E90Post
 


MaxcySpeed & Company
 
BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum > E90 / E92 / E93 3-series Technical Forums > Suspension | Brakes | Chassis > Racing Brake Slotted Rotors F/R + Cool Carbon



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      01-06-2012, 08:31 AM   #1
ciomas
Captain
 
ciomas's Avatar
 
Drives: LCI e92 335
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: london UK / 3city PL

Posts: 661
iTrader: (0)

Racing Brake Slotted Rotors F/R + Cool Carbon

Finaly!

All 4 of my Racing Brake two piece rotors arrived just before Christmas

We installed them right after christmas together with a fresh set of cool carbon pads that I had and they were propely bedded.

I have been experiencing some abnormal behaviour though. They seem to work fine when driving around the city. Two days ago I drove across Poland and Germany so I finally got a chance to get it up to motorway speeds. This didn't quite work as was expecting. When going above 160 km/h a mere touch of the pedal would cause extreme noise together with very strong vibration. However the behaviour didn't seem consistent. I thought it got a bit better after driving a few hundred kilometers, but then it would happen again. The only time my brakes behaved like this before was after three hard consecutive laps at the nurburgring..(stock rotors/cool carbon pads/all 6 goodridge brake lines)

I'm pretty sure I am able to reproduce this now. I went for another drive yesterday. I got out on the motorway and got the car to around 180 km/h. First braking was amazing, great bite, great stopping power (60- 180- 60km/h). I tried repeating the procedure straight away and as i suspected just a touch of the pedal made it feel like the brakes were about to fall apart.

At this point I was pretty sure it was temperature related. They only became functional again after at least 3-5 minutes of driving @ 160-180 km/h.
I repeated this a couple of times...

As I've read a few positive reviews praising the RB/cool carbon combo (didn't Mr 5 run this setup as well?) I was quite suprised with my findings. Please correct me if Im wrong- is it possible that due to the rotors being slotted there is more friction between the rotors and the pads which results in much higer temperatures, which the CC pads cannot handle anymore?

Is there a known issue with the CC pads? Could it be something completely different? At the moment driving around the city is possible, but anything above 100km/h is scary to say the least.

Please let me know what your thoughts are.

Michal
__________________
Öhlins//Swift//M3 front suspension//M3 subframe bushes//Quaife LSD//AR Design Catless//Forge Intercooler//Alcon BBK//Goodridge//AFE//RPI//Fenders//JB4 Stage 2

ciomas is offline   Poland
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 12:16 PM   #2
GaryS
Colonel
 
Drives: 2009 135i 6MT
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Maryland

Posts: 2,089
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 135i  [3.25]
Two things about this:

1. Lots of people complain about vibration problems with Cool Carbons. My experience is that using these pads without thorough bedding-in causes deposits, and that very hard braking when the pads are cold also causes deposits. So far I've always been able to resolve the problem by going through Cool Carbon's elaborate bedding-in instructions one more time.

2. Racing Brakes specifically warns about less aggressive street/track pads:

Quote:
Since our disc material is has a higher hardness level than OE or other manufacturers' rotors, the same racing pads (brands such as Carbotech or Ferodo) that may have worked great on your original rotors may not work well on our rotors. These pads, commonly used by weekend racers, are affordable but are often not aggressive enough to be used with our rotors. Using these types of pads on RB rotors may result in pad deposit at high temperatures, and/or an unsatisfactory "bite" on the rotor at low temperatures.
GaryS is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 02:53 PM   #3
Syndicategt
Brigadier General
 
Syndicategt's Avatar
 
Drives: 335i
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Nor Cal

Posts: 3,732
iTrader: (11)

Cool Carbon pads are TRASH! Just about everyone I know who uses them hard has experienced horrible brake judder. I felt like I was going to crash into a wall and die the last time I had them on the track, and I had to pit after 2 or 3 laps (it was so bad my instructor didn't want to go back out with me - we used his car instead). I went back to stock and tossed them in the trash can, waste of $250 for s/t pads, they should be called "street only pads" IMO. I was really excited to ge them after I read Mr 5's review, not sure if he recieved free pads or what, but they don't hold up at the track. Before vendors come on here bashing me and saying "other customers love them", they were bedded in properly on my car and the other car at the track that day. They are OK for easy daily driving, they did reduce dust a little bit over stock, but that's about all they are good for and I still get judder on ocasions. Go get yourself some good Hawk pads, my opinion, anything with the word street in the pads name should be left off the track.

- Hey Gary, CC's elaborate bed process has you turn off ABS. I was told mine were bedded wrong because of this, funny thing is we can't turn our ABS off
__________________
2008 BMW 335i e90 - Sold - Rob Beck Turbos / PROcede V5 / Aquamist HFS-4 / AR Downpipes / AE Exhaust / ER Comp FMIC / ER CP / TiAL BOV / Custom Intake / RPI Scoops / Quaife LSD / Swift-Koni Coilovers / DSS HS / Morr VS8.2 Sig Black / Michelin PSS / P3 Boost Guage / M3 body / M3 steering wheel / Adam's Rotors / Hawk HPS / SS lines /

Last edited by Syndicategt; 01-06-2012 at 02:59 PM.
Syndicategt is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 03:41 PM   #4
e90pilot
Freight Dawg
 
e90pilot's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 325i
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Oakland, CA

Posts: 2,088
iTrader: (3)

You can bed your brakes with ABS on, just don't activate it. You can brake plenty hard and not activate ABS. Also, if you disable ABS and manage to lock a wheel, that's basically the same thing as stopping with the brakes applied. No bueno if you're bedding pads.
__________________
--Marcelo
'06 Arctic Metallic 325i | Sport Package | 6MT | Dinan Stage III suspension | Dinan exhaust | 330i manifold swap! Click here! | Active Autowerke tune | 135i Brake Calipers | Deiselboost caliper brackets | E46 M3 front rotors
e90pilot is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 04:13 PM   #5
Syndicategt
Brigadier General
 
Syndicategt's Avatar
 
Drives: 335i
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Nor Cal

Posts: 3,732
iTrader: (11)

Quote:
Originally Posted by e90pilot View Post
You can bed your brakes with ABS on, just don't activate it. You can brake plenty hard and not activate ABS. Also, if you disable ABS and manage to lock a wheel, that's basically the same thing as stopping with the brakes applied. No bueno if you're bedding pads.
You probably remember my horrible experience at Thunderhill last year
__________________
2008 BMW 335i e90 - Sold - Rob Beck Turbos / PROcede V5 / Aquamist HFS-4 / AR Downpipes / AE Exhaust / ER Comp FMIC / ER CP / TiAL BOV / Custom Intake / RPI Scoops / Quaife LSD / Swift-Koni Coilovers / DSS HS / Morr VS8.2 Sig Black / Michelin PSS / P3 Boost Guage / M3 body / M3 steering wheel / Adam's Rotors / Hawk HPS / SS lines /
Syndicategt is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 04:20 PM   #6
GaryS
Colonel
 
Drives: 2009 135i 6MT
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Maryland

Posts: 2,089
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 135i  [3.25]
Haha, I don't think Cool Carbons are trash. I've done 21 track days on them and haven't had any problems. If I start getting some vibration and it doesn't go away by the end of my run, I just bed in again, and that always fixes it.

About ABS, you don't need to threshold brake to do the bedding in. You should start with moderate braking and work up to hard braking but not threshold. If you slip up and activate the ABS, just let them cool for ten minutes and start over again.

That said, true race pads like Hawk DTC series are much better if you're willing to swap them in and out for every event. But Hawk HPS or HP+ are not better.
GaryS is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 04:29 PM   #7
beneliezer
Captain
 
Drives: 2006 BMW 325i
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Upstate NY

Posts: 637
iTrader: (0)

I have cool carbon pads and brake performance slotted/drilled rotors.

I miss my OEM brakes. Yeah the dust was ridiculous but at least it didn't feel like I was braking a semi.
__________________
['06 325i TiAg] [19" VMR VB3 HYPERBLACK] [Blacklines] [OEM Xenon Conversion] [35% Tint] [M-Tech Rear] [M-Tech Front] [Black Vinyl Roof] [Slotted/Drilled Rotors, Cool Carbon Pads] [PBX]
beneliezer is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 08:19 PM   #8
ciomas
Captain
 
ciomas's Avatar
 
Drives: LCI e92 335
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: london UK / 3city PL

Posts: 661
iTrader: (0)

I dont think the cool carbons are as rubbish as some of you say, ive had some very good experience with them, both atthe track and atacking mountain passes- but that was on stock rotors. Either way this should not be happening. What I described above happens after one/two high speed brakings on the motorway. This isnt even close to track conditions..

I need a pad I can live with on a daily basis. Id rather replace my pads more often than switch before every event. Aren't Hawk DTC 60/70 a track specific application?
__________________
Öhlins//Swift//M3 front suspension//M3 subframe bushes//Quaife LSD//AR Design Catless//Forge Intercooler//Alcon BBK//Goodridge//AFE//RPI//Fenders//JB4 Stage 2

ciomas is offline   Poland
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 08:35 PM   #9
e90pilot
Freight Dawg
 
e90pilot's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 325i
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Oakland, CA

Posts: 2,088
iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ciomas View Post
I dont think the cool carbons are as rubbish as some of you say, ive had some very good experience with them, both atthe track and atacking mountain passes- but that was on stock rotors. Either way this should not be happening. What I described above happens after one/two high speed brakings on the motorway. This isnt even close to track conditions..

I need a pad I can live with on a daily basis. Id rather replace my pads more often than switch before every event. Aren't Hawk DTC 60/70 a track specific application?
Yes they are track only. They work poorly when cold. They need to be warmed up. That's why they're track only.
__________________
--Marcelo
'06 Arctic Metallic 325i | Sport Package | 6MT | Dinan Stage III suspension | Dinan exhaust | 330i manifold swap! Click here! | Active Autowerke tune | 135i Brake Calipers | Deiselboost caliper brackets | E46 M3 front rotors
e90pilot is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 09:31 PM   #10
BLKLYZ
Colonel
 
BLKLYZ's Avatar
 
Drives: BSM 335i E92
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: FT. Bragg, NC.

Posts: 2,180
iTrader: (12)

Garage List
2007 335i  [4.50]
Cool Carbons ruined my first set of c/d rotors! I replaced with new c/d rotors and factory brake pads, way much better!
__________________
OSS AE's/LCI Tails/R1 Concepts C/D Rotors/ER CP/UR CAI/Vossen CV3's/H&R Sports/Koni Yellows/M3 bits
BLKLYZ is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-10-2012, 06:01 PM   #11
HP Autosport
 
Drives: E82 1M
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Barbara, AST, Brembo, Eibach, H&R, GIAC, Koni, Quaife, Stoptech, Vorshlag,

Posts: 10,829
iTrader: (29)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLKLYZ View Post
Cool Carbons ruined my first set of c/d rotors! I replaced with new c/d rotors and factory brake pads, way much better!
It's tough to beat the oem pads if you don't mind the dust. Very few street brake pads out there are actually better in terms of braking performance and noise.
HP Autosport is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-11-2012, 01:53 AM   #12
HAQ
Lieutenant
 
HAQ's Avatar
 
Drives: Fast
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Dallas

Posts: 554
iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by HP Autowerks View Post
It's tough to beat the oem pads if you don't mind the dust. Very few street brake pads out there are actually better in terms of braking performance and noise.
True, I do swear by my HPS pads though. Much better braking than stock with far less dust.
__________________
[size="2"]335 E92 Space Gray/Coral/Aluminum/6MT
HAQ is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-13-2012, 01:27 PM   #13
David1
Colonel
 
David1's Avatar
 
Drives: 09 E92 09 X5
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: City With No Room For Ludicris Speed!

Posts: 2,378
iTrader: (0)

My cool carbon pads suck also.
__________________
2009 335i CoupeLBM - Black Dakota/Glacier aluminum-6spd|Nav|M-Sport|Premium|Logic7|Heated Seats|CA|BMW Performance Suspension & M3 Control Arms|M3 lip spoiler
2009 X5 3.0-AW-Black Dakota/Bamboo|Premium|Tech|Cold Weather|Ipod Rear Climate|

07 335 coupe - Sold
07 X3 - Sold
David1 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-17-2012, 02:36 PM   #14
will.c
Lieutenant
 
will.c's Avatar
 
Drives: E46M
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Central Jersey

Posts: 538
iTrader: (5)

Hmm... I just installed Cool Carbons, and I really can't tell if they suck yet. I did notice that they are a bit less grabby than the stock pads, though I won't know if this is good or bad until I take it to the track.
will.c is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-17-2012, 03:59 PM   #15
HAQ
Lieutenant
 
HAQ's Avatar
 
Drives: Fast
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Dallas

Posts: 554
iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by wonho View Post
Hmm... I just installed Cool Carbons, and I really can't tell if they suck yet. I did notice that they are a bit less grabby than the stock pads, though I won't know if this is good or bad until I take it to the track.
CC's are not track pads, they will fade easily and you will use up most of the material after several sessions.
__________________
[size="2"]335 E92 Space Gray/Coral/Aluminum/6MT
HAQ is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-17-2012, 04:39 PM   #16
Syndicategt
Brigadier General
 
Syndicategt's Avatar
 
Drives: 335i
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Nor Cal

Posts: 3,732
iTrader: (11)

Quote:
Originally Posted by quattrosaint View Post
CC's are not track pads, they will fade easily and you will use up most of the material after several sessions.
Not to mention they glaze over and can crack easily. Leave them off the track, I found out the hard way and nearly killed myself, it was only light track use and lost braking power on only my 2nd lap(I was not the only CC pad user to have issues that day). Use the CC's for daily driving and swap out with track pads (or OEM).
__________________
2008 BMW 335i e90 - Sold - Rob Beck Turbos / PROcede V5 / Aquamist HFS-4 / AR Downpipes / AE Exhaust / ER Comp FMIC / ER CP / TiAL BOV / Custom Intake / RPI Scoops / Quaife LSD / Swift-Koni Coilovers / DSS HS / Morr VS8.2 Sig Black / Michelin PSS / P3 Boost Guage / M3 body / M3 steering wheel / Adam's Rotors / Hawk HPS / SS lines /

Last edited by Syndicategt; 01-17-2012 at 05:34 PM.
Syndicategt is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-17-2012, 05:19 PM   #17
EAS
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
EAS's Avatar
 
Drives: VF620 M3
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Anaheim, CA

Posts: 5,693
iTrader: (10)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryS View Post
Haha, I don't think Cool Carbons are trash. I've done 21 track days on them and haven't had any problems. If I start getting some vibration and it doesn't go away by the end of my run, I just bed in again, and that always fixes it.

About ABS, you don't need to threshold brake to do the bedding in. You should start with moderate braking and work up to hard braking but not threshold. If you slip up and activate the ABS, just let them cool for ten minutes and start over again.

That said, true race pads like Hawk DTC series are much better if you're willing to swap them in and out for every event. But Hawk HPS or HP+ are not better.
+1 – We have had very good experience with CC Pads both on the street and on the track; some have noted vibration issues which BTW we have not experienced and generally which can be resolved thru proper bedding/re-bedding.

CC does not stipulate turning off the ABS but rather that it is best to avoid activation during the bedding process to avoid localized deposits during the critical portions of the material transfer process. There are some that may prefer the initial bite (grabbyiness) of the OE pads that provide about 20% of full braking capability initially with little/no ability to modulate from 0-20%; We prefer the CC pads which allow a much greater and more linear ability to modulate from 0-20% and 0-100% all the way to ABS. Overall stopping capability has been found by many to be a good increase over OE and with a friction coefficient that increases with temperature.

Several have repeatedly criticized CC pads on the forums and we would suggest that any issues real or perceived from those that have actually used the CC pads be resolved through contacting CC or EAS directly to try and resolve any legitimate concerns.

Quote:
Originally Posted by David1 View Post
My cool carbon pads suck also.
Following the OP original complaint about one year back, CC contacted OP and worked to resolve their issue. The complaint was related to some type of rust color residue build up on the rotor after washing the car and allowing car to set for several days. Several high speed stops were required to remove this residue as we recall. Car was driven on good weather days only and put up in between plus stored during winter months.

This residue was only on the front rotors and only on the outboard side of the rotors as it was indicated that the inboard side of the rotors never got wet during washing. Photos were provided, which did show some surface irregularities, but also that appeared to show only partial pad contact only on the upper/outer rotor surface. Cool Carbon tried to replicate this complaint by repeating the described events on several different vehicles (335i and E46 M3) and also on uninstalled pad/rotor combinations but with no success.

It was suggested to OP to explore the lack of full pad/rotor contact as the calipers had apparently been removed for painting and reinstalled and the car also had been put up or stored for both short and longer term periods. We never eliminated the possibility of the CC pads as a possible cause, but as the OP was not willing to investigate or consider the possibility of contamination on the caliper mounting surfaces during reassembly after painting or that the guide pins could be binding, further investigation by CC was finally placed on hold.

EAS and Cool Carbon are willing to revisit this complaint and invites OP to contact directly but after first checking possible causes of poor pad contact as previously requested.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLKLYZ View Post
Cool Carbons ruined my first set of c/d rotors! I replaced with new c/d rotors and factory brake pads, way much better!
We have found Cool Carbon pads to be quite rotor friendly and we are not aware of any ruined rotors from using CC pads. CC pads polish rotors generally to a nice finish and we have seen rotors easily lasting over 30-40,000 mile with still over minimum thickness remaining.

CC does not recommend cross drilled rotors as they can have a tendency to crack around the drilled holes, holes can fill with friction material and they can warp with heat. We have seen OE C/D rotors warp with less than 10k miles and street driven only and with various pad brands including OE.. Many shops however confuse rotor deposits with warped rotors in order to sell new rotors, when re-bedding or a light cut on a lathe can rectify. Generally OE pads will fade before they will see sufficient heat to cause warpage. The subject of re-bedding to resolve vibration issues has been discussed on many previous occasions and applies to other pad brands as well.

We are presently investigating the original RB rotor issue for possible solution. As RB advises against other brands of pads than their own, it is possible that the NVH characteristics of this rotor is such that not all pads may work effectively including some of the track pads they mention. We checked with Mr 5 who indicated that he did have slight vibration during bedding with CC pads on the RB rotor and that this stopped once sufficient heat was added. He originally tried the RB pads but he decided to go the CC route after experiencing the noise characteristics of the RB pads. His experience may differ from that of others however. Neither EAS or CC had any input as to which pads Mr. 5 choose to use and were advised after the fact as to which pads he tested the RB rotors with. Cool Carbon pads are offered as a street performance pads and have never been represented as a dedicated track pad. Many have used them as a light duty track pad, including ourselves and have been most happy with their performance, but again they are not a pure track pad.

EAS and Cool Carbon suggest that an alternative be considered if one is looking for the performance of a full track pad and you are willing to change out pads before each event plus are willing to put up with track pad characteristics for street usage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryS
Yeah people say BMW has a new pad compound that's better. That's easy to believe, because I don't know how the old compound could possibly get any worse.

Anyway, I'm completely happy with Cool Carbons. They are better than BMW pads in every way - less noise, much less dust, better cold bite, much better warm bite, much easier to modulate, much better resistance to fade. Pixelblue called them 5/5 for street and 3/5 for track. I think that's exactly right.
We have many happy customers and find them to far outnumber those with any issues. Many are repeat customers with various chassis and models and that have previously used many of the other brands of pads that are out there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlanAZ
Cool Carbon reviews:

Quote:
I’m trying to think about how the heck a brake pad can be so good with the first stop of the day and also be so good at the 12th consistent stop from 70-20!
How do they do this?
The secret is a 3 part formula where every part has their own overlapping temperature range. This means that the pads work very well when cold, and continue to work really well at much higher temps without any fading.
Not only is the temperature range so wide, the pads have been known to clock over 40k miles on a single set.

The bottom line is that these Cool Carbon pads really are the ideal replacement pad.
- They are a low dust pad.
- The pad is stable in cold temperatures and temperatures over 1100 deg F!
- It’s a quiet pad.
What more do you want?
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=258143

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=373556

ohh, and a friend says FOL all the time = fact of life
We understand that there is not one choice for any performance product that can make everyone happy. Some may prefer the OE type bite without the modulation capabilities. Others may prefer a true track pads with more aggressive rotor wear characteristics.

We would however be most happy to answer any questions and/or to address any issues and request the opportunity to do so.
__________________
european auto source (eas)
email: info@europeanautosource.com web: www.europeanautosource.com
tel 866.669.0705 | ca: 714.369.8524 | fax: 714.908.1796


Blog | Facebook | YouTube | Flickr | Twitter

Last edited by EAS; 01-17-2012 at 08:10 PM.
EAS is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-17-2012, 05:38 PM   #18
Syndicategt
Brigadier General
 
Syndicategt's Avatar
 
Drives: 335i
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Nor Cal

Posts: 3,732
iTrader: (11)

David,

You guys are a great company and I would not hesitate to purchas from you guys, however, you might want to look into your customers complaints a little closer. You say "several" have repeatedly complained, there might be a reason for that. I understand you are the primary vendor for CC on this forum, but this is a public forum and the "several" people with issues can come on here to speak openly and not just go to the source directly (just like companies like Tire Rack use a customer review section). I gave the pads a fair chance, used them for almost 10,000 miles, I wanted to like them but to my expense they had to go. Maybe I got a faulty set? I'll never know as Waste Management owns them now.
__________________
2008 BMW 335i e90 - Sold - Rob Beck Turbos / PROcede V5 / Aquamist HFS-4 / AR Downpipes / AE Exhaust / ER Comp FMIC / ER CP / TiAL BOV / Custom Intake / RPI Scoops / Quaife LSD / Swift-Koni Coilovers / DSS HS / Morr VS8.2 Sig Black / Michelin PSS / P3 Boost Guage / M3 body / M3 steering wheel / Adam's Rotors / Hawk HPS / SS lines /
Syndicategt is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-18-2012, 10:55 AM   #19
David1
Colonel
 
David1's Avatar
 
Drives: 09 E92 09 X5
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: City With No Room For Ludicris Speed!

Posts: 2,378
iTrader: (0)

I am the one that supplied the photos about the rusting to the rotor issue and the CC guys are the ones that stopped contact with me. They basically by their questions treated me like a dummy and like I don’t know how to do brakes when I have done 500+ over 30 years. As far as looking at the inside of the rotors, that is insulting to me and a waste of my time when the car is not driven in the rain especially on a newer car. Also, I am not the only one with these problems in my area. There is no paint, or contamination on any of the surfaces where the pad ears make contact with the pad carrier and the calipers were painted before the installation of the CC pads anyways (at 400 miles) and the stock pads did not have any issues. The CC pads went on the car at 3100 miles (at the time) and the pins are all fine on a car with 3100 miles. Give me a fxxking brake. The rears also exhibit the same issue, but not to the same degree. To this date the car only has 6700 miles on it. No one should have to worry about getting the pads wet and getting pad impressions / collection of pad material on the rotor even after parking the car after driving it to dry off the rotors. I do not appreciate a vendor telling me that the problem may be due to bad parts on new car. There is no other pad that I have used over the years that exhibits this issue from OEM, Hawk, Axxis, etc. None of my other cars that do get wet in the rain all the time sitting outside and yes I know they get a slight rust layer until driven, but there is no rusting to the rotor / pad impression or the need to re-bed the pads.

I do like the CC pads for the way work over stock for pedal modulation and the slight increase in fade resistance. The correct course of action should have been the offer to refund my money when I return the pads and not assume I am an idiot.

Here are some pics of what my problem is. You guys be the judge. Now when I wash the car I do the rims by hand and do not get the pads wet and no problem that way, but I shouldn’t have to do that.
Attached Images
   
__________________
2009 335i CoupeLBM - Black Dakota/Glacier aluminum-6spd|Nav|M-Sport|Premium|Logic7|Heated Seats|CA|BMW Performance Suspension & M3 Control Arms|M3 lip spoiler
2009 X5 3.0-AW-Black Dakota/Bamboo|Premium|Tech|Cold Weather|Ipod Rear Climate|

07 335 coupe - Sold
07 X3 - Sold
David1 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-18-2012, 05:43 PM   #20
EAS
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
EAS's Avatar
 
Drives: VF620 M3
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Anaheim, CA

Posts: 5,693
iTrader: (10)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Syndicategt View Post
David,

You guys are a great company and I would not hesitate to purchas from you guys, however, you might want to look into your customers complaints a little closer. You say "several" have repeatedly complained, there might be a reason for that. I understand you are the primary vendor for CC on this forum, but this is a public forum and the "several" people with issues can come on here to speak openly and not just go to the source directly (just like companies like Tire Rack use a customer review section). I gave the pads a fair chance, used them for almost 10,000 miles, I wanted to like them but to my expense they had to go. Maybe I got a faulty set? I'll never know as Waste Management owns them now.
Thanks for the kind words and we appreciate your desire to do business with EAS; We agree that everyone is entitled to their opinion and we do have a good deal of positive feedback regarding Cool Carbon pads and thought it a good idea to express this as well. It is unfortunate that your experience was not of a positive nature and we appreciate your trying them and we value all feedback good and bad.

Surface cracking is not particularly unusual with track usage on many pads and glazing on any pad brand is often due to too fast of a bedding process that allows the resin to come out of the pad rapidly causing green fade aka glazing. It is possible this has occurred with others but we are not aware. Glazing is easy to eliminate (surface sanding) but the pads must be removed to do so. We believe the forums are a great venue for expressing product experiences but we believe also that it is fair to represent not only the negatives but also the positives for which we have many for the Cool Carbon product line.

Please do keep us in mind for any/all future needs for which we may be of assistance!

Quote:
Originally Posted by David1 View Post
I am the one that supplied the photos about the rusting to the rotor issue and the CC guys are the ones that stopped contact with me. They basically by their questions treated me like a dummy and like I don’t know how to do brakes when I have done 500+ over 30 years. As far as looking at the inside of the rotors, that is insulting to me and a waste of my time when the car is not driven in the rain especially on a newer car. Also, I am not the only one with these problems in my area. There is no paint, or contamination on any of the surfaces where the pad ears make contact with the pad carrier and the calipers were painted before the installation of the CC pads anyways (at 400 miles) and the stock pads did not have any issues. The CC pads went on the car at 3100 miles (at the time) and the pins are all fine on a car with 3100 miles. Give me a fxxking brake. The rears also exhibit the same issue, but not to the same degree. To this date the car only has 6700 miles on it. No one should have to worry about getting the pads wet and getting pad impressions / collection of pad material on the rotor even after parking the car after driving it to dry off the rotors. I do not appreciate a vendor telling me that the problem may be due to bad parts on new car. There is no other pad that I have used over the years that exhibits this issue from OEM, Hawk, Axxis, etc. None of my other cars that do get wet in the rain all the time sitting outside and yes I know they get a slight rust layer until driven, but there is no rusting to the rotor / pad impression or the need to re-bed the pads.

I do like the CC pads for the way work over stock for pedal modulation and the slight increase in fade resistance. The correct course of action should have been the offer to refund my money when I return the pads and not assume I am an idiot.

Here are some pics of what my problem is. You guys be the judge. Now when I wash the car I do the rims by hand and do not get the pads wet and no problem that way, but I shouldn’t have to do that.
Neither EAS or Cool Carbon meant in any way to offend; however from original conversations we were aware only that the front rotors were problematic. When CC contacted you they would have had no knowledge as to your experience or expertise and required certain inputs to better understand the situation. I know that they did try multiple experiments trying to reproduce the condition but without success and also tried on several vehicles.

It does appear from the photos that there is better contact at the upper portion of the rotor surface so I would not see the request to investigate the possibility of parallelism as unreasonable and also we were flying somewhat blind at this stage and even new BMW’s can have issues. Thanks for the further input and glad you like the modulation and fade improvements. We have found the CC pads almost impossible to induce fade on street usage.

Again, there was not intent to treat anyone like a dummy and apologies from both EAS and Cool Carbon. Please keep us in mind for your further requirements and feel free to pm with any further concerns.
__________________
european auto source (eas)
email: info@europeanautosource.com web: www.europeanautosource.com
tel 866.669.0705 | ca: 714.369.8524 | fax: 714.908.1796


Blog | Facebook | YouTube | Flickr | Twitter
EAS is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-27-2012, 01:32 AM   #21
LV335i
Private First Class
 
Drives: 2007 335i Sedan Silver
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Las Vegas

Posts: 135
iTrader: (7)

just swapped out my cool carbons...incredibly disappointed! completed the full brake in process and still got crazy chattering!
__________________
'07 TiAg E90|GIAC Stage II/Race|Mr.5's Intake|HPF FMIC|Riss Racing Catless DP's|AE Exhaust|BMS DP Fix|Forge DV|Hotchkis F/R Sway Bars|M3 Bushings|Quaife LSD 3.46 Ratio
LV335i is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-27-2012, 10:50 AM   #22
TMANN
New Member
 
Drives: '07 335i c; '95 M3; '12 X5d
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Yardley, PA

Posts: 18
iTrader: (0)

With all the back/forth on this thread, it's hard for a guy like me (= mechanical newb) to know which way to turn. I will share that I purchased a full set of CC pads for my 2007 335i last October (replacing original OEM pads at 44K), and now have about 3K miles on them, including two HPDE days (Intermediate group). After following the bed-in procedure (apparently correctly) I have nothing but high praise for them on the street and track, for all the reasons mentioned in others' posts.
I now have a decision to make as my front rotors are at "minimum" depth according to my dealer. After reading all the posts above, it seems to me that finding true braking utopia is about discovering the right combination of pads and rotors (not that all calipers are equal either). With the great results I've had with OEM rotors on CC pads, I'm tempted to fatten my delear's wallet ($600 for two front rotors installed) though I long to have a slotted rotor look (and assumed better track performance). The thing is, I can't say on the track I've found myself thinking "I need better brakes" as I'm probably only driving the car at 8/10 (if that).
One day I hope to purchase a BBK and wheels that will show them off, but that $5-10K spend is a long way off as I'm hoping to purchase a dedicated HPDE car (e36 M3).

With all that said, any suggestions on my rotor replacement? (apologies if I've jacked this thread, but seems like a relevant question)
TMANN is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:06 AM.




e90post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST