It seems all the 330d's run around this temp?!
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      01-02-2012, 12:14 PM   #13
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83 deg on the motorway in this weather is just fine imo......
It seems all the 330d's run around this temp?!
Mine runs at 76 max on motorway
Lately, that's why I'm going to order a main stat from stealer in morning and get it changed...as said in previous post any diesel I've ever driven runs at 90
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      01-02-2012, 12:39 PM   #14
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Quote:
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It seems all the 330d's run around this temp?!
Yeah mine runs at around that and I'm happy with it. It's a trade-off with running a thermodynamically efficient engine.

My god, those were some big words I just used there, I've gotta go and have a lie down now :-/
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      01-02-2012, 04:35 PM   #15
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It seems all the 330d's run around this temp?!
The main thermostat is calibrated to open at 88-degrees +/- 5-degrees according to data. This means we should ideally be around 88 - 91 degrees once hot, and no real reason to cool down, once peaked past the opening temperature.

But... it seems we have a lot of engines that quite quickly lose that optimum setting, and settle in the mid 80's. The lads who run the Rover/BMW M47R engine don't have the EGR thermostat, but use the same basic thermostat in a different housing. Their experience is, even with new main thermostats, many will within a few months start tailing off from the 88-90 degree range and settle in the mid 80's. One of their Indy mechanics has changed dozens of them, none are open, but have lost the optimum range. There appears no real explanation, as a wax type thermostat element doesn't normally fail in this mode.

Many of the Rover M47R users are fitting an additional thermostat in the top hose to prevent low running temperatures, poor cabin heating and low mpg.

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      01-02-2012, 05:21 PM   #16
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The main thermostat is calibrated to open at 88-degrees +/- 5-degrees according to data. This means we should ideally be around 88 - 91 degrees once hot, and no real reason to cool down, once peaked past the opening temperature.

But... it seems we have a lot of engines that quite quickly lose that optimum setting, and settle in the mid 80's. The lads who run the Rover/BMW M47R engine don't have the EGR thermostat, but use the same basic thermostat in a different housing. Their experience is, even with new main thermostats, many will within a few months start tailing off from the 88-90 degree range and settle in the mid 80's. One of their Indy mechanics has changed dozens of them, none are open, but have lost the optimum range. There appears no real explanation, as a wax type thermostat element doesn't normally fail in this mode.

HighlandPete
As ever Pete, great background and detail! Out of interst what is the Rover variant...is it a petrol?

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Many of the Rover M47R users are fitting an additional thermostat in the top hose to prevent low running temperatures, poor cabin heating and low mpg.

HighlandPete
so this is the key....how many people are seeing those symptoms if ther 330d are running at mid-80s?

I'm am getting great mpg on a run (high 40s-low 50s) and cablin heating seems quick

But of course could I be getting even better mpg
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      01-02-2012, 05:32 PM   #17
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As ever Pete, great background and detail! Out of interst what is the Rover variant...is it a petrol?
The Rover M47R engine is a 4 pot 2 litre soot-chucker, BMW M47(Rover-ised) basically the 320d engine.
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      01-02-2012, 05:39 PM   #18
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This has got me thinking... when mentioned that after the main stat has been replaced and the temp starts tailing off few months. I presume owners are buying genuine behr parts from bmw.maybe its the construction of the wax inside the stat?

I have been looking on ecp and they seem to stock hella and vemos stats has anyone heard of these brands?
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      01-02-2012, 05:41 PM   #19
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The BMW/Rover M47R is the same basic unit (minus a few tricks) as the M47 320d engine.

So comes as a very thermally efficient diesel engine, and this is part of the reason for the Rover guys wanting every bit of heat from the engine. They have the 'water-flow' auxiliary cabin heater, (like the E46 diesels) so don't get that 'quick heat' we think we have, due to our PTC electric element cabin heaters.

Yes they are putting an in-line themostat in the top hose, the hose that emerges from the side of our M47/57 engines. Just to eliminate waste heat and the thermostats are more accurate than a 'lazy' OEM fitment.

We often think we have fast heating due to our PTC 'electric' auxiliary heating element, but that can mask a poor thermostat at low temperature. Also we have a lot of waste heat on warm up, as the whole expansion tank circuit is heating up as well, all made worse if we have a poor EGR thermostat and the coolant short circuits across the radiator, ahead of the main thermostat opening.

So easy to be running a 'lose, lose' coolant system.

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      01-03-2012, 03:21 AM   #20
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Yeah mine runs at around that and I'm happy with it. It's a trade-off with running a thermodynamically efficient engine.

My god, those were some big words I just used there, I've gotta go and have a lie down now :-/
Think i am happy with mid-80s too. Seems a pita to change the 'stat for a limited/short term benefit which doesn't last anyway
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      01-03-2012, 05:14 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by HighlandPete View Post
The BMW/Rover M47R is the same basic unit (minus a few tricks) as the M47 320d engine.

So comes as a very thermally efficient diesel engine, and this is part of the reason for the Rover guys wanting every bit of heat from the engine. They have the 'water-flow' auxiliary cabin heater, (like the E46 diesels) so don't get that 'quick heat' we think we have, due to our PTC electric element cabin heaters.

Yes they are putting an in-line themostat in the top hose, the hose that emerges from the side of our M47/57 engines. Just to eliminate waste heat and the thermostats are more accurate than a 'lazy' OEM fitment.

We often think we have fast heating due to our PTC 'electric' auxiliary heating element, but that can mask a poor thermostat at low temperature. Also we have a lot of waste heat on warm up, as the whole expansion tank circuit is heating up as well, all made worse if we have a poor EGR thermostat and the coolant short circuits across the radiator, ahead of the main thermostat opening.

So easy to be running a 'lose, lose' coolant system.

HighlandPete
Ok, undertand. yes my 320d did take longer to give cabin heat, but not much longer from memory.

But if the majority of our 30d's are running mid-80s and are still seeing good overall MPG....is this almost the norm in reality (even if running 5% cooler than spec)

What have you done Pete...living with mid 80s or changed the 'stats?
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      01-03-2012, 07:12 AM   #22
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But if the majority of our 30d's are running mid-80s and are still seeing good overall MPG....is this almost the norm in reality (even if running 5% cooler than spec)

What have you done Pete...living with mid 80s or changed the 'stats?
I changed my EGR 'stat last winter as I wanted to ensure I wasn't having slower warm up times. I also wanted to pull one apart and see the mode of failure. Mine was in good condition, just opening a couple of degrees early, when boiled up together with the new one.

I'm in two minds on the main 'stat, would ideally replace, as to run optimum temperatures, has to be the best option. Mine is 1 - 2 degrees lower than a year ago, so in the balance to replace. Just the bother of doing it.

My mpg average is the same long term as the past two years, so not seen a fall off. Warm up times are long, but that is ambient temperature influenced anyway. My car takes about 8 miles of free running (50 - 60mph) to get to 75-degrees at freezing temperatures, (even longer if I don't preheat the cabin before driving). 80-degrees at the same distance at about 10-degrees ambient, identical to last winter. DPF regen's are working fine, and gets into the 90's when a regen' is in progress.

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