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      11-26-2011, 10:30 PM   #1
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M3 Suspension Kit with Old BMW Performance Suspension

So, I've had the BMW Performance Suspension Kit sitting in my garage for months now lol. Anyways, I'm ready to pull the trigger on getting the M3 Suspension kit.
My question is are there parts that would not work with this pairing. Here are specs on my car, 2009 BMW E90 335i with sports suspension and currently running Rotiform Wheels19x8.5 on the front and 19x10 on the rears.
I'm ready to get this for my car I just want to make sure I'm getting the right stuff and not getting extra parts that I don't need.
Thanks in advance!!
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      11-27-2011, 11:05 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjollnir19 View Post
So, I've had the BMW Performance Suspension Kit sitting in my garage for months now lol. Anyways, I'm ready to pull the trigger on getting the M3 Suspension kit.
My question is are there parts that would not work with this pairing. Here are specs on my car, 2009 BMW E90 335i with sports suspension and currently running Rotiform Wheels19x8.5 on the front and 19x10 on the rears.
I'm ready to get this for my car I just want to make sure I'm getting the right stuff and not getting extra parts that I don't need.
Thanks in advance!!
might want to start by listing your parts you have or are thinking of getting.
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      11-27-2011, 12:20 PM   #3
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I currently drive a 2009 BMW E90 LCI 335i with Sport Suspension.

M3 Full Suspension Kit
http://www.trademotion.com/partlocat...catalogid=4462

BMW Performance Suspension(old) with BMW Performance Yellow Springs
Part # for BMW Performance Suspension part # 33500429574
Part # for Yellow Springs part # 33536788901 and part # 31336788893

so my question is do i need any other parts to complete this set up and coul di skip some of the m3 components to save some $ lol... Thanks everyone in advance for your help!!
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      11-27-2011, 12:21 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaFish View Post
might want to start by listing your parts you have or are thinking of getting.
thanks for the heads up! I posted above what I currently have to complete this suspension set-up.
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      11-27-2011, 10:11 PM   #5
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Better confirm the 'old' performance kit is compatible w/the yellow performance springs; check w/Tischer. 'Luckyu' made that mistake as have others. My understanding is the 'old' 'original' performance kit was dampers and bumpstops designed to used with zsp springs. The 'old' performance bumpstops are taller and firmer than zsp; I wouldn't pair those with lowering springs. Ride quality will suck..
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      11-28-2011, 12:00 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cvc 22349a View Post
Better confirm the 'old' performance kit is compatible w/the yellow performance springs; check w/Tischer. 'Luckyu' made that mistake as have others. My understanding is the 'old' 'original' performance kit was dampers and bumpstops designed to used with zsp springs. The 'old' performance bumpstops are taller and firmer than zsp; I wouldn't pair those with lowering springs. Ride quality will suck..
Thanks for the heads up with that one. I've been researching and
i've read some where here that pairing the e36 m3's front and rear bumpstops with koni's and yellow performance springs made great results... i might go this route...here is the link on the thread i'm pertaining to...
Although this thread is not about BMW Peformance Suspenion kit i think i can just match the bumpstops that they are talking about with my set up...

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=614778

Rear Bumpstop
part # 33531138109

Front Bumpstop
part # 31332225377

if some one can confirm this it would be great... thanks again guys!
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      11-28-2011, 12:33 AM   #7
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I would consider replicating luckyu's setup instead, but with the aim of a slight drop as well. I may begin this process myself as soon as I have my wheel/tire situation under control.

Begin with the rear:

M3 LCAs (+M3 headlight leveling arms), Bilstein Sport Shocks (M3), E85 Bump Stops, M3 Shock Mounts, M3 Guide Rods, M3 Wishbones

Then the front:

Koni Sport Shocks (non-M E9X), E36M Bump Stops, M3 Control Arms, M3 Tension Struts, M3 Sway

Then the rear again (requires dropping of the subframe):

M3 Subframe mounts, M3 Rear Sway

And if you still have some money left:

M3 Strut Bar

*E46 front guide supports should give a slight additional front drop (not sure if E46M/E85M will fit and/or what they'll provide) and E93 M3 sways should reduce body roll further than regular E90/92M sways.

I'm puzzled by springs. Yellow perf. springs seem like the obvious pairing, but I wonder if H&R Sports/Eibachs will do the same job for half the cost. Then there's the option of swift linears at perfect rates, but I wouldn't want to invest in additional perches/adjusters if the height isn't ideal. They're also pricey.
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      11-28-2011, 12:50 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjollnir19 View Post
Thanks for the heads up with that one. I've been researching and
i've read some where here that pairing the e36 m3's front and rear bumpstops with koni's and yellow performance springs made great results... i might go this route...here is the link on the thread i'm pertaining to...
Although this thread is not about BMW Peformance Suspenion kit i think i can just match the bumpstops that they are talking about with my set up...

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=614778

Rear Bumpstop
part # 33531138109

Front Bumpstop
part # 31332225377

if some one can confirm this it would be great... thanks again guys!
The part to get for the rear is:
33 53 6 770 350
it is from E85 Z4 and is 2.5" long. If you order that p/n, it will come with matching dust tube.

I don't think anyone's using the rear E36 M3 bump stop...
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      11-28-2011, 12:57 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cvc 22349a View Post
Better confirm the 'old' performance kit is compatible w/the yellow performance springs; check w/Tischer. 'Luckyu' made that mistake as have others. My understanding is the 'old' 'original' performance kit was dampers and bumpstops designed to used with zsp springs. The 'old' performance bumpstops are taller and firmer than zsp; I wouldn't pair those with lowering springs. Ride quality will suck..
Yes CVC is right. Everything I know first hand indicates that the Ver.1 kit was designed for ZSP springs. The bump stops were longer; it came shocks only, without springs; Evan said it was for ZSP springs; my experience with the yellow springs was bad.... Ver.1 kit was designed for ZSP springs.

The current kit is a different story, it comes with yellow springs and is designed to be used with them.
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      11-28-2011, 01:22 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yakev724 View Post
I would consider replicating luckyu's setup instead, but with the aim of a slight drop as well. I may begin this process myself as soon as I have my wheel/tire situation under control.
A fine idea, and I'm happy to assist / advise anyone who wants to make a variation or try to replicate what I did.

Quote:
Begin with the rear:

M3 LCAs (+M3 headlight leveling arms), Bilstein Sport Shocks (M3), E85 Bump Stops, M3 Shock Mounts, M3 Guide Rods, M3 Wishbones
M3 rear shock mounts are the same. Be careful with Bilstein's Sport shocks. They are sometimes valved like rocks, and are only to be used in cases of extreme lowering. Stick with the HD's, the M3 rear shock extension is already 1" shorter than the e9x shaft.

How low are you thinking of going Yakev724.

Quote:
Then the front:

Koni Sport Shocks (non-M E9X), E36M Bump Stops, M3 Control Arms, M3 Tension Struts, M3 Sway
The Koni's are much too soft. You will have to get Bilsteins and get them revalved for the M3.

Quote:
*E46 front guide supports should give a slight additional front drop (not sure if E46M/E85M will fit and/or what they'll provide) and E93 M3 sways should reduce body roll further than regular E90/92M sways.
E46 guide supports are 0.18" taller, so no help there.

Quote:
I'm puzzled by springs. Yellow perf. springs seem like the obvious pairing, but I wonder if H&R Sports/Eibachs will do the same job for half the cost. Then there's the option of swift linears at perfect rates, but I wouldn't want to invest in additional perches/adjusters if the height isn't ideal. They're also pricey.
Actually the yellow springs for your 330i may be just the ticket. If you use the M3 HD shocks, since your car is lighter (than the M3) it's OK to go a little higher in spring.

What is the weight and front bias of your car?

Aftermarket springs are highly progressive, they have dead coils! I don't know why you'd want those.

In the rear you'll have to break down and get race springs. It's the height adjuster that costs you. Race springs are cheap.
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      11-28-2011, 02:17 AM   #11
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man this is so confusing...now should i ditch my set up then?? idk what to do... i def want the m3 suspension kit... but since my bmw performace set-up isn't gonna work... what should i get... i want to keep it as oem as possible.. but the new BMW performance suspension kit is out of my range... damn...

Last edited by mjollnir19; 11-28-2011 at 02:22 AM.
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      11-28-2011, 02:23 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luckyu View Post
How low are you thinking of going Yakev724
~0.8-1" from ZSP.

For weight I have 3381lbs with 0.56/0.44 dist, so a slightly higher value than your 328.

Where are you finding the spring info? I remember digging around in ETK for spring tables with no real luck, only part numbers.

I understand your position on shocks, thanks for providing feedback. I think I got myself a bit confused, as I believe the b6 bilsteins are called 'HD' in the US market and 'Sport' in the Euro market. Likewise b8 are 'sport' in US and 'sprint' elsewhere.

I'm curious as to why you had your front shocks revalved? Do you think there may be a potential benefit to having a slightly softer front to rear? Finally, why race springs in the rear? Surely there's a near-equally good match with the proper height? Thanks again. (might be good to move this back to your thread)
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      11-28-2011, 03:04 AM   #13
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so if i wanted to keep what i have... i would need which bump stops??
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      11-28-2011, 01:43 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yakev724 View Post
~0.8-1" from ZSP.

For weight I have 3381lbs with 0.56/0.44 dist, so a slightly higher value than your 328.

Where are you finding the spring info? I remember digging around in ETK for spring tables with no real luck, only part numbers.

I understand your position on shocks, thanks for providing feedback. I think I got myself a bit confused, as I believe the b6 bilsteins are called 'HD' in the US market and 'Sport' in the Euro market. Likewise b8 are 'sport' in US and 'sprint' elsewhere.

I'm curious as to why you had your front shocks revalved? Do you think there may be a potential benefit to having a slightly softer front to rear? Finally, why race springs in the rear? Surely there's a near-equally good match with the proper height? Thanks again. (might be good to move this back to your thread)
I had the Bilstein struts revalved to Bilstein's M3 HD valving, to match the rear. I'm using off-the-shelf M3 shocks in the rear. You could probably get away without revalving, though.

I'm drawing OE spring info from a lot of different sources. I don't know the exact rates but I have data points, and I extrapolate. Vorshlag measured some E90 springs on their spring tester so we have exact numbers for those. Based on the data I have, performance springs for your car would be about 150-160#.

I think though, for the drop you want, it's better to start looking at short body shocks i.e. coilover kits. 1" below ZSP is 13" in front, that's really low, and you just won't have the suspension travel with normal height shocks.

Race springs in rear: I need to choose the exact springrate and ride height. You can't have uncertainty in both front and rear ride height, it won't match. Same for spring frequencies.
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      11-28-2011, 03:47 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjollnir19 View Post
man this is so confusing...now should i ditch my set up then?? idk what to do... i def want the m3 suspension kit... but since my bmw performace set-up isn't gonna work... what should i get... i want to keep it as oem as possible.. but the new BMW performance suspension kit is out of my range... damn...
Wait, you have the old performance kit?? I'm still confused what you have installed on your car now, what you have in your garage, and what your priorities are...

EDIT: All right I went back to re-read your first posts, so, I think to keep it factory it's best to install the performance kit shocks, but not the springs. It's still a good idea in my personal opinion to use the shorter bump stops, but it's your call. If you install the M3 arms, you may experience too much harshness from the 19s.

EDIT (cont.): the reason I say not the springs, is because the old version kit was not designed to be used with the springs.

If your budget is above $2000, and your priority is to get an M3 feel from your suspension, then... click my signature.

If your budget is below $2000, and you'll be happy with a smoother, slightly stiffer ride, I say get a set of Bilstein HDs to match with your ZSP springs.

If you're looking for a way to install what you've already got, and/or keep it as factory as possible -- nothing wrong with that -- then it kind of depends what you have. Do you have the yellow performance springs?

In any case those 19s are going to be a problem, especially with M3 control arms.
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Last edited by luckyu; 11-28-2011 at 03:52 PM.
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      11-28-2011, 04:19 PM   #16
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Is there a reason that the bumpstops that come with the v1 performance kit can't just be trimmed? I have the kit at home as well waiting to be installed, but I will be matching it up with my oem sport springs that are currently on my car.
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      11-28-2011, 05:13 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axis View Post
Is there a reason that the bumpstops that come with the v1 performance kit can't just be trimmed? I have the kit at home as well waiting to be installed, but I will be matching it up with my oem sport springs that are currently on my car.
Well, there are safety and performance issues with trimming. The bump stop prevents several things including coil bind of the spring, and tire rubbing. When you trim, you reduce minimum bump stop height, i.e. the clearance you have in a severe impact, and when you bottom out you may damage something. Probably not, but the risk is increased.

A long stop that's trimmed also won't ramp up the same as a short one. Shorter stops often ramp up (in stiffness) differently from long ones. These things are engineered to give particular resistance curves.

As one person said before, trimming stops is like cutting springs.

If you're looking for a cheap source of bump stops, Ground Control's web site shows a couple versions and they're the cheapest I've seen.

The bump stops I've been recommending / using are probably not perfect either, but I feel better knowing Dinan uses them too. That's why I originally chose them.
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      11-28-2011, 05:38 PM   #18
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yea i'd figure i'd go your route man if dinan uses these then i don't see why my car should be deprived of i... thanks luckyu for the info!!
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      11-28-2011, 07:47 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luckyu View Post
Well, there are safety and performance issues with trimming. The bump stop prevents several things including coil bind of the spring, and tire rubbing. When you trim, you reduce minimum bump stop height, i.e. the clearance you have in a severe impact, and when you bottom out you may damage something. Probably not, but the risk is increased.

A long stop that's trimmed also won't ramp up the same as a short one. Shorter stops often ramp up (in stiffness) differently from long ones. These things are engineered to give particular resistance curves.

As one person said before, trimming stops is like cutting springs.

If you're looking for a cheap source of bump stops, Ground Control's web site shows a couple versions and they're the cheapest I've seen.

The bump stops I've been recommending / using are probably not perfect either, but I feel better knowing Dinan uses them too. That's why I originally chose them.
i'm about to buy the ground control ones too lol i just bought the m3 suspension with the bumpstops you suggested... im so damn indecisive...
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      02-02-2012, 01:30 PM   #20
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Does anyone have the part numbers for the e9x M3 suspension components?

Can you get away with running just the M3 front wishbones on a non M3? I've heard that using the M3 wishbones adds some front negative camber.
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      02-02-2012, 02:18 PM   #21
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^ yea you can
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