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BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > BMW E90/E92/E93 3-series General Forums > General E90 Sedan / E91 Wagon / E92 Coupe / E93 Cabrio > BMW 3 Series E90: Can the BMW E90 ECU clock be wrong?



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      01-14-2012, 07:35 PM   #1
Muns
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BMW 3 Series E90: Can the BMW E90 ECU clock be wrong?

Hi guys, I really need some help here.

My BMW 330 E90 model was stolen 6 months ago. Some of the investigation results that were given back to me from the insurance company are wrong, but I dont know how I can prove so.

I was given the key fob information by the insurance company. The reports gave back details of the usage of the car, including the last use of time and date.

The information I recieved from their investigation reports are wrong as the time where the key was alleged to be used, it was in my possession at home.

Please advise me - my car has never been serviced by a BMW dealership in the 3 and half years I have owned it, nor has it been connectted to a diogonstic stick to any software source.

In the time of me owning my car, it has been replaced with a new battery due to the current one was in constant drainage.

The only work done to the car in my ownership is simple services. I was told that the key fob information could be wrong because of the internal cluster system or the car ECU set wrong.

The key fob gets the date and timestamp from the instrument cluster ECU unit. The cluster gets its information from the customer setting the date and time in the radio. If it has been set it incorrectly at any point it would be wrong in the key (like when the battery would have been changed, the information would have been reset).

or

The key fob gets the date and timestamp from the ECU unit. The ECU unit gets its timing and date information from the last software update or engine diagnose synchronization from an external computer source, which sets the date and time. If it has been reset by the battery power being taken out of the engine for more than 20 mins, the clock would be reset and would store incorrect information.


I know one of these sources are correct but I need to prove to the company how and why the key fob information could be wrong.

Please can you advise me someone?
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      01-15-2012, 12:54 AM   #2
///M Rakete
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The only thing I can tell you is what I observed based on using the key in a key reader as part of purchasing my extended warranty. They key is read to verify the mileage of the vehicle and it needs to have been used in the previous 24 hours (apparently).

I expected the mileage to be that of when the car was shut off the last time driven (the day before). In fact it yielded the mileage of the car that existed when the car was started the last time driven. Of course this was also the mileage of the car when it was shut off the previous time it was driven, a number of days before the most recent drive.

So while I don't know what date the key displayed the mileage number displayed leads me to believe the key shows either the last startup or the next to last shutdown.
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      01-15-2012, 05:38 AM   #3
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There are several questions that arise:

1. There are 2 key fobs - are/were both in your possession at the alleged time?

2. Which of these has allegedly been used? There could have been a third key that had been ordered using your VIN and faked possession proof.

3. How did the insurance company get at the key fob info? From (one of) the car's ECUs or from the key fob itself? In that case, the ECU might have been fooled to think it was one of the correct keys - one of the possibilities to steal the car in the first place, like with the "keyless entry remote trick": http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/1017...-entry-car.htm . You could be home asleep and the thief and his accomplice use special equipment to open and start your car.

4. Do you have comfort access? E.g.: The mileage info on the key fob itself is updated only if the key is plugged in, whereas the car's ECUs will most probably record that info even when it was started using comfort access (don't know for sure).

5. As you already noted, the recorded time does not have to be correct. The mileage is - as long as nobody has faked it. There are a lot of backyard dealers that fake mileage for customers or in their own interest - if they can do it, so can thieves.
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      01-15-2012, 01:12 PM   #4
BMWM.D.
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There is a lot of missing information that we need to really help you out. How was the car stolen? When it was recovered, had it been driven during the time it was missing or was it stripped for parts? How many miles were put on the car after it went missing? Depending on the year of your car, it could have come with 3 keys from the factory (2 remote and 1 spare/wallet key). Do you have all 3 of these? Did you buy the car new or used? Lots of missing info...

As far as key fob data, did you give your key to the insurance company and they had it scanned by a BMW dealer? If so, it will only have the mileage reading it was last used. The time/date stored in the vehicle is based solely on customer input. Meaning whatever is entered manually into the car is what will be read out of the control modules. If the battery went dead for some reason while it was missing (not an unreasonable suspicion), then that data could be wrong. Also, the key reader mileage reading is not always accurate. I've seen them be off by several hundred miles -- even with the key being used on the last drive cycle.

Mileage/KM readings in various control modules would be much more accurate, but proper equipment would be needed to get this info. Even then, I don't think it's possible to link a certain KM reading to a time/date in the vehicle. It could stored a KM reading where a fault was stored (i.e. tempering fault in CAS due to thieves manipulating electronics), but even these aren't 100% accurate. I've seen faults stored in a module that were listed as happening at a higher KM reading than the car actually had. Close enough to help diagnose a problem with the car, but not close enough to use as evidence -- at least in my opinion.

BMW AG might be able to obtain more detailed information if the car were to be tested with ISTA and the data electronically transferred to BMW. They might be able to provide accurate information on key use and KM readings.


This is all assuming the CAS/DME were not manipulated in any way to steal the car. Again, more info needed. Was the car pulled up on a flat-bed and towed away or did someone manage to start it and drive off?
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      05-24-2012, 04:57 AM   #5
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Ok I have the answer you are looking for...

I came across your question on various sites as I have had the same problem with my insurance company.

The DATE and TIME information for the key comes from the date and time set on your instument cluster or Idrive system if you have Idrive. This changeable by you.
If you have Idrive you go into the time and date settings and change it. If you do not have Idrive you you can chage this from your stalk control as shown in this link.


If this information is incorrect then the information on the key is also incorrect.
The information on the key is updated once the car is driven over 30kph.

To prove this we have changed the date and time of the car in May 2012 to January 2016. We drove thee car for 35 miles. We then read the information on the key. The key information said the last time the car had been used was 02/01/2016 yes we where in May 2012

These BMW can be stolen within 1 minute with key a key writing device avaliable from Europe check these links




Unless the vehcile is found how can anyone say the time and date was correct on the vehicle. The time and date inforamtion is changeable by the user or anyone who has access to the car THIS IS NOT A DELAER SETTING ONLY!

I hope this information helps you. There is not alot of inforamtion about his onlnine and even the so called specialists either do not know or do not wnat you to know.

Send me a message if you need any more information. And please let me know how you got on with your insurance company and success in getting paid out?
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      01-14-2013, 11:01 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsd100 View Post
Ok I have the answer you are looking for...

I came across your question on various sites as I have had the same problem with my insurance company.

The DATE and TIME information for the key comes from the date and time set on your instument cluster or Idrive system if you have Idrive. This changeable by you.
If you have Idrive you go into the time and date settings and change it. If you do not have Idrive you you can chage this from your stalk control as shown in this link.


If this information is incorrect then the information on the key is also incorrect.
The information on the key is updated once the car is driven over 30kph.

To prove this we have changed the date and time of the car in May 2012 to January 2016. We drove thee car for 35 miles. We then read the information on the key. The key information said the last time the car had been used was 02/01/2016 yes we where in May 2012

These BMW can be stolen within 1 minute with key a key writing device avaliable from Europe check these links




Unless the vehcile is found how can anyone say the time and date was correct on the vehicle. The time and date inforamtion is changeable by the user or anyone who has access to the car THIS IS NOT A DELAER SETTING ONLY!

I hope this information helps you. There is not alot of inforamtion about his onlnine and even the so called specialists either do not know or do not wnat you to know.

Send me a message if you need any more information. And please let me know how you got on with your insurance company and success in getting paid out?


I'm having trouble with my insurance company also, are there any official BMW document because that's what they want. I've been waiting 3 months already.
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      07-31-2014, 11:15 AM   #7
starvin
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Any more updates/ info on the above posts as I am having real bad problems with my insurance and the Police - to the extent of being arrested and charged with 'the attempt to commit fraud' because the date was wrong on my car. It was stolen, I gave them the spare key which they did a report from and are saying the car has been used since it has been reported stolen.......
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