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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Powertrain and Drivetrain Discussions > N54 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications - 335i > New HPF N54 Intake Manifold Pics for the 135i/335i/535i



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      01-04-2012, 11:11 PM   #23
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Omg

I just want the gen2 exhaust in quad!!

And this
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      01-05-2012, 12:06 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HPF Chris View Post
We will ultimately be running 40psi so aluminum is required.
jeebus!
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      01-05-2012, 12:08 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HPF Chris View Post
We will ultimately be running 40psi so aluminum is required.
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      01-05-2012, 12:20 AM   #26
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HPF Chris View Post
We will ultimately be running 40psi so aluminum is required.
I just wet my pants a bit. I'd love to hear 40 lbs of boost run through bov on these e9xs
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      01-05-2012, 12:21 AM   #27
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Not to mention I LOVE the purple in the engine bay.
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      01-05-2012, 01:11 AM   #28
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Looks pretty sweet!
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      01-05-2012, 03:07 AM   #29
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Is that getting a Logo? Lol, I like it.
HPF ..... youve done it , people actually will buy your product JUST to have the logo !!!!!!!
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      01-05-2012, 07:56 AM   #30
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Wait, youre going into full production without actually testing this with a presumeably single turbo setup? Or did HPF finish the big single, and worked out injector sizing, pumps lines and logic to control that in conjunction with the existing DI?
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      01-05-2012, 08:40 AM   #31
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About the heatsoak issue, will you have a thin ceramic spacer between the manifold an the motor to alleviate heatsoak?
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      01-05-2012, 08:59 AM   #32
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About the heatsoak issue, will you have a thin ceramic spacer between the manifold an the motor to alleviate heatsoak?
That might affect the efficiency of the fuel injector spray...
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      01-05-2012, 09:33 AM   #33
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Quote:
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That might affect the efficiency of the fuel injector spray...
If the spacer is properly designed, it shouldn't.
We used to do this in the VW/Audi 1.8T crowd to keep the intake temps down.
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      01-05-2012, 09:39 AM   #34
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^same in the honda/acura platforms. that gasket can go a long way in reducing induction temps
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      01-05-2012, 09:47 AM   #35
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Looks to be an interesting 2012. Can't wait to see 40psi!!
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      01-05-2012, 10:13 AM   #36
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Quote:
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Wait, youre going into full production without actually testing this with a presumeably single turbo setup? Or did HPF finish the big single, and worked out injector sizing, pumps lines and logic to control that in conjunction with the existing DI?
They will test it like their clutch...first announce, then install into their shop car, then realize that it does not engage well, then rectify their mistake by producing the first clutch batch with slightly thinner clutch discs...
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      01-05-2012, 10:34 AM   #37
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Not mocking anything here, development is always good. I'm just not entirely convinced about the necessity of this product which cures a problem that is currently non-existant.

Injection pulse width is currently a fueling option which has yet to be explored fully on this platform. Once understood, the probable fueling "limit" (in CONJUNCTION with rail pressure) could be raised from say, 480 to 600. IMO, that is the correct way of approaching this. Port injection adds a huge fueling logic complexity when combined with DI. I'm not sure of the magnitude, but I'm sure as hell it aint easy. Or am I missing something? Feel free to fill in the gaps here.

IMO, I would have liked to see a quick disconnect manifold that would allow quick and easy access to the valves. As well as a quick disconnect for the birds nest screwed beneath the runners.
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      01-05-2012, 12:20 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzu View Post
Not mocking anything here, development is always good. I'm just not entirely convinced about the necessity of this product which cures a problem that is currently non-existant.

Injection pulse width is currently a fueling option which has yet to be explored fully on this platform. Once understood, the probable fueling "limit" (in CONJUNCTION with rail pressure) could be raised from say, 480 to 600. IMO, that is the correct way of approaching this. Port injection adds a huge fueling logic complexity when combined with DI. I'm not sure of the magnitude, but I'm sure as hell it aint easy. Or am I missing something? Feel free to fill in the gaps here.

IMO, I would have liked to see a quick disconnect manifold that would allow quick and easy access to the valves. As well as a quick disconnect for the birds nest screwed beneath the runners.
You're right. At this point, it's all conjecture because nobody has tried to pump more air into this engine than there is fuel supply; (save possibly AR, who state a 530hp from a big turbo on race gas more than a year ago, but we don't know if that was a fuel limit or an air limit.) It's possible that HPF have quietly found those limits and decided that more fuel needed than can be supplied by the factory fuel system. If so, they haven't shown us any evidence of such, and their piecemeal marketing and commentary regarding their upcoming big turbo kit would suggest that they have not yet had an opportunity to find those limits, as it would appear that the key has yet to be turned. (When last he last commented, Chris said they were still fabricating a coolant hard line, so I don't think the test platform was in a state where it could have be used to established any limits as recently as a few days ago.) So... I have my doubts.

However, while there is ostensibly plenty of injector left, and probably plenty of fuel pressure, there's a volume limit somewhere too... and if the stock pump can't sustain volume, it doesn't matter how much room is left in the injectors or how we regulate pressure. While the injectors may have been designed to supply enough fuel to safely operate the car in limp mode with only the low pressure pump, the total volume requirement would be relatively low.

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      01-05-2012, 12:40 PM   #39
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It's been said that stock injectors have been tested to a 2ms pulse width rather reliably. A crude calculation of 800ish hp with that injection window. At those power levels, you'd have much more to worry about than fueling. It's all conjecture at this point anyway.

I hope you're right and HPF did sort out their single. I would think that they'd want to post that beforehand to create stir. Either way, they have been doing some great work with testing the platform.
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      01-05-2012, 12:42 PM   #40
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      01-05-2012, 12:46 PM   #41
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Does Vishnu piggyback support IPW modifications? If not, then there is your answer as to why the secondary fuel injection is needed....
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      01-05-2012, 02:38 PM   #42
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Quote:
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It's been said that stock injectors have been tested to a 2ms pulse width rather reliably. A crude calculation of 800ish hp with that injection window. At those power levels, you'd have much more to worry about than fueling. It's all conjecture at this point anyway.
That would be truly GREAT news. Where can I find these test results?
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      01-05-2012, 03:07 PM   #43
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Quote:
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Does Vishnu piggyback support IPW modifications? If not, then there is your answer as to why the secondary fuel injection is needed....
AFAIK, no they do not. They do have the ability to raise fuel rail pressure which in keeping with the stock pulse logic of the DME, will in theory and in tried and tested practise, provide larger volumes of fuel for higher boost, as so many people here are running. Vishnu/BMS can chime in if I happen to be inforrect here. Still not how I would want to go about a solution, with one more thing to go wrong. This supports why piggies have a fuel limit and flashes tend to have a higher limit. A 2nd PI rail is the best option for piggies, espically with all the new I/O comunication ports that the V3 has, but quite complex.

Cobb however has been experimenting with both rail pressures and IPW maps for their flash which would in theory provide an all in one solution for fuel targeting for large singles, negating the requirement for a PI setup. I wouldnt be surprised if they already had something viable. I also wouldnt be surprised if Shiv hasnt been around because hes working on his own solution as well. I always like to see different approaches.

Again, just my opinions.
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      01-05-2012, 04:36 PM   #44
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Quote:
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I also wouldnt be surprised if Shiv hasnt been around because hes working on his own solution as well.
I think Shiv's a lot further into his fueling solution than he lets on. I for one wouldn't sink all this time and money making a one-off turbo kit if i wasn't sure i could fuel it. I'm expecting something big from Vishnu soon.

On the other hand, the HPF manifold would give us the ability to convert to full port injection mode on a certain map and get rid of our carbon buildup headache!
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