[Fundahl]

You still haven't answered why JB4 is funny to you....

Quit assuming things and tell me why you didn't like JB4. And are you manual?

There are two variables that greatly affected boost targeting for me, especially through the shift. They are both set by user.

You think JB4 is laughable, I think it's laughable that some of these people think Procede is so much safer, faster, more responsive when there is data suggesting otherwise. The Procede is cool, the attitude is not.

[Robert@vishnu]

At Vishnu, customer service and support is something I take pride in. If any of you have questions regarding our products or tech questions you can email us at sales@vishnutuning.com or give us a call directly at 925.415.9148 If you never contacted us before then its difficult to get support. I am sure many customers can vouch for my customer support and service I try to bring this market and to our products.

Regards,
Robert@Vishnu
Mon~Fri 8:30~4:30pm pst. Closed Weekends - Gone Testing

[RnmEvo9]

Originally Posted by bryce

so, what were the last maps you ran on the procede? summer of 2011? a lot has changed since then

In JB's defense, the same couldn't be said about their revised maps that everyone is enjoying?

[ianthegreat]

Originally Posted by skim7x

Interestingly, thus far only 1% of Cobb and 1% of JB users who voted have been vocal on this thread about their tune. Meanwhile, 19% of PROcede users have been vocal about their tune.

Does this say something about customer satisfaction?

Originally Posted by BFD99

Maybe there are just more Procede cheerleaders here? That what it seems to me. Procede Vs. JB4 seems like the old Coke vs. Pepsi debate to me. They both work well, and both do what the end user wants it seems?


JB4 + FBO + Meth here. I love it. Car trapped 116.4mph in the 1/4 without meth, so i know my car is making power.

Same here, great to hear someone trapping the same as I was. I was on the JB3 race map, 97oct, FMIC, and UR CAI and trapped 116.8. I did not have meth, downpipes, or anything else at the time. Now with the JB4 ... my car is making some serious power with great looking logs.

I'm sure all the available tunes are pretty good and would meet my expectations, but I've run a JB tune (JB, JB2, JB2HH, JB3, JB4) for over 50k miles now with absolutely zero problems. On top of that, each time Terry releases a new product, because I've purchased direct from him we get some great deals on upgrades - paying sometimes less than half the MSRP. That, plus the response time directly from Terry, just keeps me hooked...

[E3r2E9r]

Originally Posted by Fundahl

You still haven't answered why JB4 is funny to you....

Quit assuming things and tell me why you didn't like JB4. And are you manual?

There are two variables that greatly affected boost targeting for me, especially through the shift. They are both set by user.

You think JB4 is laughable, I think it's laughable that some of these people think Procede is so much safer, faster, more responsive when there is data suggesting otherwise. The Procede is cool, the attitude is not.

So riding the knock sensor is safer then actual ignition tuning....

[Randomaccess335]

Thought this was" a what tune do you have trend" Not a who's tune is better
I stated facts Terry has great customer service and I like his product therefor I'm happy..... I don't need to try another tune to prove I'm happy with my jb4.
Drink a beer and relax

[ianthegreat]

Originally Posted by E3r2E9r

So riding the knock sensor is safer then actual ignition tuning....

Some of you new guys like to bring up old wivestales, like they're something never discussed here before. If BMW's ECU couldn't keep up with the tuning, there would have been so many engine failures by now - it's comical you can even reference this anymore.

[bryce]

Originally Posted by Fundahl

You still haven't answered why JB4 is funny to you....

Quit assuming things and tell me why you didn't like JB4. And are you manual?

There are two variables that greatly affected boost targeting for me, especially through the shift. They are both set by user.

You think JB4 is laughable, I think it's laughable that some of these people think Procede is so much safer, faster, more responsive when there is data suggesting otherwise. The Procede is cool, the attitude is not.

yes, i drive a manual transmission. yes, i think jb4 is laughable. it's entire R&D process was reverse-engineering a procede. you've been here long enough to know the history

[shiv@vishnu]

Originally Posted by ianthegreat

Some of you new guys like to bring up old wivestales, like they're something never talked about before. If BMW's ECU couldn't keep up with the tuning, there would have been so many engine failures by now - it's comical you can even reference this anymore.

Do you think the single turbo car would work with no timing control? No, it would have popped an engine a long time ago. Running no timing control is unnecessary risk. While lower engine outputs reduce the risk involve to the point where many people choose to ignore it, the risks are still there. Make more power and the need for actual tuning comes into play. I will say that BMS has been lucky that the stock dme is very self protective, power levels have been kept pretty low an that the n54 is stout. But lets not mistake good luck for sound engine tuning.

[bryce]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Do you think the single turbo car would work with no timing control? No, it would have popped an engine a long time ago. Running no timing control is unnecessary risk. While lower engine outputs reduce the risk involve to the point where many people choose to ignore it, the risks are still there. Make more power and the need for actual tuning comes into play.

timing is actually crucial even on stock turbo's, IMHO. this is the only platform that i'm aware of where a "tuner" extracts over 100 whp more on a stock engine, while using the stock timing curve and the knock sensor as a failsafe.

just wait, jb5 will come out soon with CPS offsetting and terry can begin to play catch-up all over again with the latest vishnu developments

[bryce]

oh, and when jb5 comes out, terry will act like CPS offsetting is the best thing since sliced bread. anyone who monitors the forums knows how terry talked down about CPS offsetting for years.

[E3r2E9r]

Originally Posted by ianthegreat

Some of you new guys like to bring up old wivestales, like they're something never discussed here before. If BMW's ECU couldn't keep up with the tuning, there would have been so many engine failures by now - it's comical you can even reference this anymore.

I'm not new. Just on a new name. Talk to any real tuner and ask them if tuning with a knock sensor is the correct way of tuning, let alone the safest approach. They will tell you to tune ignition via MBT. Maximum brake torque. Where you increase ignition until you stop making power or knock. Then when you knock you pull usually 2 degrees for safety depending on the platform. If you want to have a real tuning discussion I'll be happy to dive deeper. Lets not talk about post count or join dates that is irrelevant to someones actual knowledge of tuning or the platform.

Feel free to humor us with your knowledge of ignition tuning based on your past experiences Mr. Veteran.

[ianthegreat]

Originally Posted by bryce

timing is actually crucial even on stock turbo's, IMHO. this is the only platform that i'm aware of where a "tuner" extracts over 100 whp more on a stock engine, while using the stock timing curve and the knock sensor as a failsafe.

irrelevant, it does and what about it?

Originally Posted by bryce

just wait, jb5 will come out soon with CPS offsetting and terry can begin to play catch-up all over again with the latest vishnu developments

Shiv has done the same on other JB addons, it's nothing new and adds to our overall base. G5 is already out.

[ianthegreat]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Do you think the single turbo car would work with no timing control? No, it would have popped an engine a long time ago.

Agreed

[shiv@vishnu]

Originally Posted by ianthegreat

Shiv has done the same on other JB addons, it's nothing new and adds to our overall base. G5 is already out.

Like what?

[bryce]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Like what?

lol times 2

[bryce]

Originally Posted by ianthegreat

irrelevant, it does and what about it?



Shiv has done the same on other JB addons, it's nothing new and adds to our overall base. G5 is already out.

correctly tuning a car involves manipluating air to fuel ratio, ignition timing, boost, etc.

how you correlate corretly tuning and burger tuning is beyond me.

[ianthegreat]

Originally Posted by bryce

how you correlate corretly tuning and burger tuning is beyond me.

Where did I correlate correctly tuning on any available piggyback?

[themyst]

Originally Posted by bryce

oh, and when jb5 comes out, terry will act like CPS offsetting is the best thing since sliced bread. anyone who monitors the forums knows how terry talked down about CPS offsetting for years.

FWIW, CPS has been available on the JB4 for over a year. The new board simply integrates it into the box.

[E3r2E9r]

Originally Posted by ianthegreat

irrelevant, it does and what about it?



Shiv has done the same on other JB addons, it's nothing new and adds to our overall base. G5 is already out.

With responses like these its obvious you have no idea what your talking about. Please sit back and let people that understand how engines and tuning work discuss and perhaps you can learn. Ask Cobb if they just tune their ignition until the knock sensors go bananas. LOL.

[Fundahl]

Originally Posted by bryce

timing is actually crucial even on stock turbo's, IMHO. this is the only platform that i'm aware of where a "tuner" extracts over 100 whp more on a stock engine, while using the stock timing curve and the knock sensor as a failsafe.

just wait, jb5 will come out soon with CPS offsetting and terry can begin to play catch-up all over again with the latest vishnu developments

The G5 board does have CPS offsetting, and especially in the 335is or 1M, there is no need to retard timing on stock turbos, unless you want the high boost, low timing, laggier feeling of the lower Cobb maps. (No offense to Cobb)

And no, you are not "riding the knock sensor". It's not my fault that people try to run stupid amounts of boost with small turbos and relatively high compression with high cylinder temps and just 91 octane.

I still have not seen a valid complaint or data to suggest that running a JB4 is laughable.

Shiv, your single turbo development is awesome, keep it up!

[bryce]

Originally Posted by E3r2E9r

With responses like these its obvious you have no idea what your talking about. Please sit back and let people that understand how engines and tuning work discuss and perhaps you can learn. Ask Cobb if they just tune their ignition until the knock sensors go bananas. LOL.

great point. cobb actually runs lower than optimal ignition timing, because their maps are "one size fits all."