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View Poll Results: Which do you get KWV2 or Bilstein PSS9
KWV2 71 53.79%
Bilstein PSS9 61 46.21%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 132. You may not vote on this poll

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      07-24-2007, 10:29 PM   #67
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      07-24-2007, 10:40 PM   #68
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We are getting organized to move to the new shop this week and should be completed by next.

Sent you a PM.
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      07-24-2007, 10:53 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam@AutoTalent View Post
Current KW perches are composite over steel. According to recent factory Mercedes Benz AMG testing, they can withstand 4X the load of standard top quality metal perches. For some applications, they use Aluminum perches in the rear.

Also, KW is the only aftermarket suspension company that is approved for OEM use such as the Mercedes Benz AMG Black Series. KW Coilovers produces to the strict standards of OEM quality and durability. Bilstein has not been able to get to this level.

If they were installed correctly which is suppose to be on top then there should not be a problem There are installation instructions available at www.KWsuspensions.com Click all the way through to the specific model car, click the 'i' then you will see a bunch of icons. It provides all the information there.

Let me know if you have any questions Sam@AutoTalent.com

Both KW V2 and Bilstein are adjustable so if they are not set up according to same specifications/personal preference then that is not a fair comparison.
Doesnt Bilstein come OEM on Porsches? Also like i said plastic to hold the spring just doesnt seem like a good idea. If they wanted to make something better than aluminum or steel they could use titanium, but to go composite is for cost reduction. Also this is from the Bilstein site, "Since our inception over 40 years ago, Bilstein has been a unique and driving force in the automotive suspension industry. From racing and testing in Formula 1, NASCAR, SCCA, Rally, and Off Road to original equipment on BMW, Ferrari, Jaguar, Mercedes-Benz, Porsche, Subaru, Toyota and GM trucks, Bilstein Gas Pressure Shock Absorbers haven proven to be the best". I dont see KW on formula 1 cars just yet... I guess i just trust a company that has been around for 40 years a little more than KW.
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      07-25-2007, 01:49 AM   #70
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We are getting organized to move to the new shop this week and should be completed by next.

Sent you a PM.
I'm expecting a call back as well (BBS's)
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      07-25-2007, 11:51 AM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by down4it View Post
Doesnt Bilstein come OEM on Porsches? Also like i said plastic to hold the spring just doesnt seem like a good idea. If they wanted to make something better than aluminum or steel they could use titanium, but to go composite is for cost reduction. Also this is from the Bilstein site, "Since our inception over 40 years ago, Bilstein has been a unique and driving force in the automotive suspension industry. From racing and testing in Formula 1, NASCAR, SCCA, Rally, and Off Road to original equipment on BMW, Ferrari, Jaguar, Mercedes-Benz, Porsche, Subaru, Toyota and GM trucks, Bilstein Gas Pressure Shock Absorbers haven proven to be the best". I dont see KW on formula 1 cars just yet... I guess i just trust a company that has been around for 40 years a little more than KW.
Hmmm.....well, I guess we could go back and forth and throw nice facts from one camp to the next. However, as everyone has said, to each his own. I have recently installed KWs and I thought about it for a looooong time prior to doing so. One of the main things selling points of the KWs for me was their construction - the stainless steel construction is the bomb. And no, there is no plastic....I believe its lightweight billet aluminum.

I saw an M3 of a friend of mine with PSS9s and he upgraded to KWs. When they took down the suspension, it was corroded in certain places. Comparatively, I've seen the condition of KWs and there is no evidence of corrosion at all - this in a car that had the KWs for the same amount of time as the PSS9'ed M3.

Keep in mind that a very important part of any suspension setup is also the manner in which it is installed. I've heard reports of people complaining about KWs, or Bilstiens for that matter, making noises and not performing properly - the most likely culprit is the install of the system. This is key. That said, Technik/AutoTalent do a phenomenal job at consultation and product install.

Oh, and the KW are much easier to adjust than the PSS9s.
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      07-25-2007, 12:00 PM   #72
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Hmmm.....well, I guess we could go back and forth and throw nice facts from one camp to the next. However, as everyone has said, to each his own. I have recently installed KWs and I thought about it for a looooong time prior to doing so. One of the main things selling points of the KWs for me was their construction - the stainless steel construction is the bomb. And no, there is no plastic....I believe its lightweight billet aluminum.

I saw an M3 of a friend of mine with PSS9s and he upgraded to KWs. When they took down the suspension, it was corroded in certain places. Comparatively, I've seen the condition of KWs and there is no evidence of corrosion at all - this in a car that had the KWs for the same amount of time as the PSS9'ed M3.

Keep in mind that a very important part of any suspension setup is also the manner in which it is installed. I've heard reports of people complaining about KWs, or Bilstiens for that matter, making noises and not performing properly - the most likely culprit is the install of the system. This is key. That said, Technik/AutoTalent do a phenomenal job at consultation and product install.

Oh, and the KW are much easier to adjust than the PSS9s.

Thats cool, i dont doubt AutoTalents expertise, i think they are a great shop and would always go there and recommend them to other people. But i stand by the better product in my opinion, the PSS9's. Just built by a company with a much better reputation and experience.
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      07-25-2007, 08:16 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam@AutoTalent View Post
Also, KW is the only aftermarket suspension company that is approved for OEM use such as the Mercedes Benz AMG Black Series. KW Coilovers produces to the strict standards of OEM quality and durability. Bilstein has not been able to get to this level.


Who told you that, and why did you believe them?

Bilstein are OEM on lots of cars, more than KW even.

BMW, Ferrari, Jaguar, MB, Porsche, Subaru, Toyota and Mitsubishi, just to name a few, have all come with OEM Bilsteins.

I also believe Koni is used as OEM for some manufacturers.
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      07-25-2007, 09:34 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by down4it View Post
Doesnt Bilstein come OEM on Porsches? Also like i said plastic to hold the spring just doesnt seem like a good idea. If they wanted to make something better than aluminum or steel they could use titanium, but to go composite is for cost reduction. Also this is from the Bilstein site, "Since our inception over 40 years ago, Bilstein has been a unique and driving force in the automotive suspension industry. From racing and testing in Formula 1, NASCAR, SCCA, Rally, and Off Road to original equipment on BMW, Ferrari, Jaguar, Mercedes-Benz, Porsche, Subaru, Toyota and GM trucks, Bilstein Gas Pressure Shock Absorbers haven proven to be the best". I dont see KW on formula 1 cars just yet... I guess i just trust a company that has been around for 40 years a little more than KW.
Bilstein provides shocks for many OEM cars including Porsche but not a complete coilover. That was the point that I was trying to make.

Composite is not for cost reduction, MBZ AMG independently strength tested it and concluded that it is stronger so they went with KW which was the only one that passed all their very strict tests.

We are not knocking Bilstein as we offer their products as well. Our preference is KW for many reasons

KW tests on nurburgring which is more street oriented. KW is used on most BTCC (British Touring) cars which are race prepped. Open up any European magazine and you will see KW all over the place and I don't mean advertisements. For the amount of time that KW has been around in comparison to Bilstein, they are doing very well for themselves. Also, KW manufactures the shocks for Eibach coilovers.

We are comparing oranges to oranges which is coilovers to coilovers. Not company to product. Granted the information you provide is correct but does not pertain to the product which is PSS9 to KW Coilovers.

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I'm expecting a call back as well (BBS's)
Shoot me an email Sam@AutoTalent.com with your number

Quote:
Originally Posted by down4it View Post
Thats cool, i dont doubt AutoTalents expertise, i think they are a great shop and would always go there and recommend them to other people. But i stand by the better product in my opinion, the PSS9's. Just built by a company with a much better reputation and experience.
We appreciate that

If you would like PSS9, we have those in stock as well.
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      07-25-2007, 09:35 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadillac Johnson View Post


Who told you that, and why did you believe them?

Bilstein are OEM on lots of cars, more than KW even.

BMW, Ferrari, Jaguar, MB, Porsche, Subaru, Toyota and Mitsubishi, just to name a few, have all come with OEM Bilsteins.

I also believe Koni is used as OEM for some manufacturers.
Coilovers not shocks. Production cars which excludes Ferrari as they are an exotic.
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      07-25-2007, 10:50 PM   #76
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Ok, that makes more sense, you cant say Bilstein is not OEM quality, you should specify next time to avoid miscommunication.

Ferrari's are production cars, every Ferrari where production is not limited, is a production car. F430's, 599's, 612's are all production models, the Enzo was not a production model as it was limited to 399 units. This also would include the 360 Stradale, and the upcoming 430 Scuderia.

This is why the 599GTB is the most powerful production Ferrari ever made.
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      07-27-2007, 06:18 PM   #77
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Bilstein is definitely OEM quality. NO way anyone can deny that.

I thought I did specify but there was a lot of other stuff written at the same time

Ferrari is production especially now but it is not the same as the other big manufactures. McLaren is a production car because they produced 25 or 50 cars
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      07-28-2007, 01:05 PM   #78
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Is the shock adjustment at the top or bottom of the shock?
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      07-28-2007, 03:10 PM   #79
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Is the shock adjustment at the top or bottom of the shock?
On the top for the KW V2
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      07-28-2007, 06:56 PM   #80
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On the top for the KW V2
That was the only PITA part about the bilsteins. Nothing big, but you did need to turn the wheel to one full lock to adjust the first shocks without jacking up the car.
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      08-12-2007, 06:50 PM   #81
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We received a shipment of KW Variant 2's and have them ready to ship.

Let us know if you have any questions.

Email: Sam@AutoTalent.com or PM me
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      08-22-2007, 10:46 PM   #82
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Does anybody have any experience with V1s and how they have those tuned. If the ride is inbetween full soft and full stiff (maybe slightly towards the softer setting) then I would definately just go for those. As far as adjustability goes, I prefer the exact settings of the Bilsteins. I've had a few koni shock setups before (Dinan suspension systems) and while I enjoy being able to adjust them, you always have to be ocd about getting them perfectly matched from left to right. Making marks on the shock towers, counting turns, etc, etc,. I often just put em in the middle and didn't bother to adjust for the track, or roadtrips. Chime in if you have some objective technical info and some subjective ride ratings.

PS:
after reading through this thread, I am amazed at how some members have found it possible to bicker and argue about two great products. People seem to feel the need to quote other's posts and then try to make them feel stupid, or try to look like the suspension guru they want to appear to be. Come on, this thread began so constructively and some of you just can't help but try to bring it down to a level where no one can gain any knowledge about the topic.
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      08-23-2007, 12:35 AM   #83
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Quote:
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Does anybody have any experience with V1s and how they have those tuned. If the ride is inbetween full soft and full stiff (maybe slightly towards the softer setting) then I would definately just go for those. As far as adjustability goes, I prefer the exact settings of the Bilsteins. I've had a few koni shock setups before (Dinan suspension systems) and while I enjoy being able to adjust them, you always have to be ocd about getting them perfectly matched from left to right. Making marks on the shock towers, counting turns, etc, etc,. I often just put em in the middle and didn't bother to adjust for the track, or roadtrips. Chime in if you have some objective technical info and some subjective ride ratings.

PS:
after reading through this thread, I am amazed at how some members have found it possible to bicker and argue about two great products. People seem to feel the need to quote other's posts and then try to make them feel stupid, or try to look like the suspension guru they want to appear to be. Come on, this thread began so constructively and some of you just can't help but try to bring it down to a level where no one can gain any knowledge about the topic.
Welcome to the BMW syndrome. I notice a lot of immature post and rudness on this forum. For some reason this forum has quite a few Aholes and/or young immature kids.

In either case, it rather sucks cause there is some good info. here, but you have to weed thru all the retarded posts to find it. By far the most immature car forum I have been a part of.

Now, you want a class act forum that is fun and has some of the coolest people, go visit Z06vette.com
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      08-23-2007, 12:43 AM   #84
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Welcome to the BMW syndrome. I notice a lot of immature post and rudness on this forum. For some reason this forum has quite a few Aholes and/or young immature kids.

In either case, it rather sucks cause there is some good info. here, but you have to weed thru all the retarded posts to find it. By far the most immature car forum I have been a part of.

Now, you want a class act forum that is fun and has some of the coolest people, go visit Z06vette.com
Audiworld use to be good..now most of the good guys are over at wayot.org
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      09-03-2007, 11:15 AM   #85
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I think most folks are happy with whichever they chose. I haven't heard anyone with KW or PSS9's complain about either. I got KW V2's because I have a wife, and I know that they are a touch more compliant over harsh roads. I was willing to sacrifice some handling for them. Having driven on them for 5k km now I can say that I personally do not think you sacrifice the handling, but do get a slightly more complaint ride. That said, some PSS9 owners do feel they have a better turn in.

Another factor for me was the height adjustments. I wanted to be able to go as low as possible without rubbing, which I do not think I could have done with PSS9's.

I don't think you will be unhappy with either.
My current issue with pss9 is the pro shop told me there isn't much room for raising the rear springs. Most people think the rear drop is too low. Though I have not faced any rubbing issues, but there were cases, when the car is over uneven road surface at any speed, the car is jumping up and down. One pro shop told me, raising the rear spring (decrease the drop) might help.
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